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[Aqizzar]

Well I just got in a serious fight with my mother over the phone for, I guess, being snippy about her calling me without anything to talk about (that she remembered at the moment).  On the one hand, I really don't feel like I'm at fault here.  For some reason, the way I talk has always made her think that I'm angry about something.  I dunno, I think a hard day at work, long traffic, I hand-delivered flowers to your job for Mother's Day, and you're calling just because you feel like I don't call you enough is enough excuse for me to be slightly disinterested in talking a lot.  She's always been easily irritated and defensive, and I swear some days she just wants things to be upset about.  Especially considering she's on pain-killers for a car accident she didn't even tell me about until I'd apologized.

On the other hand, she is my mother for God's sake, I'm supposed to want to hear from her.  Right?  I guess?  Apparently I'm the only one who considers two weeks ago to be recent.

I feel like I should stick up for myself and not feel guilty, and that I should feel guiltier than I do, and that just once I'd like to hear her admit when she's being a jerk, and then I feel guilty for that.  Dammit.

[Furtuka]

I'm starting to conclude that the reason for why I feel so annoyed with how people behave is because there's something different about my interpretation of self worth that I just can't put my finger on.

[Solifuge]

Is moving completely infeasible? It's rarely easy, but it might be something to consider for your long-term well-being.

I can sympathize with you here, if it helps... though my Mom rarely lacks for things to talk about, because she doesn't socialize much outside the family. Conversations with her are a delicate dance to avoid breaking into serious arguments over really trivial things, and she's prone to dump her problems and internal garbage on you. Phone calls and visiting with her tend to be emotionally draining experiences. I too would like for her to be able to admit fault where it exists, and to become a more whole person some day, but I don't know how and when and if that will happen. But I love her anyway. Don't always know why, but I do.

It's okay to be angry at people you love. Just make sure if you call them out on things, or get into arguments, you're acting out of love and not otherwise, I guess.

RE: Depression. To peeps from earlier, I appreciate your words. Even if it's just commiseration. I know I'll be through it in time, and I'll hopefully have a better handle on real problems in my life then.

Vector, I'm not, and can't in good conscience, pursue suicide no matter how bad things get. Too permanent, and death is too unknown a quantity. Moreover, to elect to die without any benefit coming from that death is just a wasteful negativity; it would bring pain to other people, with no substantial benefit. It just has an insidious way of seeming like justice when everything I've done seems uselessness and purposeless. Semi-quantifiable positive outcomes are a good thing for me to consider right now, though, so thanks for that.

Truean, I caught what you wrote before you edited it into a punctuation mark, and I'm endeavoring to see things your way. I do understand my responsibility to the world, to do something valuable and worthwhile with my life. I'm just having a hard time finding that road... in part because I feel like I represent a burden on those in my life, in part because I'm having trouble finding anything terribly important, and in part because I've gotten myself in a very unstable position and don't know where to go next without the few comforts I enjoy (house, food, etc) falling apart.


Is it possible to make ends meet and contribute to the benefit of the world-at-large, in a way that doesn't feel like dehumanization or becoming a cog in some machine? I really need to find that.

[kaijyuu]

Just because they're family doesn't mean you should be expected to take more BS from them than from anyone else. If anything, you should expect less; they're supposed to care about you, right?

The flip side of this is you have less of an excuse to be a jerk to them than other people (not that anyone has any excuse to be a jerk to anyone, but hey). You should care about them too.


Anywho, if the only reason you tolerate someone's presence is because "they're Family (tm)", then you're causing yourself unnecessary pain and/or you have some Problems with them that need resolving by communication. Most likely the latter.

[Vector]

Be a teacher, Soli?

[Truean]

Einstein was a patent clerk. <--- Pointless job and arguably harmful. Pays the bills though.

What I wrote wasn't about your "responsibility" it was about your worth and right to exist, and how there are human beings who are burdens and that you aren't one.

You want meaning in life? A whole string of philosophers throughout history have driven themselves crazy trying to find that. Take care of yourself doing what you have to do. Know that the shit you are in is not your fault: it's because of when you graduated. If this were 20 years ago, you'd be a king.

Do what you can with what you have where you are.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I hate where I am in life currently. I don't like many if any of my clients. Several of them are absolutely terrible people. I get paid terribly by the state, and late. If I give these people a cookie, they want some milk, then a gallon, then the cow, then the entire dairy farm. Also if the case is won "they" won it. If it is lost then "I" lost it....

Get stable/stay stable and ride out this godforsaken economic storm. Whatever effort you put in will not be "wasted," if you get something out of it in terms of money. Sure, cog it up a bit. If you still want "meaning" then you don't have to get that from your job necessarily. If you're a feel good type, then join one of those clubs like ... Elks, Lions, or [insert charitable organization here]. If tending to the world's ills in your spare time does it for you, then do it. Just make sure YOU are ok before any of that happens, because if (for some reason I will never understand) you feel like you owe the world something, you have to be stable yourself first....

The charitable organization you join will do .... [insert thing here] and then you can say you've made a difference doing that. I dunno, I hope this helps a little.

That said, you are way too damn hard on yourself.

[Frumple]

Kinda' feels, Soli. I'm banking on long odds to give back to society or whatev', but kinda' gave up particular hope that I'll actually manage anything meaningful... years back. Too mismatched with societal standards, too tired, can't seem to care enough to change either of it. Not sure what's going to happen when I don't have family to fall back on anymore, hum. Trying to work through some certification/education stuff so I can manage at least self-support, but... not feeling it. Not feeling it so hard. Wish it was easier to do something useful and stay fed and somewhat entertained at the same time.

In more localized sad... I'm starting to suspect I've lost of the ability to lie or... something. Somewhere in the last few years my ability to communicate in willful bad faith seems to have atrophied, and I'm kinda' starting to think I may never have had the ability to begin with. It's... such a strange feeling. This is supposed to be a good thing or... something, right? But it's more like it's crippled certain means and methods of communication. Somewhat annoying that it mostly limits things to honesty or avoidance and the only reaction you have available to certain sorts of inquiry are... weird. S'just... dunno. Long day today, more tomorrow. And right now I'm struggling with the concept of telling people what they want to hear, regardless as to the appropriateness of doing so. Feels so fucking wrong. Same kind of fundamental wrongness that comes from crap like "selling yourself". Not supposed to withhold or manipulation information that would impact optimal decision making, damnit! Even when it would be personally beneficial

Riddle me this, though: How do you respond to someone asking you to judge a person based on insufficient information, when "I cannot" is not accepted and you can't communicate in bad faith? Judging without sufficient information to make a justifiable judgment would acting in bad faith, yes, and in the confines of the scenario in question calling the asker on it is verboten. Is it possible to get out of something like that without compromising principles?

[Descan]

Wait, why can't you just say "I don't have enough information"?

I do that and it's been accepted nearly all the time.

[Vector]

I always say: "I don't have enough information to make a definitive statement, but my impression is ____________"  Because often, people really do just want your gut reaction.  Your fast-processing, in other words.

[SalmonGod]

Apparently I'm the only one who considers two weeks ago to be recent.

I consider two months to be recent.  Sometimes even more, depending on the relationship.  I know I'm far from the norm here, though.  I don't consider time investment or maintenance to be an essential part of a relationship.  For me it's all about what's been shared, and that's it.  I can go for years not talking with someone I care about and then pick up again like that span of time never happened, and that feels normal to me.  Really bothers most people.  "Quality Time" is one of the most heated arguments my wife and I have on a regular basis.

[Frumple]

I always say: "I don't have enough information to make a definitive statement, but my impression is ____________"  Because often, people really do just want your gut reaction.  Your fast-processing, in other words.

... problem with that is that it's mostly been trained out of me. Fast processing and gut reaction is... bad. In a lot of cases. My first reaction these days to gut feeling is "Where am I fucking up?" and/or "What information am I lacking", because it usually means I'm making assumptions without being aware of it and that causes all sorts of terrible shenanigans. Impressions are to be stopped, hogtied, and buried under a rock until analysis can come check it out. Corollary to the maxim that natural or self-evident are words I should express extreme skepticism towards, doubly so when they're coming out of me

My gut reaction to people asking for my gut reaction is a strange sort of hostility, ha. Ask me to evaluate based on insufficient information, will you!? We dual at dawn, ye monger of epistemological perfidy. I will strike you down for this sin of justification!

But nah, in this particular case it was a question regarding a short documentary piece, asking to evaluate a person's character based on the (really damn shallow and piss-poor/sensationalist overall) information given by said piece. Gist of the response was, "I can tell you want happened, insofar as the information you provided for analysis, but I can't tell you what that means re: character." Didn't have enough information or the training to evaluate the limited information to a meaningful degree and the person presenting the question was... not entirely amused when I just kinda', y'know, said that.

S'not actually that big of a deal overall, but the last several hours have been off and on giving me fits trying to figure out a better way of approaching the situation. Maybe worked out a couple better responses during the interim, but it'll probably be a few more back and forth responses before I can tell if they're viable approaches, hum.

Apparently I'm the only one who considers two weeks ago to be recent.

I consider two months to be recent.  Sometimes even more, depending on the relationship.  I know I'm far from the norm here, though.  I don't consider time investment or maintenance to be an essential part of a relationship.  For me it's all about what's been shared, and that's it.  I can go for years not talking with someone I care about and then pick up again like that span of time never happened, and that feels normal to me.

You too, huh? S'kind of an evaluative thing, f'me. Generally folks I'd be willing to pick up interaction with like that after a period are ones that, well, are fairly unlikely to change in ways to make that not happen. So now, tomorrow, next month, next decade... whatever. Good people's good people. Friend is friend until proven otherwise. Time apart isn't sufficient proof. More immediate actions are the measure.

[SalmonGod]

My gut reaction to people asking for my gut reaction is a strange sort of hostility, ha. Ask me to evaluate based on insufficient information, will you!? We dual at dawn, ye monger of epistemological perfidy. I will strike you down for this sin of justification!

You say the most awesome things.

Apparently I'm the only one who considers two weeks ago to be recent.

I consider two months to be recent.  Sometimes even more, depending on the relationship.  I know I'm far from the norm here, though.  I don't consider time investment or maintenance to be an essential part of a relationship.  For me it's all about what's been shared, and that's it.  I can go for years not talking with someone I care about and then pick up again like that span of time never happened, and that feels normal to me.

You too, huh? S'kind of an evaluative thing, f'me. Generally folks I'd be willing to pick up interaction with like that after a period are ones that, well, are fairly unlikely to change in ways to make that not happen. So now, tomorrow, next month, next decade... whatever. Good people's good people. Friend is friend until proven otherwise. Time apart isn't sufficient proof. More immediate actions are the measure.

This is one way social media turns out to be really useful.  Just liking/commenting Facebook posts once in a while seems to greatly relax most people's expectations of social time investment.

[Descan]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: I like the Frumpster and his typographical weirdness~

[Solifuge]

Suiting up to do a serious Malware Purge. I suspect something has hijacked my Java, Flash, and a notoriously easily hijacked Windows process (it's been driving my CPU usage up to full for a while). Might resolve some of my connectivity and performance issues.

If you don't hear from me, I most likely accidentally my computer.

[AlleeCat]

I hate it when I accidentally my computer. Sometimes I accidentally the entire thing, and then things get really bad.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: I like the Frumpster and his typographical weirdness~

Are we giving him nicknames now? Can I call him Frumplestiltzskin? X3