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Author Topic: Smoke  (Read 22642 times)

ChairmanPoo

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #195 on: November 30, 2009, 03:04:19 am »

Statistics don't suck... when done properly.


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Life is unfair, get used to it? Don't make me laugh. That is a useless blank-check justification.
To be honest, I dont even get what the "life is unfair" comment is supposed to mean in the context.   ???
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Strife26

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #196 on: November 30, 2009, 03:07:11 am »

I believe that the underlying point is that everything is unfair, therefore stupidity by association is justified.
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Siquo

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #197 on: November 30, 2009, 04:18:41 am »

And, to get back on topic: kcwongs statement that all smokers are assholes, how does that compare to all Americans are cocks?

The camps are too much divided between smokers and non-smokers, while there is a lot of space in between where both smokers and non-smokers can coexist peacefully. I just resent both edges of the map, I really don't like smokers who smoke even though there are kids or people who are clearly bothered by the smoke around. On the other hand, I equally dislike the anti-smoker zealots who'd like to burn every smoker at the stake just because they smoke.
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This one thread is mine. MIIIIINE!!! And it will remain a happy, friendly, encouraging place, whether you lot like it or not. 
will rena,eme sique to sique sxds-- siquo if sucessufil
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G-Flex

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #198 on: November 30, 2009, 05:02:25 am »

Strife26 pretty much hit the nail on the head. Stereotypes might be true statistically, but for extremely diverse groups especially, they tend to fall apart and become useless when you're actually dealing with individuals and don't even really have any need to stereotype in the first place.

I would give Neruz more credit for the assumption since I kind of made myself seem like I AM an example of the stereotype, but now he's defending the stereotyping itself, which is kind of shameful.

Neruz, you need to realize that, like Strife said, there's hardly any such thing as an "average person" amongst such a diverse population. Even if 75% of people have trait A, 80% of people have trait C, 70% of people have trait D, (. . .), 80% of people have trait Z, that doesn't mean that there's necessarily a single damn person with all of them.

You've been talking to me on the forums. You know enough to judge me by my individual behavior, not useless assumptions based on which country I come from. I think I've made it pretty clear just from the fact that I belong to this forum and say the things I've said in the past that I'm not some kind of weird, paint-by-numbers typical ultra-conservative American (the kind who would be likely to act like an ethnocentric dick in the first place). I can understand you thinking I am one because of me accidentally ACTING like that way that one time, but please, don't assume that I am some way just because I belong to this stupidly large-and-diverse group called "Americans" when you have better information at hand.

Although, if you want to judge based on stereotypes, I can supply more specific ones than "American"!

Here are other stereotypes related to groups to which I belong, for your benefit of choice:
  • College student: Liberal, politically-correct, lazy, likes to eat instant noodles and drink a lot, highly disconnected from reality, PARTY WOOO
  • A 20-something: See above, except less "PARTY WOOO" and more "oh my god where is my life going"
  • A New Englander: Reserved, kind of bitter, votes Democratic and doesn't rhoticize vowels well.
  • A Rhode Islander: See above, except probably either Italian or eats at weird artsy pizza joints, and likes some kind of beverage myseteriously called an "Awful Awful".
  • Somebody who plays Dwarf Fortress: Introverted, probably likes Rube Goldberg devices, slightly antisocial and maladapted, probably fairly intelligent.
  • An Internet dweller: Introverted, just plain messed up, jaded and cynical.
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Neruz

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #199 on: November 30, 2009, 05:06:11 am »

I believe that the underlying point is that everything is unfair, therefore stupidity by association is justified.

No, the underlying point is that if life was 'fair' then that would mean that everyone had access to the same amount of stuff as everyone else, which would mean that everyone would be on dialup, or possibly have no internet connection at all, and finding food would be rather difficult indeed.

The fact that life is unfair is the entire reason why you are currently on this board able to post this, it's also the entire reason Homo Sapians exist as a species, since if life was fair then life would have never gotten past the basic algae stage.


Quote
Calling Bullshit now.

Statistics suck.
1) You find me an unbiased statistical survey, and I'll find proof that we're in the matrix.
2) Have you done statisic's work on this board? Cuz I will bet you the entire value of my estate that the makeup of American Bayers is a hell and a half lot different than anywhere else (actually, you can replace Bayers with anything you want, see 3)
3) America is a big place. Melting pot, sure, but there is so much differentiation between this place that your sterotype is useless. I've been chatting with random people on Mystery Google, and I've gotten people from California, Texas, and the East Coast. They all had very different opinions on stuff. Sterotyping America is like generalizing a pack of paint. If you combine them all, and then divide, you'll ALWAYS get brown. There may be one or two shades of brown, how do you extend that to everything else?
4) You fail to realize that people talk about things they are knowledgeable about. The "let's grab those three people off the street" survey is going to hit up people who would NEVER presume that they could talk knowledgeably about other countries.

5) The entire issue is really pointless. G-Flex made a comment that applies differently from his piece of America (BTW, smoking regulation is a city or state issue, so even talking about America fails) and Neruz got annoyed at it. End.

When did i say anything about unbiased statistical survey? All i said was that about 2 years ago i started tracking some numbers for ~3 months and asked the various Americans i know (some immigrants, some online, some here, some there) a few questions, as well as going back with them to the first time i met them and remembering what it was like, the questions they asked, the mistakes they made etc.

What i found was a statistically significant swing towards my American friends being more ignorant of the world outside of America than my European and Asian friends.


Is this an unbiased survey? I never said it was. Did i do a statistics work on this board? No, i wasn't here 2 years ago, i did do it on a couple of other boards though as i was interested in my peers rather than the average American.

The rest of your post appears to be completely irrelevant and probably copied and pasted from your standard response to people claiming 'survey' results or something. I claimed nothing of the sort. I merely stated that my personal experience as led me to conclude that Americans tend to forget that the rest of the world exists more often than people of other nationalities.


That's it, that's the long and the short of it. There's no secret message or underlying political motivation or special shiny racist overtones, it's just a statement made from my own personal experience, based on my own personal experience, by me, the person who experienced the experiences.



Strife and G-Flex need to get off their high horses and actually read my posts and respond to what i wrote, rather than making my posts up in their head and then responding to the stuff they made up.

Siquo

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #200 on: November 30, 2009, 05:30:00 am »

Strife and G-Flex need to get off their high horses and actually read my posts and respond to what i wrote, rather than making my posts up in their head and then responding to the stuff they made up.
Yeah, that happens a lot here. Still, even though your stereotypes are from personal experience, and even though they were never proven wrong, and even though stereotypes are generally quite handy as they allow abstractions and faster processing, you should NEVER EVER say to someone that they fit the stereotype, especially when it's a negative one. Keep the stereotypes to yourself, and you just might live a bit longer and not be called a racist.

Taking the extra bit of effort when in conversation with someone to set aside the stereotype and listen to what someone has to say (even though it perfectly matches the stereotype) is generally a trait that is helpful in life. Assume that you're always wrong about someone. Because really, you usually are (your personal experience may differ but that's just researcher-bias: you're wrong about someone but your mind won't allow you to acknowledge the fact). Try to have an open mind.


Even towards americans who, as everyone knows, are the most dim-witted ignorant cocks known to man. ;)
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This one thread is mine. MIIIIINE!!! And it will remain a happy, friendly, encouraging place, whether you lot like it or not. 
will rena,eme sique to sique sxds-- siquo if sucessufil
(cant spel siqou a. every speling looks wroing (hate this))

Neruz

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #201 on: November 30, 2009, 05:51:49 am »

I did listen to what G-Flex had to say, i then made an off-handed remark about stereotypes which was intended to be a joke and promptly blew up when G-Flex and Strife did the stereotypical (hur hur) response to someone making a stereotype remark and started ranting at me for crimes i did not commit.

I would suggest that the ones here who need to set aside the stereotype and listen to what someone has to say are in fact G-Flex and Strife, but the stereotype they're fitting at the moment (oh look, i did it again) leads me to expect exactly what i saw, so i'm not even remotely surprised.


Generally i get by with a simple approach to meeting new people; i expect them to be an idiot, i hope that they're intelligent. That way i get to feel nice and fuzzy inside if they turn out to not be an idiot, and i'm not surprised if the opposite occurs.

Mind you; some of my best friends are idiots. It's not really all that much of an insult. One of my best friends kicked a moltov cocktail because he wanted it to explode (it did), another one grabbed the fire extinguisher and promptly put the road out, despite the fact that the aforementioned friend was hopping around with his leg on fire.

Yeah, they're idiots, so what.

Siquo

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #202 on: November 30, 2009, 05:55:09 am »

The "Yeah, that happens a lot here." wasn't aimed at you, more of a shot in a general direction.

Your usage of stereotypes is common, but try to refrain from telling people about them. Coming up to a stranger telling him you expect him to be an idiot but you hope to be surprised might surprise you with a fist in the nose  :D
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This one thread is mine. MIIIIINE!!! And it will remain a happy, friendly, encouraging place, whether you lot like it or not. 
will rena,eme sique to sique sxds-- siquo if sucessufil
(cant spel siqou a. every speling looks wroing (hate this))

G-Flex

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #203 on: November 30, 2009, 05:57:30 am »

I did listen to what G-Flex had to say, i then made an off-handed remark about stereotypes which was intended to be a joke and promptly blew up when G-Flex and Strife did the stereotypical (hur hur) response to someone making a stereotype remark and started ranting at me for crimes i did not commit.

If it was a joke, I didn't know it was a joke, and your responses to the posts afterwards kind of made it seem like you were pretty serious.

Honestly, even if someone seems like they fit a stereotype, like I was saying, it's just better to judge them as individuals instead instead of assuming shit. I think that's been made clear though.


That being said, I probably overreacted, because I do that, and if I did, I apologize.
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ThreeToe

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #204 on: November 30, 2009, 06:17:45 am »

G-Flex, Neruz, please knock it off and get back on topic.
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Neruz

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #205 on: November 30, 2009, 06:25:44 am »

The "Yeah, that happens a lot here." wasn't aimed at you, more of a shot in a general direction.

Your usage of stereotypes is common, but try to refrain from telling people about them. Coming up to a stranger telling him you expect him to be an idiot but you hope to be surprised might surprise you with a fist in the nose  :D

Nah, wouldn't be surprised at all; why do you think i posted my expectations on the internets?

Tack

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #206 on: November 30, 2009, 07:09:45 am »

On a re-railing note: Ha, awkward moment dude?

On a de-railing re-railing note (keep with me here): I generally don't offer comment on whether someone smokes or doesnt. If they started out of peer-pressure, maybe they should quit out of peer-pressure, but I reckon that every smoker has already been hassled a shitload, so my personal asshole opinion is worth nothing but making their day slightly worse.


Oh, and Sofia - If you smoke, your boobs don't develop. Totally true fact I got from somewhere which I can't remember.


Seeing as the consequences of smoking are going to hit you at what, thirty, forty, which is when your life has pretty much burned through anyway, I wouldn't care about whether or not I smoked. Only reason I don't is because of your athleticism.. I don't want to lose... stamina.
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JoshuaFH

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #207 on: November 30, 2009, 07:13:01 am »

You aren't burned out at 40! I know some 70 year-olds that still live full lives and are fit enough to still kick my ass!

Just saying.
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Jude

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #208 on: November 30, 2009, 07:48:21 am »

I smoke once in a while. And I'm not going to take any of you guys' whining about your "right to breathe" seriously until you:

-stop driving a car
-stop buying mass-produced goods
-stop eating meat except local

...and that's just a start. Tobacco smoking is a drop in the ocean of air pollution. It is NOT the reason why air quality is shit or the cause of acid rain.
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JoshuaFH

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Re: Smoke
« Reply #209 on: November 30, 2009, 08:26:29 am »

Since when did Micro-scale air pollution become comparable to macro-scale air pollution?
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