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Author Topic: Toon Mafia V - Day 5 - GAMEOVER  (Read 59242 times)

webadict

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #315 on: November 02, 2009, 10:12:06 pm »

@Web

I was thinking of your quote actually when I wrote it.  It's true, though: I haven't seen an OMGUS actually catch scum yet.  Closest I've seen is in BM2 when Pandar(scum) was randomvoted and Diakron(scum) voted back to attack. 


As for the cop matter.. I wasn't thinking townie (vector IIRC brought that up, and it makes sense now).  I WAS thinking Dephy though and, honestly, I'm still pondering if the cops all have various sanities. 

It wasn't so much the Arch death that made me target you: I did believe you when you said you had no other targets.  You were inspected because, frankly, you're Webadict who's reputation has ended up with a game dedicated to trying to actually kill you off.  So I investigated, was told you were "obviously mafia", saw the mafia die N2, then my gut screamed "something is #&(*%$# wrong here". 

I'm glad I told, in the end.  It ended up confirming just how the game is being run, gave us a small puzzle to solve that won't take up too much time from the town, and all with plenty of time in the day to go scumhunting. 

As for believing Janus: I learned the bay 12 lesson of 'role proof =! alignment proof'.  I also know, though, that Josh needed 3 full days to fully ripen his scuminess and that going after him before then would've been just WIFOM.  Janus was my prime target in D1.  That he is claiming a kill no one else will claim means all that is softened, but we'll see more as the days go by.  I won't drink the Wine when I have a stronger choice in my sights.


I've been thinking and I'm pretty sure that the name of the role itself is Sane Cop, and in no way affects its alignment. But, your role PM leads me to believe you're Paranoid, as opposed to Insane, and that these PMs might give an idea for what sanity you are.
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dakarian

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #316 on: November 02, 2009, 10:32:36 pm »

!

That's just crazy enough to work!

Sane cops.. don't say anything, but just take note of the PM itself.  How did it sound to you?  Remember, there's sane, insane (reverse alignment), naive, paranoid, and random.  For now, when it comes to your investigations, just focus on trying to figure out what you are.  If we can find a sane or insane cop among us, we might have something truly useful.
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JanusTwoface

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #317 on: November 02, 2009, 11:05:25 pm »

I blame Borderlands for a lack of posts.  Great game.  Anyways...

I will credit everyone with a minorly greater amount of density than normal.  Most of my earlier townie/third party posts have been for one simple reason:

EFFECT FOR THIS GAME:
If at anytime someone becomes "confirmed", they will be mod-killed instantly.
Except at the end of the game, of course.  That wouldn't be fair.


I'm avoiding getting too close to this rule.  I think I'm safe because although it's unlikely that scum would kill other scum, it's still possible, so just my actions are not enough to actually confirm.  For the record, ToonyMan, that's a very strange and open to interpretation rule.

Second, the lack of a mafia kill somewhat unnerves me.  I know that the mafia do not have a communal ability to kill people, but I'm doubting that Toony only gave them the ability to try to manipulate the vote into killing off the town.  Now I'm curious if there was no kill because they don't have the ability or because it was blocked...

Disclaimer: If there is a role blocker out there, I don't need to know about it.  I am not role fishing, merely thinking out loud.
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Cheeetar

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #318 on: November 02, 2009, 11:09:22 pm »

I've got an idea. This may be incredibly stupid, so point out if it is. We could lynch Dakarian, revealing his roles true abilities. If he is a scum lieing about Webadict being scum, a scum is lynched. If he is a true rolecop with no madness, we then lynch Webadict afterwards and get scum. My idea fails somewhat if he turns out to be a paranoid/naive cop.
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ToonyMan

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #319 on: November 02, 2009, 11:11:35 pm »

@JanusTwoFace:

Confirmed as in 100% alignment confirmed.

Too be honest this might not even happen this game, but it's something to watch out for.
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Eduren

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #320 on: November 03, 2009, 01:26:49 am »

I've got an idea. This may be incredibly stupid, so point out if it is. We could lynch Dakarian, revealing his roles true abilities. If he is a scum lieing about Webadict being scum, a scum is lynched. If he is a true rolecop with no madness, we then lynch Webadict afterwards and get scum. My idea fails somewhat if he turns out to be a paranoid/naive cop.
I'm pretty sure that his flip wouldn't determine Webs guilt/innocence. I mean, if he's not told his hidden condition then we won't be when he dies either.

Yes, I agree, the intricacies of the Cop roles can probably be found in our PM wording (Seeing as mine is very strange).
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Rysith

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #321 on: November 03, 2009, 01:31:14 am »

I've got an idea. This may be incredibly stupid, so point out if it is. We could lynch Dakarian, revealing his roles true abilities. If he is a scum lieing about Webadict being scum, a scum is lynched. If he is a true rolecop with no madness, we then lynch Webadict afterwards and get scum. My idea fails somewhat if he turns out to be a paranoid/naive cop.

Since his role is "Sane Cop" and we expect that that has little to do with his actual sanity, that's not going to help at all. We only get role name flops, not role description flops.

OMGUS = Old, broken tell.  It hasn't caught scum in ages and scum around here are very likely to attack a town with poor excuses.

I place the first vote on a person to pressure vote, based on a scumtell that HAS actually caught scum before, and to start a discussion on a person and you say that's anti-town. 

Probe for potential bandwagons?!  Are you serious?  I never knew Janus was marked as an easy lynch. 

You didn't just ask questions: you're marking me scum and voting off of poor logic and incorrect information and basing that your reason to accuse is...poor logic. 

Now come up with some new material before you start tunneling.  I'll put my money where my mouth is and pull an analysis on you to see if you're just a Bloodthirsty townie or an Overeager scum.

I agree: OMGUS on its own isn't a good tell at all. What is a good tell is getting very worked up over people voting you, and the OMGUS is just a topping on all of that. Hence "Add OMGUSing to your list of offenses", not "You OMGUSed, you must be scum!".

What I mean by "probing for potential bandwagons" is that you've voted a series of people (Janus, Webadict, myself, Cheeetar), each with only the briefest of explanations as to your vote. From here, it looks like putting votes on people to see if you can get anyone else to follow along and vote them as well. That's scummy.

And my questions were (and are) "What is your reasoning behind such rapid vote switching, as well as the apparent voting Janus despite a later willingness to claim sane cop and push for a vote on Webadict?" You've sort of answered those now, but you're still looking very much like you are defending by attacking your attacker.

Also: Posts between when you voted Janus and when you voted Webadict:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

So, the only bit of potential non-bastarding in that time was me, and you clearly don't trust me. Thus, I'm not satisfied with your logic behind that vote switch. The fact that you later declared things to in fact be bastard and voted yourself also doesn't help your claim that you had decided it wasn't bastardly before revealing your hand.

And I'm being careful not to tunnel, this time. I'm paying attention to the rest of the people, but you're arousing the most suspicion by far.
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dakarian

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #322 on: November 03, 2009, 08:05:44 am »

In the least, I know you aren't messing up your information.  The mentality of bastardly/nonbastardly was a little different though:

When the day started and I put together the Sane Cop that was lynched, the mafioso that was the only nightkill, and the role PM that just happened to hit the second mafia with a 'so obvious' I thought "something's off here.. it has to be".  Thus my first post.  Since I dislike sitting around doing nothing, I decided to scumhunt in the meanwhile, holding my investigation until I had a better idea.

Two things helped ease out my claim:  Yes, you were part of it.  I suspect you, I don't ignore you.  My 'ignore' point usually kicks in when I'm asking everyone around to join in lynching you.  The other was Janus claiming the kill.  That both calmed my suspicions on him for the time and helped explain what happened last night. 

So when I claimed, I thought it had a good chance of being unbastardly.  Thus I claimed and, later, opted to off myself since that would either eliminate a mafia or prove that the role names aren't trustworthy.  Toony's explanations made that moot.

That's what happened.  Janus has an alibi that may need to be traced later.  You seem Bloodthirsty pro-town so far based on the analysis.  I'm either Paranoid, Sane, Insane, or Random.

Sidenote: you haven't started tunnelvisioning. 

And Cheeetar
I've got an idea. This may be incredibly stupid, so point out if it is. We could lynch Dakarian, revealing his roles true abilities. If he is a scum lieing about Webadict being scum, a scum is lynched. If he is a true rolecop with no madness, we then lynch Webadict afterwards and get scum. My idea fails somewhat if he turns out to be a paranoid/naive cop.

You know, I normally hated the 'deflection' argument.  I believe that, even under direct attack, a townie should always be aggressive and going after others.  Thus their posts will have some defense as they try to deal with the accusations and some attack as they continue their scumhunt. 

So thank you, thank you Cheeetar, for showing me just exactly what a true Deflection looks like.  You don't defend, you don't answer to accusations, you just "suddenly" had an "idea so crazy it may work!" that involves me being dead.


A few problems:
1. I already came up with that idea
2. I already found out that it wouldn't work without me dying
3. Question Dodging and Deflection noted

I'm just about done with you now. 

You were passive most of Day 1, simply joining bandwagons using other people's arguments and providing no content for yourself.

You were the 4th vote on Nihilist's bandwagon: a scumtell.  Before you cry 'old broken scumtell', Pandarsenic KNEW about the tell and still ended up 3rd on the same bandwagon. 

You lurker hunt WELL past the point of normal lurker hunting.  I'll leave off the vote for someone not playing, since really it's not hard to get games confused.  What I WILL focus on, though, is that you hunted a lurker to their death and, when done, continued to lurker hunt.  Lurker hunting is easy, gets a good bit of popularity, and dispels some of the risk of lynching since "they were useless anyway". 

You were in lockstep with Pandar for a good bit of D1: voting 4th to his 3rd in Nihlists' bandwagon and voting 2nd to his 1st on Archangel's lurkerlynch.  You also jumped in when he and Web were at it.

Yet while your hands were buddies with Pandar, your mouth pretended he didn't exist.  You barely mention him and never attack him even when you casually lump him as scum during the Bus claim. 

The image of two people, never looking at each other, walking side by side in the same direction.  When you see that, you KNOW they know each other, but don't want people to realize they do.


And now you question dodge and deflect the conversation to an old subject that, if you were paying attention instead of just frantically glancing for something to help you, was already brought up and rejected.

I'm VERY close to being done with you.

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Leafsnail

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #323 on: November 03, 2009, 11:16:05 am »

Just to say: I am suspecting, from my pm, that I am a naive cop.  According to it I barely checked webadict's house at all, and just wandered off without doing anything.
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webadict

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #324 on: November 03, 2009, 10:01:44 pm »

@JanusTwoFace:

Confirmed as in 100% alignment confirmed.

Too be honest this might not even happen this game, but it's something to watch out for.
I'm assuming there is only one of each type of Cop, then.
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dakarian

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #325 on: November 03, 2009, 11:32:26 pm »

Dephy setup then?  Well, it fits the story so far with us having 4 cop claims now.

Dephy's setup would be Sane, Random, Naive, Paranoid. 

In dephy there are 5 cops, one of each type and a mafia pretending to be a cop.  The idea of breaking a Dephy is having the cops inspect each other and compare results.  Eventually, a pattern forms.

Since we already have 3 cops claiming themselves, it's late to hide things now.  Instead, we're best off investigating and sharing the results.  Unlike dephy, we can combine it with good old scumhunting and lynching (which right now should be based on the scumhunt, not the investigation).  Eventually, we'll not only find out which one is which but it may also ferret out mafioso that decided to play cop.

This, however, is something that the 'cops' need to deal with to the side.  For everyone else, it's the traditional game.


Which leads to me waiting for Cheeetar's answer, along with wondering how everyone else feels about him.
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Cheeetar

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #326 on: November 04, 2009, 12:15:02 am »

Dakarian: Ok you guys, Cheeetar is REALLY SUSPICIOUS for deflecting my question about his supicions. I'm not going to vote for him though. So, you guys how do you feel about him maybe we should vote for him if you want to?

Right now I'm going to vote Webadict. Not much content in his posts, not many posts.
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dakarian

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #327 on: November 04, 2009, 12:40:58 am »

I would ask that you post those questions that I seem to have deflected, along with why you suspect me but won't vote for me but wouldn't mind if I'm voted on by others.


But you know what.. I'm done.  You're scum.


@Everyone

Please read over the debate between me and Cheeetar.  Just about all of it starts a little after Day 2 begins (at my vote on Cheeetar), though you'll also want the data from my Wide Scan back in Day 1, the important information lies here:

Cheeetar: Randomvote Eduren, V Nihilist(4th)-RF, Unvotes Nihilist-unknownreason, V Archangel-[Lurker hunt, 2nd vote], V Webadict-BUS with Pandarsenic

To rephrase and expand, Cheeetar Randomvotes to Eduren, then later is the 4th vote against Nihilist (Pandarsenic was 3rd) due to RoleFishing, He later unvotes Nihilist without stating why and becomes the 1nd vote on Archangel instead.  He then switches to Webadict by claiming that he is bussing Pandarsenic.  Eventually, he dropps that vote and votes Archangel again, this time being the 2nd vote (Pandarsenic being the 1st) for lurking.  Archangel is then lynched.

The rest of the argument comes in Day 2.  I'm accusing Cheeetar of being passive, bandwagoning, being in sync with confirmed scum (Pandarsenic) while pretending to be distant, and now deflecting questions rather than answering them.


If you believe that my argument is faulty then show them so I can explain or reevaluate my stance.

If you believe that my argument makes sense but leaves you unsure then question or accuse Cheeetar so you can obtain those answers.

If you believe that the argument is sound and that there is no defense for Cheeetar, please vote for him. 

For myself, I am ready to see him lynched.
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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #328 on: November 04, 2009, 01:01:43 am »

I don't see any flaws in Dakarian's reasoning. Cheeetar.


I hate to lurk, but I'm afraid I don't have much to add. Every time I go to post something, I realize that other people have already said it or that it's inconsequential anyways. Cheeetar seems scummy, especially his voting pattern. The whole Shadowdump thing was somewhat perplexing and his deflections puzzle me.

My thoughts on Cheeetar?
Scum.
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Rysith

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Re: Toon Mafia V - Day 2 - Aren't Town Suppose To Die?
« Reply #329 on: November 04, 2009, 01:36:43 am »

If you believe that my argument is faulty then show them so I can explain or reevaluate my stance.

If you believe that my argument makes sense but leaves you unsure then question or accuse Cheeetar so you can obtain those answers.

If you believe that the argument is sound and that there is no defense for Cheeetar, please vote for him. 

I agree with you, he's been acting scummy. What I don't like is turning today into "Is Cheeetar scum, or not?" Especially when we've still got cop sanity running around, and not that much (it seems) to go on.

I'll admit that you've been seeming less scummy with your explanations, though, so I'll unvote and vote Cheeetar, pending his answer to your ultimatum. It would be a FOS, but I'm voting since I'm not entirely sure when the day ends and, without a response from Cheeetar that's another point against him.
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