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[Maximum Spin]

The whole Ali + Jasmine thing seems cute and all, until you realize that Jasmine is like, 16.

So uhm, her getting married is you know-- child marriage. Go Disney!

That's over the age of consent in the majority of American states. It's not child marriage, it's just regular marriage at an age which, indeed, would be a little late for Persian royalty of the approximate time period.

[Reelya]

The whole Ali + Jasmine thing seems cute and all, until you realize that Jasmine is like, 16.

So uhm, her getting married is you know-- child marriage. Go Disney!

That's over the age of consent in the majority of American states. It's not child marriage, it's just regular marriage at an age which, indeed, would be a little late for Persian royalty of the approximate time period.

http://apps.frontline.org/child-marriage-by-the-numbers/

There are around 10,000 minors getting married per year in the USA, about 87% of them are girls, and about about 86% of them marry someone who is an adult. About 1/3rd of them were 16, most of the rest 17. So I'm guessing a couple of thousand 16 year old girls get married to an adult per year, just in the USA. It's pretty common and nobody really gives a shit about this, or y'all would be making petitions and stuff

Most of what we're going to get on the issue is someone typing "i'm outraged!" then going back to perusing cat videos.

[Maximum Spin]

There are around 10,000 minors getting married per year in the USA, about 87% of them are girls, and about about 86% of them marry someone who is an adult. About 1/3rds of them were 16, most of the rest 17. So I'm guessing a couple of thousand 16 year old girls get married to an adult per year, just in the USA. It's pretty common and nobody really gives a shit about this, or y'all would be making petitions and stuff.

Pretty much, yeah. There are a few groups that try to make a big deal out of it but approximately nobody else cares, because the vast majority of these are just kids with <10 years age difference who grew up together and followed a nauseatingly standard romance story path. The handful of more "dramatic" cases are from immigrant communities from places where that's more common so nobody wants to touch those either.

Addendum: It's considered extremely normal for a wife to be like 2-10 years younger than her husband, here. The opposite is not uncommon, but definitely rarer, at least in the rural and suburban milieus with which I'm familiar. It's Not A Big Deal. Some people like to imply that this is some kind of patriarchy, but, in truth, it's usually the women looking for older men (this is ESPECIALLY true among teens and young adults, probably because they seem to find teenage boys annoying) more than the reverse, so...

[Rolan7]

Oh I'm sure it's not patriarchy.  Just that women are taught the value of their bodies for child bearing, and trade that to significantly older men for financial stability which they "coincidentally" lack.  It's all very romantic /s

[pisskop]

Its fairly romantic to have somebody cater to your every whim and to form an emotional connection with them.  And the fact that they tend to be older and a little more mature than the teenagers around you doesnt hurt.  Its not without its sentimentalisms.

[Egan_BW]

Oh I'm sure it's not patriarchy.  Just that women are taught the value of their bodies for child bearing, and trade that to significantly older men for financial stability which they "coincidentally" lack.  It's all very romantic /s

lemme just quietly +1 this

[Il Palazzo]

Then let me -1 it.

[Maximum Spin]

Oh I'm sure it's not patriarchy.  Just that women are taught the value of their bodies for child bearing, and trade that to significantly older men for financial stability which they "coincidentally" lack.  It's all very romantic /s

Everything about that is wrong.

Our TFR is 1.7, below replacement, which should be your first hint that nobody here cares about childbearing. Considering how lopsidedly *implemented* that TFR is, most of the couples I'm talking about aren't even going to have children, or maybe one.

2-10 years is not "significantly older".

The men in question are themselves unlikely to have financial stability in the first place.

You can make up whatever bullshit critical theory approved story you want, but it's not a substitute for having basic empathy and knowing actual people in the actual situation.
And when you come out of the gate with "women have no agency and just do and choose whatever they are taught to do and choose" you're just being a terrible person.

[LordBaal]

Us men tend to be more inmature than woman. Hence is not uncomon for woman to look up for someone which in theory will have a mindset similitar to them, which for example for a 25 years woman migth not be a 25 party dude.

[Reelya]

Oh I'm sure it's not patriarchy.  Just that women are taught the value of their bodies for child bearing, and trade that to significantly older men for financial stability which they "coincidentally" lack.  It's all very romantic /s

That's a very distorted picture. The only bit you're right about is it's not that romantic.

The women want to have kids. They're not "trading" it to the men. The idea that women decide to become incubators for men's benefit in exchange for economic wealth is delusional.

Not least of which is that the very economic instability is actually caused by that thing:

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2015/aug/29/women-in-20s-earn-more-men-same-age-study-finds

When aged 22-29, women earn an average of £1,111 more than men – but the roles are reversed with a vengeance once 30 is hit

Uh, "coincidentally", the gender pay gap only appears at the point where women have kids. And it's "coincidentally" when this huge thing grows in them over almost a year then pops out and has to be taken care of 24/7. At this point they suddenly decide that having someone else take up the slack ... would be a good idea. I'll also point that men aren't age-constrained by the biological clock thing. So even all else being equal a woman who wants to have kids has time constraints, but she can pick from men who do not. And since she can definitely pick men with a higher earning capacity than she does (just due to seniority), even all else being equal, it would make economic sense for her to work less hours than him going forward.

So ... women who are actually doing perfectly well financially then decide to get married to a wealthier older man and have babies for him, an act that is the actual reason they end up with said financial instability. ... None of that actually makes sense.

So, no, they didn't actually trade anything to a man: they sacrificed their own economic independence in order to have children. Many people call something like that "having a purpose in life".

EDIT: let me note, a 29 year old woman earns more than a 29 year old man, on average (UK study and also in a large US study). If those two married each other, then it would make economic sense for the woman to go back to work, and for the man to stay home. However, that's not the decision women normally make, they definitely prefer a mate with higher income than themselves, and it's the income differential which dictates who *should* stay home in order to maximize the earning capacity of the household.

[Rolan7]

You can make up whatever bullshit critical theory approved story you want, but it's not a substitute for having basic empathy and knowing actual people in the actual situation.
And when you come out of the gate with "women have no agency and just do and choose whatever they are taught to do and choose" you're just being a terrible person.

I believe the domestic dream is fine and valid.  I think people should be able to choose it, and have the financial stability to do so or not.  For some people it's an unachievable luxury to stay home, and that sucks.  For others it's simply the role they're forced into, and that also sucks.

I have no idea what you believe in, except that you usually seem afraid to say it out loud.

[Maximum Spin]

I have no idea what you believe in, except that you usually seem afraid to say it out loud.

Lol, if you wanna ask a question, go ahead. Although I'd say I don't believe IN anything.

[Rolan7]

Nah, I'm good.  Sorry for the derail.

[Maximum Spin]

Nah, I'm good.  Sorry for the derail.

That's, not fear, why I try to avoid sharing too many of my own opinions: there's no thread for it.

[Naturegirl1999]

I thought there was the random thoughts theead
Check here, it’s a thread specifically for sharing opinions