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[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

I've just been thinking it should take dwarves longer to do many things. Mainly these things are: Mining, Wood-cutting, most (but not all) creation skills (furniture, crafts, etc.), and most importantly their skills!

I don't know, perhaps it's a bad idea due to time and patience constraints, but I'd like to see a major slow-down in a lot of these. It just seems silly to me that some skills (especially miner and engraver) can go from nothing to legendary in a little over a year, and likewise your fortress goes from being bumblef*ck nowhere to the center of the universe in roughly 3 or 4.

As a side note, this might latently make crafts more valuable to the player by making it harder to produce enough to buy out a caravan. As is, assuming everybody else shares my exp., any well-developed fortress could stop producing crafts alltogether and buy out the next couple of human caravans with rock mugs alone before they need to move on to selling their toy hammers.

Anyways, lemme know what y'all think. Good? Bad? Possible?

[Core Xii]

I concur to an extent. I'm especially worried that when sappers are added, they tunnel through my walls in a matter of seconds.

[TotalPigeon]

I've thought about this a few times, and I have to agree. I kind of feel like I'm playing arcade mode of dwarves, when I want to play original.

Basically, a slower game in terms of skill growth, especially mining. Legendary workers also need nerfing somewhat, they're ridiculously fast. And immigration should be slower.

[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

Yay, TotalPigeon!

I'd begun to think people had thought this too dumb to even comment on. Immigration I didn't mention but definitely, my last fort has grown from 7 to just over a 100 in 3 1\2 years. In rl terms this isn't so crazy, but considering that in-game that currently well exceeds the population of most human capitols, it's kinda ridiculous. (Much more so for those that like to imagine their fort as remote or 'backwoods')

The only city I can think of that, proportionally, was established and prospered that fast is St. Petersburg. But it had some 'encouragement'.

[Capntastic]

I'm sure that this will all be tuned up when skills and immigration and all these other things are worked on.  

As for fending off attackers, I think that should require more focus than it does presently.

[Grek]

I would like slower dwarfs but faster time.

[axus]

Sort of agree, but I like the current pace of the game.  

The amount of time for each season feels about right after many plays.  Caravans come at a good interval.  Most dwarves take a long time to be legendary, its the miners, engravers, and masons that do it quickly.  And that's because we set one dwarf to do those, instead of lots, and they are things dwarves are naturally good at.

A way to resolve this is have the skillup rate for each profession be configurable, have the overland travel rate for caravan, immigrants, and armies be configurable.

[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

No, more skills than just miner\engravers. And I'm not really addressing time-disparity (Dwarves eating 2x per season or whatever, as opposed to adventurers who need to eat roughly once a day), but the rate of crafts production seems super-whacked out, especially with stone crafts, or so it seems to me. Farming seems about right but maybe a little slower skill gain. The fine details need to be worked out, but it's silly that by year 1055 in my fortress I've 5 Legendary Engravers, a Legendary Miner, and others well on their way. This is with only 1 successful non-possession mood. By year 10 I'll probably have champions and legendary stonecrafter\carpenters, I expect a legendary mason within the next 2. These are not dwarfs that are assigned to just 1 task either. Now, if I loosely dedicate myself to a trade for 10 years, I doubt I'd be "Legendary". I would suggest 10 years w\ of constant effort, minimum, and an artifact boost that is huge but not quite so superpower-ish as now.

IRL, 10 years of constant effort probably still won't make for legendary, but making it to slow might ruin gameplay.

[FallenHero]

I don't mind the actually *pace* of the game as much as I do immigration. I tend to just get swamped with dwarves (having 15+ come each round). Of course, that could be fixed with only having dwarves come once a year.

[Svirfneblim]

I also think that making crafts can generate too much wealth too fast.
Buying out a caravan is indeed to easy.

As for immigrants, it's not really so bad, though.

[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

I don't have a problem dealing with immigrants, but it's kinda silly how your fort pop. explodes. It should take a little bit longer, I think, to have a 150 dwarf fort. (Considering next to nobody exceeds 200, I count 150+ as giant forts)

[axus]

I like having lot of immigrants, but it is unrealistic how quickly they come.  I figure you'd toil away in obscurity for many years before your fame was worldwide.  That could be changed by advertising, paying signing bonuses, etc.  Of course exporting gold, iron, or masterpiece items would bring a lot of dwarves to your fort.

Perhaps the upper end of skills could be lengthened, and what is considered legendary changed to something even better.  I think there are plenty of examples of people who become masters at a younger age, usually they started when they were children though.  

As for buying out the caravan, the value of things could be changed.  Or at least, they could have limits to the amount of things they demand.  As your supply grows, the demand is met and prices drop.

[Funkadelic Jive Turkey]

quote:Originally posted by axus:
<STRONG>I think there are plenty of examples of people who become masters at a younger age, usually they started when they were children though. </STRONG>

Yes, I wasn't referring so much to relative age, but years of dedication. Also, somebody becoming a master in youth is very rare, you and I can think of examples aplenty because next to everybody who does is a historical\cultural icon. 99.9 (add a lot of decimals)% of the population cannot completely master, to the point of being a legend, a trade or art in a few years, if at all. Add even more decimals if you are referring to youth.

Note: An exception is to be made for athletes, and other proffessions that require one to be in prime physical condition, as those have a higher percentage of young adult "masters". Also I don't think DF needs to reflect RL exactly, but 2 years = Legend seems a bit too fast of a development.

[Fieari]

I agree (only) with the fact that "Legendary"... quite frankly isn't.  I would suggest that legendary be made slightly harder to get normally, and not come automatically from making an artifact.  Instead, an artifact should grant experience based both on the rarity and quantity of items requested.