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[webadict]

Depends on how you're measuring decentness, and what the cut off is. Personally, I think 0.25 Metric Dakarians is good, but you seem to have gone with players barely reaching 0.01 Dakarians, which converts to about 8 Orgs +/- a Herpderp (The conversion is tricky.)

[Mephansteras]

It's tough to judge sometimes. And I'm probably a bit more lax about stuff than I ought to be. But I'd rather have a larger game with a few players that turn out to be mediocre than have a smaller game that shuts out people who might be fun to play with. This subforum tends to die if we don't have a decent influx of new people on a regular basis.

[JanusTwoface]

This subforum tends to die if we don't have a decent influx of new people on a regular basis.

IMO, it's been happening for a while...

Doesn't help when people shut down newer players with different playstyles from their own.

[Vector]

Yeah.  I think it's reasonable to ask someone to play a BM or two for some games and have an excellent track record for some others (like, say, Third Party), and it's reasonably to exclude the folks who are really skilled from the BMs.

It's kind of ridiculous to say "you must be this amount of excellent to play any game here, period."



Also, I still want a cool game with interesting flavor and innovation.  Our current meal set is vanilla, BYOR, and paranormal/supernatural + vengeful and BMs, and that seems like we're just sitting in the "well, let's do the same old thing" camp.

And for everyone who is going to go "then YOU run something," well, I'm planning on doing that over the summer, when my life won't be a million kinds of insane.

[Toaster]

I'm planning to keep Kingmaker around until people get sick of it.  Also, I'm usually fine with most anyone in my games for the most part- I try to fit games in the "Intermediate" slot.


Speaking of my games, Kingmaker 4 is on its last day and I'm down to two games, so that means it's time to put Roguelike Mafia in the queue and get opinions on when I should open it for signups.  Minimum players is 9 and maximum is 13.  Skillwise, I don't want it to be anyone's first game, but due to the randomness of the night game (and therefore stronger focus on day), I'm ranking it intermediate.  A BM or two is sufficient experience for me to let you in.

[Mephansteras]

Should be fine to put it into sign-ups soon. Not much else starting right now, and it's good to have something for people to do after they die in the other games.

[Toaster]

About as fast as I thought it'd be, Kingmaker 4 is over.

How is interest in Kingmaker 5?   Also see the end of the KM4 thread for gametype discussion.

[Mephansteras]

We're now down to just 3 games running, plus WWYDT whenever it actually starts.

So, sure, stuff can go into signups whenever, I think.

[IronyOwl]

Beginner's Vengeful Mafia.
Thoughts?

I've been thinking about this for a bit, and with the recent VM6 going on, I'm feeling the adrenaline that the newbies should be feeling. IronyOwl, if you want to host this, this is your last chance to call it.  Otherwise...

... I'm almost ready to say I'll host BVM1: Beginner's Vengeful Mafia 1.

It'd probably take me a bit to get set up, and since you're obviously jonesing for it right now, I say go for it. Absolute worst case I'll run BVM 2 concurrently, or something.

I do think the entry/exit stuff is getting a bit elitist, but I would agree that you really can't screw around in a VM because it's lylo at all times. Attaching too much importance to it isn't good, but doing your best is pretty much mandatory unless you're already a decent player.

We want to make sure they understand this is quick but intense, but we don't want to drive them off or make them overly nervous.

[Mr.Person]

I think this is leaning dangerously elitist.

And now I feel bad. Rightfully so, too. I accept mods wanting to bar beginners from really complex stuff, but remember that a lot of players here started without a BM to jump into. It's very much possible to dive right into, say, Paranormal.

Roguelike Mafia at Intermediate sounds fine. The only real confusing stuff is artifacts, which are rare enough that as a mod you can walk players through using it if they get confused.

[Akhier the Dragon hearted]

   If you have mods saying no to inexperienced players
then make sure there is an alternate suggested. I would
have just left after trying to join paranormal 18 and being
advised to try something easier if I had not been directed
towards beginner's XX at the same time. Telling someone
that they can not play till they are better but having no
where for them to get better is just kind of rude. Also I
would side on the letting them play because this is the
forum for Dwarf Fortress, the game with a difficulty curve
like a cliff with an overhang.

[JanusTwoface]

Anyone can join any game I run. If they're new, so be it. I don't mind answering general questions if they come up. New blood makes games more interesting. Just make sure you understand the posted rules and don't be afraid to ask for clarification and you're golden. (Heck, my first game was replacing into a Paranormal game... it's doable).

I've had more problems with more "experienced" players in general than with newer players, but that might just be my experience...

Side note: Akheir, why do you format your posts like that? They're still fine to read, but it jumps out a bit when scanning the page. Sort of like the 2-3 people I've noticed recently that are posting in Comic Sans...

[Vector]

On the other hand, DF isn't a collective undertaking that you play with other people, and it pretty much suggests that one should attempt to come up with new and crazy ways to lose.

Mafia isn't a game like that.


That said, we only have 3 games running right now.  That's kind of absurd... we have a lot of people who want to run games, too, but we haven't been letting them.  A lot of them have even played a few games.

Being a bad player doesn't mean you'll be a bad mod.  Hell, swap inexperienced there and you'll get the same thing.

I strongly suggest that we start trying to encourage the new blood more, because if we continue to act as insular as we have been, we're going to run out of new people to have fun with and it will be boring.

Remember, there have been lots of more-advanced games with newbies that were loads of fun.  Many of them even wound up in the Notable Games list.  Some of them even (*gasp*) included ExKirby, or other people who were playing to lose.  I think we're getting too paranoid about our games.  Excluding newbies on really small games kind of makes sense, but for bigger ones... well, as long as half the players aren't new, why not?

Is it about fun, or isn't it?


Also, Webby, if you run Color Mafia again I'll in.

[Toaster]

Right, I'll put Roguelike Mafia up in the morning with the caveat to brand new players that I suggest they play a different game first, but I'll take them if they ask nicely.

[webadict]

Also, Webby, if you run Color Mafia again I'll in.

Muahaha. I'll need to finish either BYOR or BM first.

Maybe I'll think of the setup during that time. This school thing seems to have long stretches of sitting around not doing homework time.