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[Vector]

...to try again, without that concept, I'm saying that Vector doesn't/cannot know what I meant when I said "Nobody's asking." That he is is putting words in my mouth.

I read that thing three or four times trying to figure out what you were talking about.  Looked at all your recent questions, etc., etc.  Do I really have to explicitly write out the thought process that informed me you were talking about your paper-question-thinger?

The reason why I ask, rather than just doing it, is that it is a royal pain to translate out of Vectorese and into the semi-comprehensible English slodge I normally speak/write in.  It's even more of a pain to translate from slodge to Good English, especially when it comes to intricate thought processes.

And yes, before you look it up... slodge is a neologism.  It means what it sounds like, and no, "sludge" would not do.  I speak slodge, not sludge.


Bleh.  Well, anyway.  I'm too tired, now, but if you want me to do a write-up I'll take care of it in the morning.

[Vector]

Bleh.

So, I rethought, and realized that I exploded over what would have otherwise been a fairly innocuous statement.  My apologies.

Spoiler: Reasons, for those who want them (click to show/hide)

I used to know a young lady who, whenever she wanted attention (and this was constantly) used similar sentence construction to inform me that I was supposed to come dragging her Deep Dark Problems out of her and listen to her cry for perhaps 8-10 hours straight about the unfairness of life.  I am not exaggerating, by the way.  I spent about eight and a half years sitting on my explosive temper in an attempt to remain "friends" with this individual.  Unfortunately, a long time spent trying not to blow up at her has resulted in present anger at people who do not deserve it.

So, I'm just not going to touch on that bit of your statements, because I'm too emotionally tied up in that sort of crapola to reason well about it.  Someone else can look at what we've said and decide.

I think there are some other things you've said that were genuinely scummy, however.  I don't have the time to look them up right now, but soon-ish I'll go trawl through and try to find out which of my opinions are emotional and which are logical.

[Cheeetar]

Cobalt, you were on about 20 minutes ago, yet you decided not to answer my questions. I still have no clue what you are talking about with you saying 'Nobody's asking' and Vector replying to it, or how it related to my post.

[CobaltKobold]

...if you don't know, then you don't know the contents of your own last argument against me, since you're taking it from Vector...which IS pretty scummy

Nobody's asking.

What, about your term paper that isn't a term paper?

Nobody's asking.

Nobody was asking about my "How to play mafia" is what I was saying, I think.

This is the contradiction that Vector is claiming exists. but is really just him asserting I mean one thing and I thinking I meant something else.

[CobaltKobold]

Cobalt, you were on about 20 minutes ago, yet you decided not to answer my questions.

I am not here primarily for mafia. it is the weekend.

[Cheeetar]

...if you don't know, then you don't know the contents of your own last argument against me, since you're taking it from Vector...which IS pretty scummy

Nobody's asking.

What, about your term paper that isn't a term paper?

Nobody's asking.

Nobody was asking about my "How to play mafia" is what I was saying, I think.

This is the contradiction that Vector is claiming exists. but is really just him asserting I mean one thing and I thinking I meant something else.

I find the quotes have nothing to do with anything I was talking about. He was referring to you not remembering/saying elsewise to what you said earlier, and calling it inconsistent. You said it should be excused because you were tired. You then said he was being inconsistent when he said he didn't want to hurt your feelings. But, through all these mangled quotes and bullshit, I'm not even going to try finding out what he was originally quoting. Consider that point proven false or something.

I still don't see the hypocrisy, and I don't like you saying confusion is a scum tell. Right now, I am a bit confused because most of the things people are saying seem to have no connection between what they are quoting, and people bringing up all this unrelated shit.

[Mr.Person]

I agree with Cheeetar here, I'm incredibly confused. I'm going to have to read over what happened again, probably more than once, just to figure out what's going on. Then I'll have to reread AGAIN to figure out who's scum. Not really complaining, I'm just saying, you guys need to make more sense

[Mephansteras]

Meph and CobaltKobold voted SirBayer in quick succession.  That makes me suspicious.

META:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Also, Day 1 of Not-So Beginner Mafia 2.  Dirtybird was getting lynched for being "scummy" and HE WAS THE DOCTOR.  I didn't fall for it of course!  Then quickly died Night 1.

As far as I can tell, we all voted for him as soon as he claimed a different role then the one he claimed the day before. He put up a giant sign saying "I'm a lying scumbag!", so why is it suspicious that we suddenly voted for him?

[ToonyMan]

'Cause he's the easiest target in the world,

1.  He's town being SirBayer like always.
2.  He's scum and scum(you) are voting him to stiffen discussion.  He could be doing this as a scum tactic(possibly).

[ToonyMan]

Scumlist:
dakarian
Meph
CobaltKobold

This is my thoughts right now.  Also, almost 100 pages!  :-D

[Vector]

I feel at least somewhat responsible for the crazy confusion that's flying around right now, so I'll summarize/translate.  Sorry for the length, folks:

Spoiler: A detailed summary/accusation.  Has links to the relevant posts. (click to show/hide)

1. CK posts his suspicions, replete with WIFOM about the doctor not being dead.
2. Bayer and Webadict pick up on WIFOM and cautiousness, citing BMIV (a game in which CK took part).
3. CK doesn't remember BMIV, so Vector jumps on him for what seems to be a contradictory change in behavior/beliefs about what is scummy and what is not.
4. CK brings up using short-term memory for Mafia and says something about "Nobody's asking."
5. Vector jumps on him again, this time because he thinks that CK is trying for an emotional appeal.
6. CK seems to have forgotten what he was thinking about a couple of seconds ago, thus inducing ambiguity and WIFOM.  He then brings up one of Vector's statements from a currently-running game and states that Vector's apology for exploding is an emotional appeal, itself.
7. Vector continues to press the "emotional ploy" interpretation of CK's statements, while stating that the apology was an attempt to keep from any sort of RL emotional irritation.
8. CK says he was inconsistent because of a headache.  He also states that Vector's confusion about Vector's apology being considered an emotional ploy is scummy.  Further, Vector is a hypocrite for complaining about CK's glossing over his statement (the one about "no one asked").
9. Cheeetar votes for CK, since CK's arguments seem incomprehensible to him.
10. Dakarian points out that SirBayer's being the doctor was not revealed until today, so it is not a scumtell.
11. Now it seems that CK can remember the events and arguments of BMIV just fine... compare to statement 3 of this list.
12. Meph shows that SirBayer had claimed doctor D2, so Dakarian switches onto Bayer for reasons of fakeclaim + still being alive + scumminess.
13. ToonyMan seems to think that everyone voting Bayer is scum or stupid town.
14. Cheetar continues the attack on CK for inconsistency.
15. CK and Cheeetar argue about the meaning of a "hidden referent" and whether or not Vector could possibly know what he was talking about.
16. Vector issues a weird and whiny apology and backs off on the emotional-appeal argument.

So, my real allegations against CK:

1. WIFOM spreading and cautiousness.
2. Inconsistency about the way he fundamentally thinks about Mafia in two weeks' time.
3. Flimsy reasoning in a person who is known for his well-composed arguments.
4. Doesn't actually write out arguments; just puts up lines of quotes/random accusatory statements and expects us to interpret them for him.  Looks like scum trying to spread confusion.
5. Emotional ploys (not the one I thought I saw--the ones about headaches and short-term memory and all that)
6. Contradictions (First he can't remember BMIV, now he can, etc.)

Unvote.

CobaltKobold.


@Cheeetar: if you're still at all interested in what I was originally quoting, my statements were about CK's general attitude in BMIV, D4.  He was one of the main proponents of the "people aren't scummy by virtue of their being alive later in the game" theory, which he conveniently forgets about when Bayer brings it up.  Then later he finds precisely the quote he wants from BMIV, a game that he had theoretically completely forgotten.

[Org]

That is good reasons. Oh God I dont want to read what I missed.

...

PANDAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

[Pandarsenic]

I'M HERE

WHAT'S GOING ON

DID SOMEONE HAMMER?

[Org]

I'M HERE

WHAT'S GOING ON

DID SOMEONE HAMMER?

100 PAGES

WHHHHHHYYYYYYYYYYYYY

[Vector]

I'M HERE

WHAT'S GOING ON

DID SOMEONE HAMMER?

No hammer.  Just a couple of vote changes.