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[fqllve]

The infinitive is cute, though gerunds are much nicer.
Also, the real fun is in interwoven phrase structure, like the subject complement clause being tangled up with a predicative nominal clause, with bits of the two scattered around the main clause until you need to hunt them down word by word.

Predicate nominatives are a type of subject complement, so I dunno what you're trying to say here.

I've always had an easy time with spelling and structuring language (as well as vocabulary) - that came seemingly instinctively to me. Could never bring myself pay attention to the grammatical parts of the Swedish (or English, for that matter) classes, though, so I have no idea what all those fancy latin words for stuff means. I guess this is also part of why grammar and "laws" always seemed unnecessary to me - I never needed them in the first place. It always makes me feel stupid when people throw them around, though.

Anyone who tells you there are grammatical "laws" needs to read a book written after 1924.

And grammar education is pretty much worthless. Most people don't make many grammatical errors.

[Lord Shonus]

This may be a stupid question, but are people who spell it 'grammer' actually honestly wrong, or are they just trollin'?

Also I am the Grammar King. I know what an infinitive is, and how to split it, and why the rule not to split it is fucking silly.

The infinitive is cute, though gerunds are much nicer.
Also, the real fun is in interwoven phrase structure, like the subject complement clause being tangled up with a predicative nominal clause, with bits of the two scattered around the main clause until you need to hunt them down word by word.

+1 for saying that with a split infinitive. Of course, I've never heard anyone insist that it's invariably wrong except grade-school English teachers and idiots that think English is a Romance language and should follow all Latin uses.

Not even all Romance languages follow Latin structure entirely. Sure, the English language made off with about 70-80% of its words from Latin, but it's goddamn Germainc.

Exactly. But that's where a lot of nonsense comes from. "It's impossible to split an infinitive in Latin because it's a word form and not a pair of words. That means that we should treat the English infinitive as one word even though it's clearly two and must never ever be willing to wrongly split them."

[scriver]

Anyone who tells you there are grammatical "laws" needs to read a book written after 1924.

That's exactly what I tell those who do. Often in a very ranty tone of voice, unfortunately . My grandmother, an old teacher, feels the exact opposite way. I have spent many family dinners with fists clenched, trying hard to keep my objections from being anything more than a questioning look on my face.

And grammar education is pretty much worthless. Most people don't make many grammatical errors.

In their native language, perhaps. English/second language grammar lessons are very much needed for many people.
edit: That might have sounded more elitist than I intended, in light of previous posts.. I'd like to add that I myself do not believe I somehow learned the English "structuring" without the grammar lessons, just that I never needed it as much as others around me.

[Something Evil]

Predicate nominatives are a type of subject complement, so I dunno what you're trying to say here.

Mistranslation on my part most likely. I haven't really gotten the grasp of the English terminology yet.
I was referring to having two subordinate clauses scattered throughout each-other and the main clause, and having to track down the words from each clause one by one to figure out what kind of clause you're dealing with. Romance languages especially have a really fun habit of tossing their clauses in the blender and serving you the resulting mishmash.

Exactly. But that's where a lot of nonsense comes from. "It's impossible to split an infinitive in Latin because it's a word form and not a pair of words. That means that we should treat the English infinitive as one word even though it's clearly two and must never ever be willing to wrongly split them."

What is this I don't even.

[Lord Shonus]

I'm not joking. That's exactly where the split infinitive rule came from.

[fqllve]

Mistranslation on my part most likely. I haven't really gotten the grasp of the English terminology yet.
I was referring to having two subordinate clauses scattered throughout each-other and the main clause, and having to track down the words from each clause one by one to figure out what kind of clause you're dealing with. Romance languages especially have a really fun habit of tossing their clauses in the blender and serving you the resulting mishmash.

Okay, I see what you were saying. I was thinking of something like a relative clause inside an identifying clause inside another sentence like ". . .because he is what I become. . ."

In their native language, perhaps. English/second language grammar lessons are very much needed for many people.
edit: That might have sounded more elitist than I intended, in light of previous posts.. I'd like to add that I myself do not believe I somehow learned the English "structuring" without the grammar lessons, just that I never needed it as much as others around me.

I didn't think it sounded elitist. It's very important to learn the grammar of a second language. It's difficult to teach grammar in a way that's going to be applicable though. The best way to learn it is probably by conversing with native speakers.

[Keita]

So. Much. Talk. About. GRAMMAR!

*runs screaming.*

[Something Evil]

I'm not joking. That's exactly where the split infinitive rule came from.

But... but... English verbal structure is painfully and obviously Germanic. What has Latin infinitive structure have to do with anything?

[fqllve]

It mostly has to do with English speakers following on the coattails of the Academie francaise and appealing to Latin authority. Well before the founding of linguistics as a legitimate science. Probably even before Grimm.

[Acanthus117]

Life made me sad today.

[Angel Of Death]

Life made me sad today.

What happened?

[Acanthus117]

Life made me sad today.

What happened?

Vague sense of regret, angst and despair over my life as of yet, not to mention an almost crippling fear for my future.

My dad says I'm a few decades too young to have a mid-life crisis.

[Keita]

Nothing like getting it over early I guess :/

[Darvi]

Eh, it'll be over in no time. Been there, done that.

[Acanthus117]

I just think family money problems just exacerbated said angst.

It's been going on for forever :v