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[Arnos]

How about when dwarves have some free time on their hands they get the best free armor and weapons available and train.  It would be nice if skilled dwarves always carried around a weapon and wore at least light armor.

[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

There was a thread for having dwarves carry daggers or small-arms a while back. I could see wearing some very light armor (i.e.; leather caps, boots) to go along with this.

Having them train on their off-time automatically makes no sense to me though. Especially given the deadly nature of sparring, I can't imagine dwarves regularly deciding to stab at each others faces in their off-time, rather than lounge with some ale by a waterfall and some statues.

Note: Especially wouldn't want your superstrong untrained (militarily) dwarves choosing to spar with random civilians. Imagine: Zas Berzon, legendary miner + other assorted skills, vs. Iden Stigilmebil, dabbling grower, pregnant peasant.   :eek:

[Tamren]

One idea i had awile back was to get every single dwarf in the fortress to carry a belt knife. This would be mostly used for eating, but in a pinch they can fight with it. Dwarves with proper training would carry a dagger instead, a bit more dangrous.

Those nobles such as the order of the sword, order of the hammer ect would train your dwarves with little to no risk. So you would have no losses from training.

The problem is after a certain point there is nothing left to learn without experiencing real combat and real danger, so from then on all training would be done with sharp weapons and full armour.

We could really use such a system because it is currently impossible to train dwarves with high stats without killing or mangling the people they spar with -_-

[slMagnvox]

Ok, this is even more retarded than the other.  I will stop replying to Arnos' posts until he's actually played the game.

Off duty time?  Weapons and Armor?  Hello?  Sparring?  McFly?

There should never be no risk training.  Swords and spears, its dangerous shit.  The bit about being impossible to train is bunk.  Extreme strength is the only stat you have to be careful with.

EDIT: An afterthought.  Arnos, DF does have a very steep learning curve.  Try asking questions in the Gameplay forum or studying the wiki.  Don't just vent your frustration into the Suggestions forum.  It is not meant for that.

[ June 12, 2007: Message edited by: slMagnvox ]

[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

Well, weak weapons, strong armor, and make sure they spar with very tough dwarves. Even then it's not fool-proof.

But I don't think it should be. If IRL you had 2 untrained people sparring with real weapons and no armor, and one was substantially more physically fit, it'd be dangerous. Violent sports see numerous off-season training injuries, that's amongst already trained athletes, with armor, minus weaponry, plus modern medicine.

Tamren, for your Order of the _____ idea, I'd think current nobles  need to be fixed before  adding more. Maybe even fix pathing issues so people could have more dwarves before slowdown since, as is, once the nobles start coming + fortress\royal guard, it is possible  that you have no control over 1 in 4 dwarves -no need to increase that ratio I think. Otherwise sure, and I think the idea of an experienced trainer makes a lot of sense. Even with sparring as is, it's the untrained that injure each other a lot. Your ___ Lords are careful enough not to decapitate every poor recruit they spar with. (Usually.)

Also I don't think Legendary craftsmen should really be fighters. The incentive to make them fight is obvious, but that's partially cause they're so easy to get to that skill. I imagine being legendary would be closer to a life-long dedication to a trade\art and an exceptional talent at it. The idea of multiple-legendary skills ought to be very rare exceptions. How many people would you cite throughout history that've been worthy of being called "legendary" in multiple professions, let alone one.

[Tamren]

Thats true, one thing crafstmen have to be very careful about is damaging the tools they have, namely hands.

The problem with using weak training weapons is that dwarves do not understand quality and material.

Silver swords are good for training but when it comes time to get your soldiers to switch them out for steel weapons a nightmare ensues.

The lack of proper trainers really bites as well.

[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

Switching out weapons of quality will be adressed in the future I imagine. Even when it is, my problem here is I can't picture every single dwarf in the colony deciding to spar regularly in their free time.

Although if left in the 'o' menu as a choice, fine, but otherwise I'd hate to see this hard-coded in the game.

[Heliopios]

quote:Originally posted by slMagnvox:
<STRONG>Hello?</STRONG>

Hello.

[AlStar]

quote:Originally posted by Funkadelic Jive Turkey:
<STRONG>... Tamren, for your Order of the _____ idea, I'd think current nobles  need to be fixed before  adding more. ...</STRONG>

Those nobles already exist, he's just giving them a job (they currently (afaik) don't do anything.)

[Arnos]

slMagnvox: I never said it was impossible to train safely, I'm just suggesting that non-military dwarves should carry around weapons and know how to use them at least a little in the dangerous world they live in.  I do admit though that I should have been more clear that I was talking about non-military dwarves.

[ June 12, 2007: Message edited by: Arnos ]

[ June 12, 2007: Message edited by: Arnos ]

[Retro42]

Bah!!

If a dwarf can't strangle a Ratman with his/her bare hands WHILE carry a child AND a stack of goods they don't deserve to live in my fort.

On a training note:  The only thing missing from an efficient barracks is blood gutters(gunnels?) to keep it clean after all the sparring.

Honestly though, an AI option for military dwarves to upgrade equipment and post-economy civvies to buy weapons would be nice.

Retro

Retro

[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

Oh, I've never gotten those nobles...if they're already in, damn right! Give 'em work!

I've so far been good at restraining myself from killing nobles, but they're really tempting the proleteriat revolution...

Edit in response to Retro42:

I didn't see your post when I posted. Yeh, civilians wanting to buy weapons would be cool. Along with upgrade we'd need a downgrade option for sparring. Use seperate ones for weapons and armor.

[ June 12, 2007: Message edited by: Funkadelic Jive Turkey ]

[4bh0r53n]

quote: On a training note: The only thing missing from an efficient barracks is blood gutters(gunnels?) to keep it clean after all the sparring.

why do that, implement Tamrens sawdust idea and use that to mop it up.

[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

Or cloth + wood + bucket = mop and cleaners actually get to work more often.

[Retro42]

Hehe, sawdust would be fun just for the added "Piss off the Elves" factor.  Picture an elven diplomat touring the fort and walking by your barracks..... Wooden sparring weapons, Wooden Shields, Leather Armor, sawdust to soak up the blood....  Elf horror story!

Retro