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[CobaltKobold]

Why aren't more people asking their ICs questions, I wonder?

[RedWarrior0]

Unvote. I sense a slip-up:

Why aren't more people asking their ICs questions, I wonder?

I was thinking, town only has one IC, not 2. CobaltKobold, why the hell did you just use ICs in the plural if town has exactly one?

[Vector]

As far as MS goes, what I'm seeing right now is either

1. Moronic/unseasoned town
2. Scum of some flavor

At the moment I'm leaning towards scum, since I'd expect a townie to change his behavior... or staunchly defend it, or do something.  Town does not (or, at the very least, should not) spew WIFOM.

So, Martyr Syndrome.  Given that you seem to have been ignoring my last couple of questions, I suppose I'll ask another one: why do you persist in your behavior, even though you are up for a lynching?



Also: Damn.  Good catch.

[Apostolic Nihilist]

Listen, Org. I understand your usual behaviour is simply, 'wait around in the background', but as it stands this round already seems to be a bit inactive. More lurkers is not something we need right now. What do you think of Martyr Syndrome's scum claim, specifically?
Scum? WIFOM-spreading Town?
What of Cobalt Kobold's recent 'slip-up'?

We need discussion going in order to find scum, so why don't you start talking to us?

[CobaltKobold]

Unvote. I sense a slip-up:

Why aren't more people asking their ICs questions, I wonder?

I was thinking, town only has one IC, not 2. CobaltKobold, why the hell did you just use ICs in the plural if town has exactly one?

Mainly because I was trying to be inclusive. Let me point out an alternate scenario:
CobaltKobold: "Why are the town not asking their IC questions?" or, since you might leap on the third person plural pronoun, "Why are the town not asking our IC questions?"
Response: "How do you know the mafia are asking their IC questions? Why did you use the singular if there are two ICs?"

Spoiler: I'll explain, though it somewhat neutralizes the tactic's efficacy (click to show/hide)

I had the (somewhat underhanded but townie) idea at this game to find scum by paying careful attention to which people ask the town IC questions, reasoning that the newbie scum will instead ask their IC questions, which we will not see, and NOT ask the town IC, thus allowing us to eliminate those who ask the town IC questions.

And yes, I realize that this is entirely useless in clearing myself as self-meta means I understand that choosing to ask Web a question should be a [newbie] town action.

[RedWarrior0]

But why did you believe the scum weren't asking their IC?

[CobaltKobold]

Purely grammatical inclusion, I assure you. I didn't mean to assign meaning to extrapolating from a mostly-unrelated point (is the town asking its IC for help with stuff.)

[dakarian]

There's a movie, very popular among Fantasy folks, called The Princess Bride.

The story doesn't matter (hero rescuing a princess... big fights.. Andre the Giant.. so on), the following scene does.

The hero, at one point, met with one of the villans who thought of himself as extremely smart.  As such, the hero challenged him to a match.

Two wine glasses were placed, one in front of the hero, one in front of the villan.  Both filled with the same wine.  The hero tells the villan that one of the wines is poisoned by the hero.  The villan's job is to choose one of the wines to drink (with the hero drinking the other wine).  Whoever lives, wins.

The villain then went thusly:
All I have to do is divine from what I know of you: are you the sort of man who would put the poison into his own goblet or his enemy's?

Now, a clever man would put the poison into his own goblet, because he would know that only a great fool would reach for what he was given. I am not a great fool, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you.

But you must have known I was not a great fool, you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.


Because iocane comes from Australia, as everyone knows, and Australia is entirely peopled with criminals, and criminals are used to having people not trust them, as you are not trusted by me, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you.

And you must have suspected I would have known the powder's origin, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.


..and so on.

The problem is that the villain is trying to guess what the hero is doing.  Every time he thought of a reasoning that the hero would use, "That's what you WANT me to think!" would show up and it would make sense for the hero to reverse it.  The villain is now stuck and unable to choose.

This, in mafia, is called Wine In Front Of Me, or WIFOM.  Whenever a person acts in a way that causes you to have to guess their intentions you risk getting stuck in the same reasoning:

Person 1"Dakarian says that the mafia typically are lurkers and that he is active so he's town"

Person 2"But that's what he WANTS us to think.. oh no, Dakarian is scum trying to look like town"

Person 3"But that's what he WANTS us to think..Dakarian is town"

But...

WIFOM is one of the most powerful weapons the scum have, more powerful than the Nightkill.  A town full of WIFOM is a truly dead town.  Note that it's VERY easy for both town and scum to start WIFOM.  However, whether it's from town or scum, it's never safe for the town to delve into it.  The town needs to use logical reasoning that comes to firm conclusions and investigations to find more information that will lead to the needed reasoning. 

Whenever you find yourself able to fit in "That's what they want me to think" into your reasoning without messing things up then you are drinking WIFOM... stop NOW.


Btw, the answer to the Hero's puzzle?  Both wines were poisoned.  The hero was immune.

[ToonyMan]

The Princess Bride is a really good story.

[CobaltKobold]

And it is so delightful to watch people flounder in it, at least it would be if I were Mafia. Why do I not get to be mafia.

Why are you a member of the MafiaHomeowner's Association?
Nice weather we're having, isn't it?

I can't say that I'm a member of the MafiaHomeowner's Association either.

This seems to me to be a similar, but more egregious slip-up. It seems to me in many cases(not just mafia) that, when faced with an accusation, a guilty party will say "you cannot prove that" more often whereas an innocent is more likely to say "No, I did/am not."

Spoiler: If I were an evil misquoter (click to show/hide)

[...]I'm a member of the Mafia[...]

[CobaltKobold]

You're not webadict...

[Pandarsenic]

Protip, since I help the town a bit too:

WIFOM can and will fuck your shit up as town, all the damn way. It is the single most powerful weapon of the Scum. Once you doubt your own ability (as town) to reach independent conclusions, scum can control you. If you doubt yourself, they may encourage you; if you're confident but going at a townie, they may hold you back. You begin to be unable to see what is and isn't useful. You waste energy picking apart the WIFOM and miss obvious things.

Look at NSBM or Beginner Mafia 3. I was scum in both. Observe the bullshit I was able to pull.

I'm going to let you in on a secret scum secret. Of secretness.

Fake-edit: Wait a minute, I'm posting this to scumchat.

[CobaltKobold]

Would you mind cutting the crap, playing the game, and actually being helpful... Mr. Scumbucket?

unvote Talking to Martyr Syndrome there Vector?

So, Martyr Syndrome.  Given that you seem to have been ignoring my last couple of questions, I suppose I'll ask another one: why do you persist in your behavior, even though you are up for a lynching?



Also: Damn.  Good catch.

Furthermore in this post Vector is accusing someone of ignoring his questions...while ignoring my question.

[Vector]

.... That was a question?

Sorry, I thought it was obvious.  Yes, I was talking to Martyr Syndrome.

[dakarian]

You're not webadict...

I'm the host who's presence keeps this game running in the first place.