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Author Topic: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!  (Read 144667 times)

TolyK

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1095 on: September 22, 2012, 11:13:43 am »

I win when voted for a prime number of times when I die/the game ends.
:P
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Mephansteras

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1096 on: October 04, 2012, 07:34:25 pm »

Wanted to get some Opinions on my next game.

It's going to be a Bang! style game rather than a Mafia game, although the two are related game types.

In Bang! you have a Sheriff who is known to everyone. Roughly half the remaining players want him alive and the other half want him dead.

The tricky part is that no one knows anyone else's alignment.

Rather than lynches, each player has a certain amount of hit points. Players Attack and Defend one another, trying to eliminate the competition while not hitting their own people.

Since Attacking the Sheriff is a way to mark yourself as obviously against him (And thus an obvious target for everyone to shoot), people tend to wait until they think they have an upper hand before targeting him.

The actual game of Bang! is done with a deck of cards and has lots of randomness and special abilities. I'll try to keep that flavor a bit while making it doable for a forum game.

So, on to my variant:

The Battle of Iron Hill

The Players are the Prince and his Bodyguards in the middle of a gigantic battle. A heavy fog has obscured the area and turned everything into chaos.

With no one able to see what's going on with the Prince, some of his Bodyguard have turned against him. They are secretly Traitors working for another Kingdom and are under orders to slay the Prince for a very hefty sum of money!

Much of the Bodyguard is still Loyal, of course, and fight to protect him. But they have no way of knowing which of the others accepted this foul bargain and which rejected it.

There may also be an opportunistic Blood Relative of the Prince there who sees his death as a chance to move up in the order of succession. But he'll have to be the last one standing in order to reap the rewards, as the Traitors will kill him if the Prince falls and the Loyal Guards will kill him if he Turns on the Prince. And if the Prince lives with him appearing loyal, well, he's still lost since he's no better off.

Mechanics:

Each player gets Two Actions each turn: An Attack and a Defend. Once all players have used all of their actions or Passed, a new Turn starts.

Attacks attempt to deal 1 point of Damage to another player
Defends prevent 1 point of Damage to any player (Including the Player using the Defend)

This basic combat mechanic should make it so that the Traitors need to kill off a few of the Loyal Guards before they can actually target the Prince himself, since otherwise they'll all just block those shots.

Since we deal with different time zones, actions are going to be resolved on an order basis of the Player's actions, rather than time. So if you have not used either of your actions and want to block a shot that someone declared, you have to declare your block before you declare your attack.

Obviously, if someone else has blocked that attack before you post yours it's not necessary.

This is to prevent everyone from declaring their attacks and then deciding on blocks after the fact.


Possible special Roles/Sub Roles

Swordsman - May Attack Twice instead of Defending

Shieldman - May Defend Twice instead of Attacking

Crossbowman - May make an Unbockable Attack, but may not Defend that Turn

Stalwart - Has an Additional Hit Point

Blademaster - May make Two Attacks, Two Defends, or One of Each. Has -1 Hit Points


These are just my rough thoughts on the game. I'm still working on the math and simulated games, so there is lots of room for stuff to change. But I *think* this layout is workable.


Thoughts?
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Hapah

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1097 on: October 04, 2012, 11:58:17 pm »

Hmmm. I'd wait a bit to host it, in any case: there are 3 good looking games are running at the moment!

Regarding balance: What would approx. team ratios be? Scum crossbowman worry me a bit, if they're close to even. His attack on the Prince can't be blocked, no heals...even if town focus fire the crossbowman, it looks like he's liable to take a fair chunk of the Prince down with him if the numbers are about equal.
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Mephansteras

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1098 on: October 05, 2012, 01:04:50 am »

It's roughly half scum and half town. Of course, as normal for me, I'd have everything weighted so that the scum attack roles are more expensive and the town defensive roles are more expensive. The actual ratios of the different roles would be random with the possibility of quite a few 'normal' guards.

And, yeah, not looking to start anything at the moment. Just prepping my next game.
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Dariush

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1099 on: October 05, 2012, 04:01:46 am »

MrCelt

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1100 on: October 27, 2012, 02:55:52 pm »

Lore: The mafia have taken over a once peaceful town, and the past where the sheriffs and detectives once ruled is over, replaced by tyrants.

Vigilantes have a night meeting where they talk together - eventually shooting one person. - Vigilante group would consist of:

Detective - Finds out the person's role
Priest - Can't kill, or assist in killing, but converts mafia roles into village equivalent.
Jailer - Jails person, blocking their night action, stopping them being killed. can also choose to kill them.

And, The Mafia sided group'd consist of:(With (THIS) being it when converted by priest)

Hooker (Doctor) - Blocks night action of those visited & Prevents from death/conversion.
Corrupt Cop (Detective) - Follows person through the night and sees alignment
Interrogator (Jailer) - Jails person, blocking their night action, stopping them being killed. can also choose to kill them.
Shrink (Priest) - Prevents person from conversion, can decide to self-shrink.

et cetera

Opinions? - Town wins only when all mafia are killed,  mafia wins only when all town are killed
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TolyK

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1101 on: October 27, 2012, 03:54:31 pm »

Wait. Who are you?
It seems like something interesting, yet unbalanced and such. :P
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Shakerag: Who are you personally suspicious of?
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zombie urist

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1102 on: October 27, 2012, 03:58:14 pm »

The vig-masons are really OP.
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Leafsnail

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1103 on: October 27, 2012, 04:13:28 pm »

Do the mafia know who each other are?  If so you can never, ever, ever let them be converted to the town side.
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TolyK

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1104 on: October 27, 2012, 04:20:32 pm »

I've had a setup similar to this in real life (where roles - including wincons - can be switched around) and it only seems to work if you have house rules of "you can't say or even hint about your alignment or anyone else's". It works fine in verbal games, probably no so much in post-based games.
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My Mafia Stats
just do whatevery tolyK and blame it as a bastard mod
Shakerag: Who are you personally suspicious of?
At this point?  TolyK.

Leafsnail

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1105 on: November 28, 2012, 10:22:41 pm »

We get interest in running a mountainous setup every now and again.  However, we almost invariably take that to mean "7 town, 2 mafia members".  There are two problems with this.

1. 7 town 2 mafia members mountainous is heavily scumsided.  Current data seems to indicate that 11 town 2 mafia members is closer to balanced (but it's also horrifyingly boring I mean goddamn).
2. The fact that you want a setup which is based on the daygame doesn't mean the game has to have no interesting mechanics.

So I propose we diversify into more interesting open setups.  One which has caught my eye is Masons and Mafia.

The setup:
13 players, no nights.
4 mafia members (are informed who each other are but have no chat, this is important)
4 masons (again, no chat)
5 townies

Mafia members win if they make up at least half of the players in the game.
Townies win if all mafia members are dead.

The mafia can't kill at night because there's no night, but instead they have another ability.  At any time any mafia member can send in a daykill action against a town player.  If that player is a mason, they are killed.  However, if that player is a townie then the mafia member dies instead.

The advantages of this setup:
- Still based on identifying scummy behaviour and lynching correctly using the daygame
- No nights means that activity doesn't drain away after a long one
- Things can actually happen in the day sometimes which is nice
- Each role has something interesting to be doing
- Good town players aren't doomed to die in the night early

How about it?
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Toaster

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1106 on: November 28, 2012, 10:34:35 pm »

Interesting.  Everyone will be looking for team-oriented behavior, but for different reasons.  Vanilla townies will have the difficult job of trying to discern the true intent of team-oriented behavior- are they just looking for any lynch or are they trying to find scum?  Mafiosos will try to see who is shielding someone else- potentially, both the shielder and shieldee are potential targets.   Masons will want to try to steer lynches away from fellow masons without anyone realizing they're doing it.  Mass claims are a bad, bad idea.

Couple questions- is the mafia daykill one per day per player, or can a successful killer try again that same day?  Hammer, semi-hammer, or deadline?  Much as it was in Prince's Guard, the time is much less important with no night.


As an aside, this game could be run with no moderation other than role randomization and PM distribution, much like Vengeful.
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Leafsnail

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1107 on: November 28, 2012, 10:55:48 pm »

A mafia member may send in multiple daykills per day providing their first one was successful.  Otherwise you could get situations where the masons can claim safely which isn't intended.

Usually in nightless setups no-lynch isn't an option, and a tie in the votes results in something bad happening (like a mafia member being allowed to privately break the tie).  This would be to stop the town stalling indefinitely.  I'd prefer to run this game on semi-hammers with a fairly generous deadline (a week maybe) to see how it works out.

You could run it without moderation, but then there'd be an issue of masons knowing who killed them.  Could cause some problems...
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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1108 on: November 28, 2012, 11:55:10 pm »

If you make days a week, I see no reason to allow extensions.
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Dariush

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Re: [DISCUSSION] Mafia Gametypes: Hash 'em out here!
« Reply #1109 on: November 29, 2012, 09:13:07 am »

I'm too lazy to think about the details, but there is no outstanding bullshit, so I'm all for it. Pre-in. If it crashes and burns, so be it.
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