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Author Topic: Bay 12 Mafia - Game Over - The Computer's Revenge  (Read 72934 times)

Mr.Person

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #480 on: September 28, 2009, 01:35:50 pm »

I give ya 8 days and you want more?  I suppose I could do a 24 hour day extension if it's agreed upon.

Why are you complaining, you have the easy job.

This is the day that never eeends!
It just goes on and on my frieeend!
They started playing, not knowing what it was!
And now they keep on playing just because
This is the day that never eeends!

About the "trying to make the town go mindlessly with Alexhans" thing, yes, I'll admit that was a bad idea at the time. I just wanted to see what Alexhans was up to. I think the proper way to word it would of been more like "Well, I want to see what Alexhans is up to. What's the worst it could be?" instead it came out more like "Just follow Alexhans, what's the worst it can be?". I'm very aware of what the difference is.

Somebody asked a million WoT's ago what was keeping me from day killing Archangel. My answer is, I want to hear something from Archangel first. I think Archangel is scum due to past lurking, bandwagoning without reasoning, and lack of scumhunting in current posts, mostly the bandwagoning. However, it's possible that Archangel is just an unhelpful townie. So now, I want to hear who Archangel thinks is scum and why. Archangel, I just want you to know, you're very pusausive for some reason, keep talking. Seriously, I was almost tempted to unvote you just from what you've said earlier. Alexhans unvoted you because he's after lurkers not lurking, I'm after you now because I hold bandwagoning as the scummiest thing possible. In addition to who you think is scum, I should also ask, who do you think should be day killed instead of you? Who do you think is town? (Remember to answer Why)

@Everyone: What do you think of Alexhan's "lynch all lurkers" policy? Me, I usually find that scum don't lurk lurk, they active lurk. However, since he seems to just be putting pressure on them until they talk, I can't argue with what Alexhans is doing now. Additionally, if I find nobody scummy in the active players, I'll go along with a lurker lynch.
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Leafsnail

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #481 on: September 28, 2009, 01:38:28 pm »

Considering where I got the idea for the flavour and the looping role from, and endless day is actually sortof appropriate.  Although 32 posts and not a single player death is pretty amazing.
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Mephansteras

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #482 on: September 28, 2009, 01:39:16 pm »

Well, Meph, we've kinda been giving you a free pass too, but oh well, you're here now.

Yes, I want to hear Brothernature, Boski, Pandarsenic, and ideally more from Meph. You guys have been quiet, very very quiet.

@Dakarian:

1. About the mistake in that post, I made it at 3 in the morning, so yeah.

2. Eh, I use a lot of sarcasm and shit all the time. It's reeeeeeal helpful. Personally, I don't have a problem with it, but since you do, and it would make an otherwise clear post quite confusing, I'll try and stop.

3. This only just struck me, but I haven't explained why I think Alexhans is town to me mostly because nobody's asked. No, that's not an acceptable excuse. Hell, I bet you somebody DID ask and I just missed it.

@Meph: WoT's are good things, don't complain :D

@Everybody: I'm thinking we might need a day extension. Stop groaning, I'm serious. We're going to have a day and a half to cram in pretty much an entire day's worth of content. All the tunnel vision has robbed us of information on over half the town.

Yeah, I really wish I'd had more time to go over this game this weekend. It would have made all the discussion more digestible. And while I like Walls of Text in general when you get too many of them at once it starts to get unwieldy from an analysis standpoint.

I'm going to try to spend some time going over a few people's general actions. I want to see if my theory holds up to scrutiny. I'll start with Dakarian, since he's said a lot and muddied up the waters a good bit. I'll have to pay attention to the last few pages a bit more, since he says he stopped pushing for the hammer on Mr.Person recently.

While I'm here, does anyone have any questions for me?
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ToonyMan

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #483 on: September 28, 2009, 02:03:15 pm »

Oh god.  I just scanned through everything.  I was only away for like 14 hours!  I've been thinking, but if the scum team has Dakarian, Sir Josh, and Pandarsenic in it. (I know there's four)  I don't even want to think about it, but I must.  I'll keep that in the back of my head.  Now onto the point.  Pandarsenic said what do I think of this.  I say that Dakarian is right and Alexhans and Mr.Person are scum.  Like I said before.  Pandarsenic also asked if I'm going to do that bet again.  I say YES.  I will take that bet.

Unvote.  Vote Mr.Person.
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Zai

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #484 on: September 28, 2009, 04:32:00 pm »

...TM, you're either brilliant or you're stupid when it comes to this bet. We'll see, I guess.

Anyways. I've got the summary of a few pages done. Here:

First full page: Dakarian and Pandar both play up Alexhans's suspicion of Web. Cheeetar says he'd protect Pandar with the JanetFourEyes role. Alex says it's suspicious for other people to not give their extra role info out, but withholds his. M.P says he has a feeling Web is getting bussed but says that that's ridiculous, and that Alex is going after him for no reason, but joins the bandwagon anyway because he wants to see what Web says.

Second full page: Dakarian joins the fight, going after Alex, saying he became panicky as soon as Web voted him. Dakarian also says he'll share  his role if Alex shares his first. Alex refuses, pretty much saying that everything Dakarian said was wrong. M.P jumps in with the "Just go along with Alex; what's the worst that could happen?" bit. Alex then proceeds to hammer Web, who turns up as townie ArchCherub. Alex says that's what you get for being scummy. M.P is rather nonchalant about this. Alex confirms that he's Alex-chan. He wanted to use his power early so it wouldn't be suspicious in LYLO; says he was afraid the wagon on Web would go down so he made a rushed decision. Alex says he's sorry to the dead Web and that his role wasn't very useful anyway. M.P tries to get Pandar to talk about this by voting for him; says he thinks Alex is town. Diakron roleclaims as LeafSlug and shares his 2nd known role; asks Alex why he hammered Web and who he would want as scumbuddies. TM votes Alex for killing Web before he could speak and FoS's M.P for siding with Alex. Boksi does the same as TM. M.P says he was trying to get Alex night-killed. Diakron says he's not sure whether or not to bandwagon vote for Alex. Alex says he killed Web because he wasn't helping and wasn't acting like himself. He insults TM for voting for him. Says he couldn't come to any conclusion other than that Web was scum. Alex is angry at Boksi for suddenly appearing and just bandwagoning. Says the bandwagon on him is for all of the people who don't know how to really play. He doesn't want people to do the "usual" of lynching all the active townies, leaving the game to scum and townies who lurk or flame. Says hanging onto his hammer is what scum would do. Diakron asks again who Alex thinks would be the best scum-mates. Says hammer was uncalled for, and points out Archangel is lurking. Alex says to check Web's other games; his play this game was very different. Says Dakarian's flip added to his suspicions of both Web and Dakarian. Alex answer the scumteam question from Diakron. Alex points out opportunism is a terrible and overused thing in Bay12 Mafia games. Shares his known role of LeafSlug (already known role of Diakron). M.P says he wouldn't dislike TM as a scumbuddy. Cheeetar begins his parade of saying Pandar lied about the Archcherub role. Both Pandar and M.P point out Pandar did not lie. RedWarrior0 jumps in randomly saying how sure he is that Josh is scum. To TM's question of "Why?" RW0 responds that he has a feeling that Random.org never lies. I (Zai) come in FoSing M.P because of him saying that we should go with Alex. I lightly FoS Alex for killing a townie, saying that I could empathize. I also FoS Cheeetar for his lackluster reasons for voting Pandar. Diakron says that it's bad that RW0 hasn't 'advanced past the RVS'. Says the only scummy person so far was Pandar, but keeps his vote on Archangel, thinking he's Taitheproficient. M.P says that it's only Day 1, so random voting is still okay. Brothernature shows up, saying everybody posts a lot and that he'll read and post in a bit, but then edits his post saying that he's off to play his X-Box. Dakarian says he sees a panicky townie that is not helping the town in Alex, not actual scum. Follows through on his promise of sharing his known role after Alex shares his, telling us about LoonyMan, who can cause a double lynch if he's lynched. Josh says he's not sure if Alex is scum or not, as he's usually jittery, town or not. Wants Brothernature to talk, and says Pandar doesn't seem scummy to him. Cheeetar continues his "Pandar is lying!" parade. Archangel comes forward, saying that he's been travelling. He unvotes Dakarian because he posted and didn't seem suspicious to him. Pandar and Cheeetar bicker. M.P says Cheeetar makes a good point and votes Pandar. Alex counters Cheeetar's points againt Pandar. Says RVS is definitely over, as there is enough to provoke discussion now. Alex says he didn't panic with Web; he was just really pissed. Says it wasn't a random kill; he was certain at the time that Web was scum. Says he made a mistake that he has to deal with. Wants to lynch lurkers: Archangel, RW0, Boksi, brothernature, and Meph.

Third full page (FINALLY!): M.P changes his story to random voting should be frowned on, as we want opinions for discussion, but says it might give more info, so random voting isn't really a bad thing. Josh roleclaims Cobrarsenic, claiming to have broken the game and to be able to revive Web, giving us a confirmed townie. Cheeetar jumps on immediately. Alex asks if he checked it with the mod. Josh responds yes, and that there is no confusion over it; neither he nor Web will be dead. Dakarian wants validation that that's how his role works from whoever has Cobrarsenic as their known role. Alexhans joins immediately. Meph says he also wants validation, and that he's keeping his vote on Boksi until then. Alex says he's had a frenzy month, and that's why he looks anxious. M.P joins Josh's plan and requests the day be shortened. Dakarian votes M.P for being over eager to "push this gamble." Alex also doesn't like the idea of a day shortening, because some people still hadn't posted content. M.P says there's no point, as we know what's gonna happen if Josh is lying or not, and is suspicious of Dakarian. Meph thinks Josh might have a role bad for lynching. Dakarian says again that validation would be good. Josh says M.P may be trying to flip suspicion from M.P back to Dakarian. TM votes josh. M.P says we can just see what'll happen instead of running in circles over 'what if's. Meph asks what the harm in waiting for confirmation is. He's suspicious of M.P for not wanting to keep people talking. Says Josh will lie and manipulate everyone to win. Josh notes M.P's unnecessary hostility. M.P says that there couldn't possibly be a role that would make Josh win Day 1. Meph says that Alex and brothernature still haven't shared known roles, and wants to hear from BN. Alex says he already shared his role and that Meph needs to pay more attention. He's curious about the bookadict role and says he'll "check it later." Meph apologizes for missing that. BN shows up, saying that his internet was down, but confirms Josh's role. "Knowing that Josh is telling the truth," Meph votes Josh. Dakarian also votes Josh, and says that we can make good use of the day to debate more, and that he's hoping to do "that scan he so needs to do". Diakron votes Josh, asking if he can just bandwagon on it (jokingly, I'm pretty sure), and saying that he's for scumhunting but is "lacking in this department". Meph says Alex and Josh are acting pretty town. He FoSs M.p for being not sure that he "has our best interest at heart." He FoSs BN and Boksi for lurking. M.P asks what Meph means by "doesn't have the best interests of the town at heart" (which, by the way, is not what Meph said; Meph said our interest). Dakarian says M.P has been making scumhunting different, and points out his inconsistency over the random voting subject. I (Zai) ask why M.P is so sure that Alex is town, and FoS M.P. I ask a question about if Drakonian and Dracron are automatically on the same side. I decide that more attention needs to be paid to lurkers, so I vote boksi instead of needlessly adding another vote on Josh. Meph aks M.P when he's going to start hunting scum instead of blocking everyone else's attempts at doing so. M.P says he thinks Alex is town, but isn't sure, and that it's best if Alex uses his power, even if he's scum, before we get to LYLO. He claims I was rolefishing. I respond that I clearly wasn't asking what his role was, I had just been asking about roles, whether or not he has them. Dakarian addresses M.P's comments about random voting, and then says that M.P is question dodging, which is VERY scummy. M.P says that he has no comment, as Dakarian is really attacking him for giving his opinion. Dakarian says that M.P is defending the accused whenever someone calls them out on bad statement. He says M.P is trying VERY HARD to confuse, harass, and control the town, and says that M.P is scum, and that when the day resets, he will be lynched. BN pops in and suggest Alex hammer-kill M.P when the day resets. Dakarian suggests that Alex should wait until the town gives input to hammer M.P. M.P says trying to control the town is a valid strategy if he's right. he says Dakarian has strawman arguments and says again that he wants Alex nightkilled, to skip over all the WIFOM surrounding him. Diakron pops in and says that he's going to vote M.P on the second Day 1 (Day 1.5, if you please). M.P says he's not allowed to bandwagon like that and demands reasons from Diakron. Diakron says that M.P has just given another attempt to derail with an implied threat. Dakarian requests people to look over the situation and to point out anything out of place. Diakron says he "forgot" to answer M.P. He says that his reason is that M.P is protecting Alex, and is acting like Alex has got his back. M.P FoSs Diakron for attempting to derail so he wouldn't have to answer, and then says in a "FAKEDIT" that Diakron's reason is terrible. Diakron then says that he's too tired and will answer M.P when he gets up.

...I think I might be noting too much. It's taking longer than I thought. Like...an hour a page. I don't have that much time; not today at least.
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ToonyMan

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #485 on: September 28, 2009, 04:41:20 pm »

Large posts are cool and all, but make sure to add a few bullets at the end explaining the highlights.
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Pandarsenic

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #486 on: September 28, 2009, 04:44:28 pm »

Unvote, vote Mr.Person.

Toony, I hope you know what you're doing.

Signing off for class now.

Fake-edit: Zai, don't forget where everyone claims I was activelurking when I haven't been.
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Mephansteras

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #487 on: September 28, 2009, 04:49:51 pm »

An hour a page? Honestly, Zai, I don't think it's worth it. Spending over 30 hours to sum up the first day of a mafia games seems unhealthy. Especially since it's still super-dense and hard to read.

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Boksi

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #488 on: September 28, 2009, 04:50:18 pm »

Eh, I've been trying to think of something to say for a while now but I realized I don't have anything worthwhile to say. I'll be trying to follow these massive WOTs, and while it is doable with my degree of reading comprehension I really want to say that I don't find WOTs to be such a good thing. Especially when WOTs start quoting WOTs in their entireties.

Anyway, I might have more things to say more when something concrete has happened. As in actual events, like webadict getting hammered. I still suspect Person enough to maintain my vote on him, mostly because his flip will really influence my reasoning.

So, status quo for me.

FAKE-EDIT: OH GOD ZAI, PARAGRAPHS, PARAGRAPHS. I CAN BARELY READ THAT!
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Zai

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #489 on: September 28, 2009, 04:56:07 pm »

FAKE-EDIT: OH GOD ZAI, PARAGRAPHS, PARAGRAPHS. I CAN BARELY READ THAT!

Yeah...I know. They weren't originally supposed to be that long, so I was going to just have each page lumped together. And then they got that long. And I just left 'em like that. I'll try to organize them more.
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Mr.Person

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #490 on: September 28, 2009, 05:06:08 pm »

Eh, I've been trying to think of something to say for a while now but I realized I don't have anything worthwhile to say. I'll be trying to follow these massive WOTs, and while it is doable with my degree of reading comprehension I really want to say that I don't find WOTs to be such a good thing. Especially when WOTs start quoting WOTs in their entireties.

Anyway, I might have more things to say more when something concrete has happened. As in actual events, like webadict getting hammered. I still suspect Person enough to maintain my vote on him, mostly because his flip will really influence my reasoning.

So, status quo for me.

FAKE-EDIT: OH GOD ZAI, PARAGRAPHS, PARAGRAPHS. I CAN BARELY READ THAT!

Why do you find WoT's to be bad? If you don't like reading and trying to deduce sides based on what you've read, mafia might not be the game for you, no offense meant or anything.

WoT's are literal mountains of info. I salute everybody who's posted a WoT so far.
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Cheeetar

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #491 on: September 28, 2009, 05:28:16 pm »

Why hello Cheeetar.   ;D

You seemed to have missed a few of those questions Alex threw at you.  Mind answering them? I'll rephrase

1)If Mr. Person flipped town, why would Panda, Dakarian, and Josh be scum?  I hope you aren't just using "They went after Mr. Person" after all.

Do you think all lurkers would be town and thus should not be killed?

Do you feel that Dakarian is not genuinely scumhunting?

For that matter, why would Josh evoke his power if he was scum? Note that no one knew the power existed, nevermind that he had it, before he spoke up.



Please ignore Alex and Person for a moment and answer those questions.
I honestly can't remember at the moment, and I don't have much time free, but I should be able to answer those questions in about 5 or 6 hours.
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Mephansteras

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #492 on: September 28, 2009, 06:38:47 pm »

Ok, I've started to go through and do vote records. Just finished Day 1, Take 1

   Day 1.0
Alexhans:    Boksi, webadict, chaoticjosh
Archangel:    Dakarian, unvote
Boksi:   Alexhans
brothernature:   webadict
chaoticjosh:   Cheeetar, unvote, chaoticjosh
Cheeetar:   Pandarsenic, chaoticjosh
dakarian:   Archangel, webadict, Alexhans, Mr.Person, chaoticjosh
Diakron:   chaoticjosh
RedWarrior0:   chaoticjosh
Mephansteras:   Boksi, chaoticjosh
Mr.Person:   Alexhans, webadict, Pandarsenic, unvote, Pandarsenic, chaoticjosh
Pandarsenic:   chaoticjosh
ToonyMan:   brothernature, Alexhans, chaoticjosh
webadict:   Alexhans
Zaithemaster:   dakarian, Boksi

Note: An 'unvote' means that the person had a gap in between voting for one person, unvoting, and then revoting. Te only exception to that is Mr.Person who decided to vote Panda, then later unvote him and revote him immediately.

Not much to go on here, of course. Most of it revolved around Alex's hammer of webadict and then shifted to Josh's power.

Most interesting things:
  -dakarian bounced his vote around a lot. I think he's continued to do this, but I'll find out when I do Day 1, Take 2
  -Only 4 people had voted for webadict before he got hammered. brothernature, dakarian, Alex, and Mr.Person. dakarian unvoted before the actual hammer. While I suppose it's possible that our scum team is those four (and playing a giant in-fight to distract us all), I find that rather unlikely. Probably just a coincidence, but there it is.
  -Zaithemaster never voted for chaoticjosh. Rather, he chose to vote for Boksi instead. (This was after Josh's plan was set out and his power confirmed) Any particular reason for this, Zai?

Ok, like I said, not much to go on there. But it's useful to have and may help us more later on.

As soon as I get a chance, I'll do Day 1 Take 2
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webadict

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #493 on: September 28, 2009, 06:54:22 pm »

Holy crap.

Pandarsenic is scum.
Mephansteras is likely scum.
Cheeetar is probably scum.

dakarian is likely town.
Mr.Person is likely town.
Alexhans is likely town.
Zaithemaster is town.
webadict is the towniest.

ToonyMan is... probably town.

chaoticjosh is meh.
Diakron is meh.

RedWarrior0 is lurking.
Archangel is lurking.
Boksi is lurking.
brothernature is lurking.


Other than that... I dunno. I would enjoy Archangel being dead. Because he needs to be more active.

Oh, and Day Extension.

With a list of lurkers that big... it's just stupid.
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Mephansteras

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Re: Bay 12 Mafia - Day 1 - The Game Begins
« Reply #494 on: September 28, 2009, 07:02:21 pm »

Could you actually take the time to explain some of that to us, web?
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