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[BishopX]

That's true, but I still think there are better uses for ten points than that. I've never seen a stubber do much any damage, and I generally use fast vehicles or something like the leman russ, that has a sort of variant on that, in that it can fire normally if it moves at combat speed, but has to roll a d6 to determine its cruising speed. It might be something to jam onto a chimera, so it gets a little more bite while still moving its passengers where you want them, but I can't see it being useful for something like a leman russ or hellhound.

Quick note, The russ can't fire all of it's weapons at combat speed, it can fire it's turret plus whatever it would normally be able to fire, even if the turret is ordinance.

[Burnt Pies]

Having played a lot of Necromunda, I have a healthy fear of Stubbers. They're not as nasty as Heavy Bolters, but they're getting there.

[Sir Pseudonymous]

That's true, but I still think there are better uses for ten points than that. I've never seen a stubber do much any damage, and I generally use fast vehicles or something like the leman russ, that has a sort of variant on that, in that it can fire normally if it moves at combat speed, but has to roll a d6 to determine its cruising speed. It might be something to jam onto a chimera, so it gets a little more bite while still moving its passengers where you want them, but I can't see it being useful for something like a leman russ or hellhound.

Quick note, The russ can't fire all of it's weapons at combat speed, it can fire it's turret plus whatever it would normally be able to fire, even if the turret is ordinance.

"A Leman Russ that moved at combat speed or remained stationary can fire its turret weapon in addition to any other weapons it's usually allowed to fire (even if the turret weapon is ordnance!)"
That's an extremely awkward wording to say "yeah, ignore those normal rules about how ordnance weapons are fired", especially since the ordnance part is written as though it was an afterthought, rather than the central point. The errata doesn't mention it, either, and given the obvious implications of that passage, and how important they are, one would expect it to be clarified, especially were it meant to have the more restrictive interpretation. Show me word of god on the matter, and I'll believe that was the intent. I'd search myself, but I know I'd just find a bunch of ruleslawyers giggling and pissing themselves while drawing conclusions from, presumably, an entirely different codex, probably one that's since been updated to be completed different...

Having played a lot of Necromunda, I have a healthy fear of Stubbers. They're not as nasty as Heavy Bolters, but they're getting there.

Wouldn't a necromunda ganger make a guardsmen look like the epitome of strength, skill, and endurance though? Also, does necromunda have normal stubbers too? If I understand right, they're basically just normal machine pistols, rather than rapidfire missile launchers.

Was last night a 2000 pt game?

1500 point. With a modified version of the army I played cthulhu with (and lost due to repeated horrible tactical decisions on my part... ) that I whipped up in between userpay appearing and userpay being ready to play, when I got the unnerving suspicion that he made an army tailored to fight the lodar lists I'd been experimenting with. Hey, I outright said I change lists so often that knowing what I have played won't do you much good if you want to make something to fight me specifically.


Anyways, I'll be on vassal in a little while, I just have to do a few things first.

[Burnt Pies]

A starting necromunda ganger is essentially a Guardsman, without the armour. They get better over time, though, getting skills and characteristic bonuses.

In terms of stubbers, you get the stub gun, which is a terrible revolver, and the cheapest gun in the game; the autopistol, essentially a machine pistol; the autogun, which is like a lasgun but with worse ammo rolls, no armour modifier, and a silencer option, and the Heavy Stubber, which is the basic heavy weapon, not too expensive, doesn't fall apart at the drop of a hat, and decent range, strength and number of shots fired.

[Sir Pseudonymous]

Results of tonight's fight with Smitehappy, Daemons versus IG: in the first turn, nothing happened, because loldeepstrike, second turn, I lost 65% of what I had on the board (12 casualties out of 22 models on the field), before most of that could even move. Thankfully, my Chaos Icon survived, and so I could bring in the rest of my army (sans Bloodthirster, that wouldn't make an appearance until the battle was all but over ) right on top of the entrenched IG, the few survivors of turn one turning to wipe out two squads (one in close combat, two slaaneshi whores took out a squad of ten, suffering one casualty, the other by the horrors, both the three surviving (of five), and the new squad that just appeared) and tie up the command squad in a bloodless melee. The responding fire was notably muted by the casualties inflicted, and I only lost a bloodcrusher, three horrors, and two screamers, with one plaguebearer dying in melee. The following turn saw still no bloodthirster, though the screamers took down both of his vendettas, the remaining slaaneshi whore tied up the command squad after they killed the last plaguebearer, the horrors devastated one of the remaining infantry squads, opening up a whole through which the surviving bloodcrushers charged a veteran squad that had been stuck in the rear, slaughtering it. The fourth turn saw the appearance of the Bloodthirster, the death of the last slaaneshi whore after claiming the lives of two soldiers in the command squad, and the destruction of both the stormtrooper squad and the griffon that were stuck behind the initial line. Final turn saw the command squad valorously charging the Bloodthirster, with predictable results.

Spoiler: The Picturesque Conclusion (click to show/hide)

Army I used, in keeping with my policy of openness:

Code: [Select]

Daemons: 1006
  Bloodthirster +250
  Bloodcrushers +40x5: 225
    Chaos Icon +25
  Horrors +17x5x2: 190
    Bolt of Tzeentch +10
  Plaguebearers +15x9: 160
    Chaos Icon +25
  Seekers +17x5: 85
  Screamers +16x3x2: 96

[DJ]

1006 points?

[Detrevni|inverteD]

It's not unusual to go slightly above the limit and should be okay, if you check with your opponent first, of course.

[Aqizzar]

I've never tried to take advantage of it myself, but being a couple points over the "limit" isn't a crime.  Depending on the Codex, six points might not amount to one whole model, or a piece of gear.  Ironically, I consider it a good rule of thumb to never be more than five points over.  All the same, only rules-lawyers and tournaments should care that much about point violations of less than 1%.

[DJ]

I always end up with like 996 points and assume I just can't use those remaining 4. I just thought that point limits are hard limits. I mean, 1% deviation on 1000p list can buy me an autocannon.

[Cthulhu]

I was also under the impression points limits were a sacred barrier.  That's why the chosen in my 2000 points list have four meltas instead of five.

[userpay]

Be on for a bit today.

[Sir Pseudonymous]

Oh goddamnit, I get on ten minutes too late... :/


I suppose I could have dropped a bolt of tzeentch, probably would have done better without it, though in retrospect I just realized that adding a daemonic gift doesn't replace the default ones, and so the model gifted with it would still have warpfire, which is a lolrape anti-infantry weapon, at least at short range. But I was hurriedly trying to make sense of/fix a year old list that I don't believe I ever played, so a deviation of .6% from the limit wasn't really high in my mind at the time. Not that it really mattered, since all the work was done by 756 points of models... At least the Bloodthirster claimed the head of the IG company commander...

[Smitehappy]

Oh goddamnit, I get on ten minutes too late... :/


I suppose I could have dropped a bolt of tzeentch, probably would have done better without it, though in retrospect I just realized that adding a daemonic gift doesn't replace the default ones, and so the model gifted with it would still have warpfire, which is a lolrape anti-infantry weapon, at least at short range. But I was hurriedly trying to make sense of/fix a year old list that I don't believe I ever played, so a deviation of .6% from the limit wasn't really high in my mind at the time. Not that it really mattered, since all the work was done by 756 points of models... At least the Bloodthirster claimed the head of the IG company commander...

Only cause you had it kill your own screamer ; P

[Sir Pseudonymous]

Just played with a deldar army list I put together in 15 minutes with only the barest understanding of the codex. Both sides were devastated by turn two, and about 80% of the models on the board were dead by turn three, again on both sides. It was a learning experience, however, and now I think I know how to put together a more functional deldar army.

This was the army, it's probably pretty clear what I did tactically:

Code: [Select]

Deldar: 1001
  Archon: 60
  Kabalite Warriors: 166
    Kabalite Warrior+9x9
    Raider +60: 85
      Retrofire jets +5
      Splinter Racks +10
      Flickerfield +10
  Wyches x5: 525
    Wych +10x5
    Venom +55
  Ravager x2: 250
    Nightshields +10
    Flickerfield +10

[Sir Pseudonymous]

Finished the game with userpay, won by safe margin. Once his trygon went down it was essentially over, even more so when his tyrant popped and everything but the genestealers fell to instinctive behavior. List I used was this:

Code: [Select]

IG: 1500
  Lord Commissar +70: 80
    Bolter +0
    Camo Cloak +10
  Veteran Squad +70x2: 290
    Plasma Gun +15x3
    Forward Sentries +30
  Veteran Squad +70x2: 294
    Bolt Pistol +2x2
    Grenade Launcher +5x2
    Melta +10
    Chimera +55
  Leman Russ Executioner +190: 295
    Lascannon +15
    Plasma Cannons +40
    Knight Commander Pask +50
  Vendetta +130: 140
    Heavy Bolters +10
  Vendetta +130: 140
    Heavy Bolters +10
  Hellhound +130x2: 260Got exactly no use out of the veterans, except in taking the flags, and as cannon fodder. Chimeras did a little more, but not much. The vendettas and hellhounds were the real workhouses, with the leman russ providing only a token effect a couple of times, like pulping two units of gaunts after the last synapse was dead, just for the fun of it, since they couldn't touch my vehicles.