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Author Topic: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time  (Read 74714 times)

Smitehappy

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #285 on: March 03, 2010, 11:00:50 pm »

I always made it my goal in any of my campaigns to completely wipe the Papal States off the map. I know that the Pope will just take residence in a new country but it's eradication always brought me immense satisfaction. That and assassinating the new Pope on the same turn he was elected.
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Cthulhu

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #286 on: March 03, 2010, 11:09:25 pm »

Well, things are starting to look up now.  I'm cool with Spain, France, and Denmark now.  Spain demanded my vassalage, I gave him a withering look and he wet his pants, declaring unconditional ceasefire.  Probably all those guys I executed.  France was tired of using me to cull his population, and Denmark and I never really fought all that much, he just dicked around with my economy.

Also, as I'm way down on my butchering quota the Pope has been seeing me in a slightly better light.  She might even let me back in the secret club soon.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2010, 11:13:36 pm by Cthulhu »
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Heron TSG

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #287 on: March 03, 2010, 11:42:49 pm »

In my recent Scotland campaign I made it a goal to wipe Christianity off the face of the Earth. I went to war with every christian nation I bordered, assassinated every priest, and creating a HUNDRED of my own to spread the (in my mind) new religion of Scotland, Paganism.

The pope and every cardinal is Scottish. Only Venice and Hungary remain, but the Pope doesn't care if I finish the curb-stomp I started.
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Neruz

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #288 on: March 04, 2010, 12:47:21 am »

Aqizzar; the trade upgrades like roads and docks should affect tax incomes; the money you make from trade is actually the trade taxes.

I'm pretty sure it gives a breakdown in the detailed city view.


Also remember that trade upgrades in castles do next to nothing, they need to be towns\cities, not castles, if you want to get any decent trade money out of them.

Cthulhu

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #289 on: March 04, 2010, 02:21:51 pm »

AAARGH

I hate when they don't charge.  Sometimes instead of charging they just saunter up with their lances pointed up and start meleeing.

It's an open field, they had plenty of intervening space, why are they retarded?
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umiman

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #290 on: March 04, 2010, 02:27:08 pm »

AAARGH

I hate when they don't charge.  Sometimes instead of charging they just saunter up with their lances pointed up and start meleeing.

It's an open field, they had plenty of intervening space, why are they retarded?
I think the key is alt-click to force lances.

Don't remember but it's in the controls. Check it out.

edit: I haven't actually seen them with that problem in any of the latest patches. Are you sure you're using the most up-to-date game?

Akigagak

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #291 on: March 04, 2010, 02:48:24 pm »

Anyone else use mercenaries as sponges?

I line them up in front of my own troops and let them absorb the charge, then pile in with the men I actually trust/value. Works great, especially with spearmen, and if you don't mind losing them.
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umiman

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #292 on: March 04, 2010, 03:13:40 pm »

Anyone else use mercenaries as sponges?

I line them up in front of my own troops and let them absorb the charge, then pile in with the men I actually trust/value. Works great, especially with spearmen, and if you don't mind losing them.
But the mercenary units are all stronger than your own units. You only get stronger units in the very late game. The mercenaries, other than those generated by crusades and jihads, are all supposed to be expensive elite units.

Seems really inefficient to use something that costs so much as cannon fodder.

Akigagak

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #293 on: March 04, 2010, 03:17:55 pm »

No, I mean hiring the cheapest possible, during the mid-game, to make sure the units that cost loads to retrain because of equipment levels, or they're veterans, or there's ony two places in the world they can be recruited, and both of those are on the other side of the map, don't get nailed by the full force of a cavalry charge. Mostly used during Crusades, when you can get 1000s of troops really cheaply.
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Jreengus

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #294 on: March 04, 2010, 03:21:19 pm »

They're meant to be better? Most of them seem to be really expensive mediocre units outclassed as soon as you build your fortress and far more pricey than their castle level equivalents to me. I generally use them for the high casualty jobs to save my actual troops that I might need later and rarely keep them for more than a turn, it's a case of buy use disband all in one turn if possible. The exception being troop types I wouldn't normally have access to such as horse archers.
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Ampersand

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #295 on: March 04, 2010, 03:44:28 pm »

I think here I shall recount the most epic victory I've ever managed to experience on my own. I was playing the game with no battle time limits, to make turtling an invalid strategy against siege attacks. Unit size of huge because I'm awesome like that. It was the first early years in Rome: Total War, and I was playing as Carthage. If you played the game, you know Sicily starts out divided between the Greeks, Romans, and Carthaginians, and usually the Greeks and Romans both end up attempting to take the Carthaginian city before attacking eachother because Carthage doesn't have much of a military in the one city on the island, and their starting units are comparatively weak.

I knew I needed to be aggressive to hold the city, so when the Greeks attempted to attack me, I already had a sizable army to pit against their city on the island. Unfortunately, due to line of sight issues, I didn't see that they had an army consisting primarily of hoplites, as opposed to mine consisting primarily of very light calvary and some infantry, that just happened to be five times as large as my army on the island.

But they weren't attacking my army, they were attacking the city. I knew attacking with the army with my own army would be suicidal. but it would take time for them to siege the city. I could try to siege the city and take it before they do, and build up a little more from the other side before attacking.

Cue the Romans, who also hate me. They sick their army onto mine, and almost completely obliterate it, as it consists of heavy infantry and spear men primarily,

So I have a few reserves back at the city. The infantry I have are only good because they're particularly fast and vicious and can frighten and chase down enemies, but are nearly useless in a fair fight. The calvary I have are only useful because they're somewhat faster than most others, a bit more punch to them I think, at the expense of durability.

I only have a couple units. Three calvary units totaling to 360, plus a commander, and five infantry units coming out to 800 men. They had a full army. Twenty units, all of them Militia Hoplites. Militia units are twice as large as professional units... So their army came out to being six thousand four hundred

I forgot I didn't have a battle time limit. I attacked in the hopes that a victory would make them back down, since they didn't have siege equipment. Instead, I spend about fifteen minutes staring in horror as a wall of spears that stretches from one end of the map to the other steadily marches closer to my walls, waiting for me to try to attack them. It would be stupid, obviously, to attack them. There's no way to get around to their sides, since they're shoulder to shoulder from one end of the map to the other.

Using infantry is out of the question. I know the stats, and in a hand to hand combat, my infantry just manage to be slightly better than militia hoplites, and a frontal charge with light calvary  into a wall of spears is stupid. But not as stupid as I initially thought. Unwilling to surrender, I concocted a strategy too awesome to fail. After all, it is not necessary to kill every unit in the map to win, one only needs have the only units left on the map. An enemy running away is as good as dead.

So, calmly, I walk one of my calvary units out of the gates, and just let it sit there on the other side, Naturally, a group of about five hundred hoplites start approaching. At first I think it won't work, but then I see they're all marching in Phalanx position. and closing in directly on the unit. I march it slowly to the left, and the hoplites start curling around to face it. Perfect.

I bring out a second unit of light infantry, and have them charge into the Phalanx line from behind, while the other calvary unit runs some distance away from the hoplites. As the greeks reorient themselves and attempt to bring their spears against the Calvary behind them, that unit quickly disengages, and immediately retreats to the right. The rear of the phalanx line exposed to the calvary unit to the left, I order it to charge in. The process repeats itself more than I care to remember. A lot, to little effect. But eventually, it wears their numbers down, and whatever's left of the five hundred sounds a retreat. The calvary chase them and mow them over easily. They're exhausted from marching in phalanx, and the constant pounding they took from the calvary.

The greeks send more men out from their line of six thousand, and I repeat the process. The greeks, already deeply shaken by the first retreat, put up less of a resistance, and sound the retreat much earlier. I chase them down, towards the enemy line. This causes a chain reaction, where the men they run pass also start retreating. I Mow them down, and their neighbors retreat, like a wave of fear propagating out from the middle of the line, my calvary surfing on it. It's a wholesale slaughter as the greeks are chased off the east and west edges of the map. 240 horsemen versus 6400 men with ten foot long spears. The horsemen win. The rest of my army never even moved.

I don't think I breathed the entire battle.
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Jackrabbit

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #296 on: March 04, 2010, 03:46:47 pm »

Depends on the mercenary. If they're powerful enough, shock absorption is delegated to my spearmen. Other times? I remember in Rome the only reason I ever hired barbarian mercenaries is because they were like big squishy speed bumps. Same with pilgrims, actually.
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Neruz

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #297 on: March 04, 2010, 07:46:40 pm »

Mercs vary wildly. Some Mercs are just pathetic, others are so awesome there is a very real chance one will reach out of the screen and smack you.

Cthulhu

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #298 on: March 04, 2010, 07:50:47 pm »

My gallowglasses have served me pretty well as support for my main army, but I usually don't bother with other merc units.
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Aqizzar

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Re: Medieval II, Total War in general, discussion time
« Reply #299 on: March 04, 2010, 09:07:13 pm »

Bulgarian Brigands are awesome archers, the equal of any mid-tier standing archers, and they can hold their own in melee long enough for someone to come by and save them.

The other Balkan mercenaries may appear roundly useless except as speedbumps, but they're actually identical to Hungary's basic units.  Which obviously are pretty crap, yet I love them so.  I find their plucky, fatalistic determination endearing.

In Europe proper, it sucks that the only mercenaries available are Crossbowmen and Spearmen.  The Spearmen are actually a little better than Armored Sergeants, with more armor, and are reasonably priced for it.  I usually have one or two of them hanging around to shore up the middle of an infantry line.

In non-mercenary news, I've found a new love for a wacky special unit - the Sirocco Standard, the Italian inspiration for the Screaming Bell, and about as fun to watch.
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