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[Draco18s]

I am planning to create a different kind of MMO once I have a bit more experience programming: one with three ways of playing: as a king, noble or worker, as a hero, or as a dungeon master. The story would be created from the interactions between the three.

Oh, a little more info on what the dungeon master does?

Master of Monster Lair had a very interesting mechanic.  If ungodly grindy.  You built the dungeon and furnished it so that monsters would move in, then you'd go in and clear them out, steal their stuff, sell it for gold, and improve the dungeon.

[Azkanan]

I've actually played Icewind Dale II more often than any other Bioware games...

As for why DA:O sucked at story? Because we knew pretty much exactly what was going on through most of the game.

1 minute in: oh man, I can't wait to see what happens! I'm a <race> doing all sorts of crazy shit in <background location>!
20 minutes in: Sweet. I'm a friggin Grey Warden, that's kinda cool.
1 hour in: Ok, so, I gotta run around and tell people to give me their support to attack some huge army, alrighty then.
3 hours in: Why is it the same shit over and over... There's no story advancement for the next...19 hours?
22 hours in: Alrighty then. Everybody is on my side!! Time for an awesome EPIC battle! Yeah heah!
22 hours 15 minutes in: Is this it...? A handful of enemies charging at my group? No epic battles?
Boss Battle: Why does this thing take so many hits...? It makes no sense... Sure, it's big, but the actual kill is one cinematic blow... Why couldn't I have done this at the start of the godamned battle?!!?
24 hours in: Awesome! I can keep on playing! No, wait, what? I can't leave my camp unless I buy their shitty DLC? Gtfo.

[Neonivek]

I am having a REALLY hard time understanding why Dragon Age: Origins is liked

Objectively the game is mediocre

Subjectively this game is pretty bad

[Dakk]

Its bioware, c'mom. Just like NWN: It sucks at first because there's no mods or decent expansions, then it gets proguessively better till the players stop caring.

However, since DA:O has nothing inovative about it, the hype will die really fast and people will stop caring before feb 2010.

[GlyphGryph]

A note on Morrowind - It find this game extremely "lifeless and empty" much like people are accusing Dragon Age of being.

Mind you, a couple of mods fixed that mostly, but still. (Companion mod giving me the ability to actually hold conversations and become friendly with people (+sleep with them) I'm looking at you! Thanks!)

And Bioware made those crappy Icewind Dale games? Grrr. Those things annoyed maybe, but maybe I was just spoiled after the far more enjoyable Shadows of Amn.

[Maggarg - Eater of chicke]

Morrowind was a much better game than DA:O, in my opinion at least. The hundreds of hours of side quests were often quite fun, and the expansions made it even better. The game was actually better before Oblivion came out, as there was a vast database of mods, some of them almost professional in design.

[Shades]

Morrowind was a much better game than DA:O, in my opinion at least. The hundreds of hours of side quests were often quite fun, and the expansions made it even better. The game was actually better before Oblivion came out, as there was a vast database of mods, some of them almost professional in design.

Yer it's kinda sad how many games have, in some cases very simple, mods that improve the game no end.

[dragnar]

I am planning to create a different kind of MMO once I have a bit more experience programming: one with three ways of playing: as a king, noble or worker, as a hero, or as a dungeon master. The story would be created from the interactions between the three.

Oh, a little more info on what the dungeon master does?

Master of Monster Lair had a very interesting mechanic.  If ungodly grindy.  You built the dungeon and furnished it so that monsters would move in, then you'd go in and clear them out, steal their stuff, sell it for gold, and improve the dungeon.

I was thinking about getting that game...

Anyway, the dungeon master would be most easily described with a comparison to starcraft: The DM is to the king, what the zerg are to the protoss. The kings would hire heroes and weak NPC soldiers to fight off massive hordes of monsters created by the DM, and eventually invade their lair(if you could find it).

Basically, the king would play like a city building sim(and would include scripting for NPC merchants and things), the hero would be a traditional hack-and-slash game, and the DM would play like... a combination RTS and DF construction(traps, secret passages, guardians, if a DM loses their dungeon they have to start over, so it will be well guarded)

Morrowind was a much better game than DA:O, in my opinion at least. The hundreds of hours of side quests were often quite fun, and the expansions made it even better. The game was actually better before Oblivion came out, as there was a vast database of mods, some of them almost professional in design.

The only problem I had with morrowind was really my fault: I roleplayed a munchkin, which is only fun for so long after you become an invincible, spell-slinging, lock-picking, warrior.

[Xombie]

As for why DA:O sucked at story? Because we knew pretty much exactly what was going on through most of the game.
...

Almost all the games are like that. And movies too. Know what? Try books! Those little paper bastards will tell you all kind of stories.

[Shades]

Master of Monster Lair had a very interesting mechanic.

I was thinking about getting that game...

Apparently it's basically a dumbed-down DS version of the Dungeon Maker: Hunting Ground PSP game. Which is a shame to my mind. I've not played either but the concept interested me.

[Zironic]

I like DA:O, However do not discredit me. I see it's flaws. It's pretty linear and pretty boring in the respect of making extreme decisions to slight decisions. However I find the battling pretty exciting, which is what I bought the game for, to fight all sorts of big mean monstrosities with a tactical battle system (I'm finding the change difficult but exhilarating, adjusting my ideas of individuality of characters to a more turnbased strategy game. Though it'd be more effective I could use maybe 5 characters). I think the main problem is, Bioware is stuck between a rock and a hard design decision. If they make it so you can just do whatever you want, they have to plan the game around all the possible outcomes of your actions. If they make it more linear, they can plan the game around have you do some actions with possibly awesome results - always-. Like when I discovered you can use the ballistas to take out a row of archers in the first tower. However, Bioware is really pissing me off with this social interaction bullshit. Seriously, I have to work hard at that than most battles. I sit there for minutes reading questions and the answers and match them to the personalities of the characters and find I can't please everyone ever and most people ever or basically anyone. FFFFUUUU. We're fighting dragons not ethics!

[Timst]

Yeah, morrowind is a bit lifeless. It lacks motion, and real folks that do... you know, the kind of things townspeople do. Work, cultivate farms, build houses, eat and drink, carry crates around, or just idly chat. Some mods partially fixed that, but most of the time, every NPC is standing still or just going back and forth to simulate activity. Bars are colder than a burial ceremony, and the music ambiance mods doesn't cut it.

[platypus]

Gothic II struck an acceptable balance between freedom and direction. Almost the entire world was open to you at any point, which meant you'd face instant death if you veered to far at the start; but exploration was rewarding. I think it's a very underrated game, though it's quirky and has a couple of flaws.

Is there anyone here who've played through it? Gothic I was less polished, and the more recent Gothic III was well nigh broken upon release, though perhaps it's been fixed since.

[Draco18s]

Master of Monster Lair had a very interesting mechanic.

I was thinking about getting that game...

Apparently it's basically a dumbed-down DS version of the Dungeon Maker: Hunting Ground PSP game. Which is a shame to my mind. I've not played either but the concept interested me.

Really, all you need to do to have the full experience is steal the game and play for about 2-3 hours (beat the second dungeon level).  You may stop at any time prior to this, with all likely hood of coming to realize that while a lot of the concepts were good, the game is really really boring and not wanting to start back up again.

[Shoe]

Risen is supposed to be Gothic done right, though I haven't played it myself.