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[Euld]

So far, I have an almost solid grasp of Hiragana, but Katakana just beats my head in trying to remember it. And they're just the same thing with different characters, so it's especially maddening in that regard. I heard Kanji has something like 1000 characters, and that Japanese kids need to know them in order to graduate middle school. That's a scary scary thought.

Something that helped me was associating the abstract forms with real objects.  Ka in Katakana kinda looks like the tip of a katana, for example.  And for Na, kinda reminded me of a stylized flying gnat (gNAt).

[Vorthon]

I'm reading the Mote in God's Eye.

Dear god do Niven and Pournelle make a good team.

[SalmonGod]

If I remember right, there are actually tens of thousands of Kanji characters, but you only need to know a very small portion (I think it's still over 1,000, though) to be considered literate... fluent, even.  I think most of them are dialect in nature.  Just like in english, no one uses the whole dictionary.

I'm recalling this off the top of my head from 6 years ago, so I'm likely wrong about something here.  I wish I had time to study Japanese again.  I really wanted to learn.

[Reudh]

So far, I have an almost solid grasp of Hiragana, but Katakana just beats my head in trying to remember it. And they're just the same thing with different characters, so it's especially maddening in that regard. I heard Kanji has something like 1000 characters, and that Japanese kids need to know them in order to graduate middle school. That's a scary scary thought.

Something that helped me was associating the abstract forms with real objects.  Ka in Katakana kinda looks like the tip of a katana, for example.  And for Na, kinda reminded me of a stylized flying gnat (gNAt).

Ah yeah. I had the Na in hiragana as 'nun' with the elongated cross and someone kneeling down.



Katakana are pretty easy to learn once you learn how they relate to hiragana.


And Salmon is right, there are many thousands of kanji - think of them as 'Word bits' - some words can be one kanji, some can be two, or more. To pass VCE Japanese (year 12) we had to identify 1000, and write 500 passably well.

[JoshuaFH]

So far, I have an almost solid grasp of Hiragana, but Katakana just beats my head in trying to remember it. And they're just the same thing with different characters, so it's especially maddening in that regard. I heard Kanji has something like 1000 characters, and that Japanese kids need to know them in order to graduate middle school. That's a scary scary thought.

Something that helped me was associating the abstract forms with real objects.  Ka in Katakana kinda looks like the tip of a katana, for example.  And for Na, kinda reminded me of a stylized flying gnat (gNAt).

That's something I try to do, but even in Hiragana I still get tripped up by the ones that look alike, namely Ne ね, Wa わ, and Re れ. I just need some more drilling in Katakana, and it'll stick eventually.

I still need alot of practice reading things naturally, as I still need to take everything one character at a time to read what something says.

My goal is to become atleast proficient enough that I can finally do a complete playthrough of Fire Emblem 5 untranslated. That's a little ways off though.

If I remember right, there are actually tens of thousands of Kanji characters, but you only need to know a very small portion (I think it's still over 1,000, though) to be considered literate... fluent, even.  I think most of them are dialect in nature.  Just like in english, no one uses the whole dictionary.

I'm recalling this off the top of my head from 6 years ago, so I'm likely wrong about something here.  I wish I had time to study Japanese again.  I really wanted to learn.

I guess I'm not sure, but it seems like alot of memorization. Or maybe I'm just looking at them like unintelligible blocks of lines and squiggles, when in reality they can be read naturally if I know how, and I just don't know how yet. Kind of like how in English you can read words you don't know and still pronounce them even if you don't know what they mean.

[Frumple]

I guess I'm not sure, but it seems like alot of memorization. Or maybe I'm just looking at them like unintelligible blocks of lines and squiggles, when in reality they can be read naturally if I know how, and I just don't know how yet. Kind of like how in English you can sometimes read words you don't know and still pronounce them even if you don't know what they mean.

FTFY. Some of 'ems traps. Delicious lingual traps. English is pretty close to the dwarf fortress of languages, honestly.

Unless of course you meant pronounce them erroneously. That's really easy and, being fair, is less likely to get you punched in the face in most english speaking countries.

[SalmonGod]

I never pronounce anything wrong.  I just invent my own accent as I go along!

[JoshuaFH]

I guess I'm not sure, but it seems like alot of memorization. Or maybe I'm just looking at them like unintelligible blocks of lines and squiggles, when in reality they can be read naturally if I know how, and I just don't know how yet. Kind of like how in English you can sometimes read words you don't know and still pronounce them even if you don't know what they mean.

FTFY. Some of 'ems traps. Delicious lingual traps. English is pretty close to the dwarf fortress of languages, honestly.

Unless of course you meant pronounce them erroneously. That's really easy and, being fair, is less likely to get you punched in the face in most english speaking countries.

Is that so? I always heard that English was one of the easier languages, despite it's occasional caveat here and there.

[Urist Imiknorris]

We have shittons of words and lots of backwards grammar rules.

Also lots of exceptions to rules.

[jc6036]

And exceptions to those exceptions.

[Flying Dice]

I guess I'm not sure, but it seems like alot of memorization. Or maybe I'm just looking at them like unintelligible blocks of lines and squiggles, when in reality they can be read naturally if I know how, and I just don't know how yet. Kind of like how in English you can sometimes read words you don't know and still pronounce them even if you don't know what they mean.

FTFY. Some of 'ems traps. Delicious lingual traps. English is pretty close to the dwarf fortress of languages, honestly.

Unless of course you meant pronounce them erroneously. That's really easy and, being fair, is less likely to get you punched in the face in most english speaking countries.

Is that so? I always heard that English was one of the easier languages, despite it's occasional caveat here and there.

I mostly tend to hear that it is difficult because of the large number of loan-languages, and because of the huge number of exceptions and idioms that can only really be learned with memorization and use. Not sure if I agree or not, but that's the most common thing I've heard.

[Frumple]

Yeah... general consensus (From language teachers, foreign students, etc.) I've heard is that English is one of the hardest languages to learn as a second language, for reasons already mentioned. Most other languages are relatively sane and logical and the exceptions are, well, exceptions. English is almost as much exception as rule.

[Rose]

Wait... we have rules?

This is news to me.

[Aklyon]

I've heard English be called "the clusterfuck of languages thats makes the rest of them sound more sensible." before.

[Flying Dice]

To quote an old joke, English doesn't just borrow words from other languages, it follows them down dark alleys, knocks them over the head, and goes through their pockets for loose grammar.