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[hops]

The problem is, free speech brings its own problems.
But even though I want to crucify some people for their opinions, I still find that a world where these people exist unpunished is still a better world than a world where you get killed for your opinion.

Of course, when it's on a forum in textual form you replace "murder" with "verbal abuse", but it still means that you get punished for your beliefs which doesn't fly with the Information Age.

[SalmonGod]

Well friend me on Steam or something before you go... don't just disappear suddenly like Gryph.

[hops]

GlyphGryph is still on #bay12lb if you want to ask his contacts.

[SalmonGod]

That's a relief.  I will have to go catch up with him soon.

Also, I still love this place.

[Bauglir]

I'm sad that GlyphGryph left...

I don't know if I said it before, but I'm onboard for the sadness about GlyphGryph.

Also, RedKing, would you be able to PM me some kind of contact information or something in the event that you do leave? I dunno if I'd ever use it but you have a perspective I've always enjoyed reading. And I'm sad to say that

The forum community seems to be changing (hell, the whole world seems to be), and not in a direction where people like me are welcome.

is a sense I've been getting around here lately, as well. Maybe it's just nostalgia glasses.

Spoiler: Bitch Bitch Bitch (click to show/hide)

This is the kind of dynamic I feel like we get on any kind of social or political discussion these days, to pick something that actually has entertainment value as a redeeming feature. I doubt anybody's been paying close enough attention to my posting habits in particular, but over the last year I've developed a habit of dropping out of conversations at the point when I realize nobody's actually interested in communicating. That goes for myself, as well - I stay in if I think I might still have something to say that somebody might listen to, and I admit that I sometimes fail on the first part of that. Every so often I'll take a step back and realize, "Shit, it doesn't matter if I'm right, I'm not actually saying anything worth reading."

I'm not trying to imply that half the forum is interested in good-faith discussion, by the way. If you think I'm saying "The forum's been infested by stupid people, here represented by Blackrazor", you're as much a part of the problem as anybody. All of these discussions I'm talking about boil down to "This is my preconceived notion, and you're an asshole for trying to prove me wrong, so I'll be an asshole to you" shouting down "This is my preconceived notion, and you're an asshole for not agreeing with me because of reasons X, Y, and Z, so I'll be an asshole to you". The community doesn't seem to have the critical mass of people who want to have a discussion that my nostalgia insists it once did, and it's had an awfully chilling effect on my ability to want to say anything.

At this point, I still value Bay12 for a few particular users (and boy do I hate how cliquish I feel about saying that), and for giving me a place to talk. It remains a helpful source for current events, although I can no longer count on any kind of useful analysis. When I post in one of the threads I'm bitching about in this very post, I at least have an opportunity to organize my own thoughts and explicitly reason out why I think the way I do. But despite the tremendous role this forum plays in my life, I can't in honesty say I feel like I'm part of its community any longer.

I'm hopeful that'll change back, but I don't really expect it.

NINJA-EDIT:I'll have to figure out how to work an IRC client again, then. And don't take that spoiler too seriously - to an extent, I'm probably just in an overly grumpy mood. But it's some thoughts that've been stewing and which I needed to get out.

[KingofstarrySkies]

I am under the belief that noone wants anyone to get banned, or to disappear. Even tuypo1. I care not who they are, what they believe, or how annoying they can get. They're still a part of our genocidal, inane, insane, stupid, brilliant, retarded, genius community.

[flabort]

Even GreatWyrmGolds? That's one user I miss having around.
I feel a sense of... youngness reading Bauglir's post, so I think I get what he and RedKing means about the changing; albeit I'm on the other side of the change.

[smjjames]

I'd be sad to see you go Redking. There's already so many of the old guard that have vanished/diminished in presence over the past couple years.

Aren't I one of the old guard? Though I did disappear for like three years.

Though nobody really seemed to notice or say hi when I came back.

[Vector]

.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Shame to see you go. I suppose I'll have to carry the torch of Great Carolina from here on.

[SalmonGod]

I suppose it does feel a little bit like there's less of a collaborative learning feel to debates on the forum these days... but it's still a more tolerant community with more residents who can appreciate and acknowledge my point of view even if they don't agree with it than anywhere else I know on the internet.  And I've stuck around here longer than anywhere else ever.

I'll also admit that there's a core membership of super-memorable and constructive-natured people that I love to see around.  Gryph was one of them.

BTW, I'm really easy to find.  I've made it that way intentionally.  I've been using SalmonGod as my screen name on absolutely everything for 17 years.  I keep the name, even though it's ridiculous, so that people I've lost touch with can always find me again.

[smjjames]

No acknowledgement of being old guard? Come on. Though I agree that some have disappeared or otherwise.

[Bauglir]

but it's still a more tolerant community with more residents who can appreciate and acknowledge my point of view even if they don't agree with it than anywhere else I know on the internet.

This is still definitely true, but then, I haven't been looking for a very long time. If I thought otherwise, I don't think I'd even be posting about this. Realistically, it's more fair to say that Bay12's community has evolved to suit a slightly different focus than it used to - it's just that what it used to be is something I valued more than where it seems to be going, or so my ever-rosy nostalgia glasses tell me. Even so, that's kind of my problem, not everybody else's, and if I were to earnestly demand that everybody shape up and conform to my expectations, that would legitimately and unquestionably make me the asshole here.

Really just needed to get that vented, I think.

[Furtuka]

No acknowledgement of being old guard? Come on. Though I agree that some have disappeared or otherwise.

Sorry, yeah I remember you. You've been around quite a while. Just harder to recognize on sight since you don't have an avatar

[Tiruin]

I'm sad that GlyphGryph left...

Didn't realize that. But looking at the circumstances, I'm probably not far behind him. The forum community seems to be changing (hell, the whole world seems to be), and not in a direction where people like me are welcome. And not one where I can quietly hold my tongue and try to ignore the things I see posted that make me want to bitchslap some people with all the fury of a thousand exploding suns.

The outspokenness, maybe? But not the people within the community--the community changes due to the people that inhabit it, and how outspoken they are (+attitudes).

GlyphGryph is still very much alive on #bay12lb (and very very conversational, much fun is had talking to him ;3), and there's no need to leave at all--just to either keep hold to what you treasure and your values through all this...'change'.

Though I'm pretty sure it isn't change and is more of 'new people popping up here'.

This just in: People have differing opinion.

Opinions?You snarky Objective, you.

Sad to see you guys leave though. Sadder, however, to see the proliferation of what causes you to leave. :S