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[Outcast Orange]

I have to say, it would be awesome to find oil underground and pump it up for refining or use as fuel.

Then again, it would be nice to be able to extract oil from certain animals as well for the same uses.

I disagree.

That would violate the whole "no steampunk stuffs" rule.
I don't really want this game to become "Sim Everything",
because then it starts to have more of a focus on realism,
and less on random crazy-sandbox fun.

If the only purpose of oil was burning (no combustion engines, except for maybe mega projects)
then I would have to agree, that oil would be fun!

I would love to see a 3D ascii geyser in Visual Fortress some day.
And then said geyser on fire.

Damn! I've been pseudo-ninja'd!

[forsaken1111]

I'm not sure if oil was used in the time period that Toady wants this fantasy setting to replicate, but it WOULD make the fire accidents way more fun...

"Ever since the accident at Uradgashud, the oil wells there have been burning for all of 9 years now..."

Well certainly they had primitive uses for oil, and knew it burned. Fat from animals was rendered into oil and used in cooking and fish oil was often used in medieval medicine. I'm sure it didn't escape their notice that it burned when hot enough.

[forsaken1111]

I have to say, it would be awesome to find oil underground and pump it up for refining or use as fuel.

Then again, it would be nice to be able to extract oil from certain animals as well for the same uses.

I disagree.

That would violate the whole "no steampunk stuffs" rule.
I don't really want this game to become "Sim Everything",
because then it starts to have more of a focus on realism,
and less on random crazy-sandbox fun.

If the only purpose of oil was burning (no combustion engines, except for maybe mega projects)
then I would have to agree, that oil would be fun!

I would love to see a 3D ascii geyser in Visual Fortress some day.
And then said geyser on fire.

Damn! I've been pseudo-ninja'd!

What part of what I said did you get steampunk from? I said use it for fuel... as in BURNING...

[JoshuaFH]

Oil lamps or primitive heating systems would be mighty awesome.

[Outcast Orange]

Fuel for what? A machine.------(keep following the dashes, it'll be okay)------------> Steampunk.
Unless you're going to use it for furnaces, in which case it's just a super difficult version of wood.
Sorry, but my mind makes assumptions.
And oil, as far as I know, is only used by complicated machinery.

EDIT: Oil lamps sound good, but they might have too many parts to fit the era.

[winner]

Oil lamps are ancient.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[JoshuaFH]

Well, by heating system, I'd mean like: Flood a z-level with oil + set it aflame = Keeps everything warm! It'd be a nifty way of melting ice on glaciers.

Or you could just set up simple devices that use it. Like say: A tower full of oil that sprays goblins sieges, then another mechanism sets them on fire.

Oil is also a lubricant: "Man, what is this hill covered with?! I can't walk up it, I keep slipping!".

The possibility of polluting the environment is awesome as well.

[Outcast Orange]

I really like all of the ideas in that last post.

[Niveras]

Ever since the accident at Uradgashud, the oil wells there have been burning for all of 9 years now..."

Heh.

"Don't cross the streams (of oil and magma). You'll cause a paradox and the universe will implode. Actually, it's a pretty logical transfer of energy. That'll explode. Just don't do it, okay?"

Unless you're going to use it for furnaces, in which case it's just a super difficult version of wood.
And oil, as far as I know, is only used by complicated machinery.

I was thinking more fuel, like lignite or coal. Not sure if it could be used in the same way (e.g. whether you could use fuel oil to make steel, or whether the coal is needed because of its chemical structure more than just something to generate heat). Certainly it could be used to power furnaces like coal, though collecting out of a pressured reserve might require a moderate to advanced fortress.

Using oil as weapons is also possible. Burning pitch/tar, flame-lit arrows, explosive catapult ammunition. Possibly explosive ballista arrowheads (though I have a hard time imagining that).

[Sizik]

Oil lamps are ancient.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Those would use plant or animal based oil, not petroleum.

[Outcast Orange]

I don't think it would explode, it would probably just catch fire like in any other heat + oil reaction. Or maybe it would boil...

[forsaken1111]

Fuel for what? A machine.------(keep following the dashes, it'll be okay)------------> Steampunk.
Unless you're going to use it for furnaces, in which case it's just a super difficult version of wood.
Sorry, but my mind makes assumptions.
And oil, as far as I know, is only used by complicated machinery.

EDIT: Oil lamps sound good, but they might have too many parts to fit the era.

You're jumping to wild assumptions, as you noted. I said use as fuel, just like coal is used as fuel. You say it's a superdifficult version of wood... well so is magma when you put it that way. Magma requires the same amount of setup and infrastructure oil would, except oil won't burn your dwarves (unless its on fire...). Oil could be (more safely) used to heat the fortress, provide lighting (if that's ever put in) etc.

I don't want, nor do I really care about, 'steampunk' being in the game.

[DeathOfRats]

You say it's a superdifficult version of wood... well so is magma when you put it that way. Magma requires the same amount of setup and infrastructure oil would, except oil won't burn your dwarves (unless its on fire...). Oil could be (more safely) used to heat the fortress, provide lighting (if that's ever put in) etc.

The advantage magma has over wood as a fuel source (for workshops and the like) is that it's inexhaustible. Also, I don't agree with it being a superdifficult version of wood... it's pretty simple to handle and use. Yes, it takes a bit more effort to set up, but not much, and once it's set up, it's much simpler.

For oil to be an interesting fuel (leaving aside considerations of whether it would work for things such as smithing - I'm not a chemist or anything like that, so I don't have a clue), it'd need to have some advantage over wood/bitcoal/lignite. It could be as simple as getting multiple fuel units from a single tile (hey, it *is* a liquid, so we could be getting 6/7 units per tile, for example).

[forsaken1111]

You say it's a superdifficult version of wood... well so is magma when you put it that way. Magma requires the same amount of setup and infrastructure oil would, except oil won't burn your dwarves (unless its on fire...). Oil could be (more safely) used to heat the fortress, provide lighting (if that's ever put in) etc.

The advantage magma has over wood as a fuel source (for workshops and the like) is that it's inexhaustible. Also, I don't agree with it being a superdifficult version of wood... it's pretty simple to handle and use. Yes, it takes a bit more effort to set up, but not much, and once it's set up, it's much simpler.

For oil to be an interesting fuel (leaving aside considerations of whether it would work for things such as smithing - I'm not a chemist or anything like that, so I don't have a clue), it'd need to have some advantage over wood/bitcoal/lignite. It could be as simple as getting multiple fuel units from a single tile (hey, it *is* a liquid, so we could be getting 6/7 units per tile, for example).

Good points. There's no reason the oil couldn't be inexhaustible or at least very efficient. Perhaps a 'gather oil in barrel' job at an oil well building which is built, like a well, above the oil. Then oil barrels could be taken to a refinery and refined into useful components. Just a thought, as burning isn't the only thing you can do with oil.

Also, oil doesn't have to come from down deep. Many animals have oils which can be extracted by a simple mechanical press... whale oil was a main source of heat and light for a long time.

[JoshuaFH]

But to get whale oil, we'll need whale hunting.

For whale hunting, we'll need dwarvish ships.

Sounds good.