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[Neonivek]

Since even fortress mode isn't going to be bound to a single place in the future, I don't think the wizard will either.

Yes but there is a fundemental difference between a powerful magical adventurer in adventurer mode and a Wizard in Wizard mode.

A wizard doesn't just abandon his tower and explore the world. It is a fundemental aspect and likely a key to the Wizard's power.

[Little Pandemonium]

Hm, how about this

Sorcerer: They are the entity of magic itself. Not just one of those guys that backs up the team and shoots fireballs, but run something more like a dwarven outpost and construct your own multilevel tower or other such dwelling. This could include adventure style elements where your wizard is engaged in various activities, as well as larger scale army battles and so on. Randomized creatures could also be introduced as you create your minions, and they should be able to breed and expand outward, perhaps becoming a playable race in either adventure or civilization modes.

Basically, this means that the wizard or magic wielders is not a dwarf but a new entity, a unique race

[Dakk]

Its likely all races (well, maybe not kobolds) will have wizards, since there are bloats about letting you control different races, IE build your own goblin keep/elven retreat/human city/kobold cave, etc. Though that will only happen after DF 1.0 is out, so yea, probably not any time soon.
So yea, wizards aren't a new race, but come from the already existing races, they're just so powerful that they're considered a different entity entirely.

The placeholder wizards are sort of a different race altogheder though, well, they're actualy creatures, but thats just an easter egg put there to make wizards appear in engravings from time to time, they don't even spawn in-game unless you do some minor modding, which will cause them to show in legends mode since they can actualy shoot fireballs.

[Granite26]

Since even fortress mode isn't going to be bound to a single place in the future, I don't think the wizard will either.

Yes but there is a fundemental difference between a powerful magical adventurer in adventurer mode and a Wizard in Wizard mode.

A wizard doesn't just abandon his tower and explore the world. It is a fundemental aspect and likely a key to the Wizard's power.

I think Tolkien's wizards are the touchstone here.  Human but not really human, powerful, but not really in a tangible way.

[Draco18s]

I meant to type out a short thought on that whatever magic ends up being, it needs to be rules based.  There  has to be an understanding of why magic works the way it does, or at least allow the freedom to use the rules to do something different.  But I ended up writing more of a rant on existing systems and their basic rules.

Spoiler: "Rant on magic systems" (click to show/hide)

Just to put in my 3 cents, whatever it is that you come up with with magic, it has to have rules, just like everything else, especially if you let the player "create new spells" (there's an old PS game out there that allowed you to do that by writing words--it's pretty good, and it's easy to use).  You can't let people go and do anything willy nilly, "Oh, magic did it" is a terrible excuse (except for breeding a gibbering mouther with a dragon, because that's just funny (reference to World's Largest Dungeon)).

One example of a rule-based magic system, is that you can't do anything with magic that you couldn't otherwise do, and it takes the same effort to do (I'm referencing Eragon--as terrible of a book as it was), you just didn't need the tools.

Another example is that you need to know the True Name of an object or an effect before you can use it (EarthSea) and that every action has a reaction: causing rain here, now causes a drought somewhere else.  Mages end up being all knowing and all powerful, but rarely act.

A less rule based system allows you to "do anything" provided you know the spell (if you don't have it, you can research it or even make it yourself), but that casting spells is painful and requires no action other than concentration on the target and effect.  And overcasting and pushing your limits on what you can do causes sever injury (rough idea of the magic of ShadowRun).

Even less rule based is having sources and intentions, "I want to hurt it with fire" is an Elemental + Agony "spell."  But even magic of this kind can have limits: it takes time to cast, during which the caster can't move from where they're standing, and must make arcane gestures, and casting burns through the user's stamina (this type of wielding is used in Alpha Omega (very new table top RPG), and shares some similarities to the World of Darkness system).  AO's magic system has a severe downside to out-of-combat buffing (which is almost free and can last hours right out of char gen) is that once you enter combat, the magic is snuffed out due to the surge of adrenaline, you'd have to recast it as a combat spell (much much shorter duration for the same effect) if you want to make it stick around.

One of the worst systems is the D&D system (at least for Wizards), whereby you have only so many of each spell you can cast each day (I'm sorry, you're a first level wizard and you just cast your only combat spell!) and there's no "make your own spell."  Arg, I need "fireball" but that does electric damage!  No, sorry, you either need to use a metamagic and raise the spell level or use this pre-written spell which is the same thing, only does half the damage.  There are no rules to how magic works, it's just a list of "this stuff does work, we don't know why."

[Little Pandemonium]

Well, it has been covered in the embodiment of spell segment concept though [invoke]
Or perhaps there's something I miss?

[Neonivek]

Well, it has been covered in the embodiment of spell segment concept though [invoke]
Or perhaps there's something I miss?

Well you do need something below Spell.

Being Innate and Channel

Innate is natural magic while channel is magic performed through concentration and natural movements.

In otherwords Channel adds onto a mundane skill while Innate is simple magical powers evoked naturally through a creature (A Unicorn doesn't need to cast spells to purify water) that doesn't rely on skill to happen.

[Little Pandemonium]

Hmm, channel seems so similar to ritual because the attributes of waiting or concentrating when compared to prayer or dance or hand movement (they don't affect the magic itself, they only act as a preparation of the magic)

While innate like unicorn seems so similar to spell, as they can cast magic with little restrictions

I still need opinions in the matter

[Neonivek]

Channel's difference with ritual is that it is just doing the action and pulling magic through it rather then doing anything extra. It is punching someone and pushing magic through the fist, it isn't chanting magic words, doing a dance, then punching someone. It is raw magic channeled through the body.

(which yes it is a ritual but if we apply it to that then they are all rituals and the distinction is pointless)

Innate's difference to Spell is that it is innate. As your description said "it is a skill similar to blaw". It is like a Dragon's breath if done by magic, certainly it could be enhanced by a skill but it isn't required for its execution.

[Little Pandemonium]

I see
Based on my understanding it looks like this
Spell - Cast predefined magic
Channel - Cast magic that are being stored in the caster body
Innate - Magic that are being used as a common action by the caster like dragon fire breath is equal to dwarf taking a breath
Ritual - Cast predefine or redefined magic with actions and preparations required
Invoke - Create or combine magic with some law then cast it

I'm still a little bit confused though

[Dakk]

Since even fortress mode isn't going to be bound to a single place in the future, I don't think the wizard will either.

Yes but there is a fundemental difference between a powerful magical adventurer in adventurer mode and a Wizard in Wizard mode.

A wizard doesn't just abandon his tower and explore the world. It is a fundemental aspect and likely a key to the Wizard's power.

I think Tolkien's wizards are the touchstone here.  Human but not really human, powerful, but not really in a tangible way.

I was thinking about spheres. Wizards could harness magic from the environment in some way, so maybe suddenly a wizard would go Oh my Armok! I suck at fire magic, i should really go to that fire forest with the fire elk and firey stuff to advance my studies! or something like that. Which brings up an interesting subject: Wizards could affect spheres, or even be the cause of them.
Its not difficult to imagine an evil area which has become evil due to some necromancer's experiments there back then in year 102 when Urist Uristurist was engraving his first cheese.

[Little Pandemonium]

Are you taling about the magic sources?

Perhaps what you mean has been covered in The Source of Mana Segments : Natural Animism

Hmm, the necromancer stuff might fit in the Magical Environment segments
Perhaps it will be some kind of a heritage
Certain magic will exist and still give the effect of it properties to the surroundings

[Granite26]

Dakk:  Well students of magic, or magic users, sure, that sounds cool.

Wizards are more like the embodyment of a sphere and it's powers.

Edit:
Actually, that's badass.... maybe not for DF, but still:  Gods/Wizards/Whatever not as embodyments of spheres, but as sources.  The world is as it is because these beings exist.  People die because DEATH exists.  If death were to leave the universe, death would no longer be.

The world is the way it is because of the interplay of these forces.  Without NATURE, there'd still be PLANTS and ANIMALS and whatnot, but they'd be missing that cohesive whole that bound them into a single whole.

[Deimos56]

Perhaps some varieties of wizard (Read: Those who use magical spheres that are based on an Alignment [Good, Evil], a form of change [Decay, Corruption, Life, Death], or other, similar factors) should gradually change the land surrounding their Tower/Demesne/Territory.
For example, Urist McGodlyWizz, a master wizard tied to the Spheres of Wealth, Change, and Greed, might gradually change the stone below his tower to be filled with valuable minerals simply with his presence. Perhaps due to the influence of the Greed Sphere, though, he becomes increasingly paranoid, to the point where he assumes any random person who he doesn't control directly to be an enemy.
Meanwhile, deep in the middle of a twisted, evil swamp, there might be a small patch of solid ground and life created by the influence of an elven hermit who was once a great wizard who focused on Life and Earth Spheres.

Perhaps wizards could retire (like the above hermit) and, maybe, could be persuaded to come out of retirement by an adventurer.

In the above example, such a persuasive adventurer might indirectly lead to the obliteration of the swamp altogether and, if people then moved in to aid the recently-unretired wizard, a whole new civilization could form eventually.

A powerful necromancer who dedicates himself to evil and death might cause the opposite; trees becoming dead looking and, in extreme cases, gaining a malevolent sort of sentience, the dead- buried or otherwise- rising to serve him, and a general feeling of pure terror and dread.

Of course, depending on the wizard, they might choose to intentionally avoiding such things, either to keep a lower profile (Nothing says 'Oh look a pyromancer' like a huge swath of land that's partially turned to lava and is dotted by volcanoes.) or simply out of some desire for the area to remain as it is. Or something.

As for the alignments I brought up, there will most likely still be spheres related to them- areas that encourage malice or benevolence in their inhabitants, gods who demand such behavior from their followers, wizards who... well, you get the idea, right?
Maybe a somewhat kinder necromancer than the above example might instead decide to move into a town (with their permission- no matter what way you cut it, skeletal laborers and guards would put many people off the idea of letting him in.) and raise their dead as guardians to defend them.

Just my two copper coins...
Well, one copper coin. I have far too many conflicting ideas.

[dragnar]

The magical system I would prefer would be rule based, but with few restrictions.
Adventure mode characters would wield the same power as in wizard mode, the difference being that adventures don't really know what they are doing, so they use spell sort of like mnemonics. Wizards have studied the working of magic for centuries and understand it perfectly, they do not need the handicap of spells.

It's essentially the same as the difference between speaking a language fluently and using a dictionary to translate- same tools, vastly differentlevels of control.