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[4bh0r53n]

i have had  abad history purely down to a slight misunderstanding: i had 2 masterwork bracelets, one encrusted with jewels, one with bone.....

...i gave them the wrong one and they then refused to trade so i had to use the 'persuader' (3 ballistae set up to go down the merchants patway and kill them all)....

[Fieari]

The bad blood is far less bringing in stuff from other fantasy stories, and far more dealing with the realization that dwarves like industry, such as cutting down trees and using them to make stuff, and elves don't.  In fact, elves PREVENT such industry, threating war in the process.

The elves are arrogant enough not only to not cut down their own trees, which would be forgivable, but to attempt to stop us from doing the same.  That's bloody infuriating!

THIS is why we hate the elves.  Not because of other stories.

In the TT stories, the political marriage between the races would likely be just that.  Political.  You know, to attempt to stave off a war?  Prevent conflict?  Because without it, the conflict is damn inevitable.

There'd be little need for such an alliance between the dwarves and the humans, because the humans provide us with beer, and make no demands other than that we don't harass their merchants or steal their goods.

[Draco18s]

And elephants are all possessed by demons.

[Tamren]

You know what would be scary? An elephant posessed by a leprechaun.

How would political marriages work between members of different races? I mean the political aspect is pretty obvious, but if the two races were not biologically compatible then they are essentially cutting short a branch of thier possible family tree which could prove disatrous if the line of succession is interrupted.

Elven in DF seem to be your typical tree huggers, and Humans are the typical greedy merchants. But they will probably gain a lot more depth later. They would have to if they were made a playable race.

[lumin]

Turning DF into an offline MMORPG would be very cool.

[hactar1]

quote:Originally posted by Exasperation:
<STRONG>
You know, this is almost entirely due to players bringing that prejudice in from other fantasy worlds.  If you read the Threetoe stories, the dwarves and elves are close enough to have alliances and political marriages.  As far as the gameplay aspect goes, it's fairly easy to avoid trouble with the elves unless you're trying to start it.  By the time the elves start asking me to limit my tree-cutting, there's generally fewer trees in existence than the number they ask me to limit myself to, and I don't really need the wood for anything anymore.</STRONG>

This may be true in the Threetoe stories, but not in the context of the game.  Just about every line of elf dialog in the game is either condescending or outright insulting, especially when compared to the human dialog which is very diplomatic and respectful.  Also they impose unprovoked unilateral military sanctions on your fortress, and offer very little in the way of interesting trade.  So yeah, in the game the elves have a somewhat adversarial relationship with the dwarves, or at least with your fortress.

[Tamren]

That is something i hope will change in the future. Even if the elves do not think very highly of you, that could change.

The elves that show up to your fortress only ever bring a pair of mules with them. Despite that they DO bring helpful products with them, even if it is just food, but later on that could include rare herbs and such "only they know how to grow"

So say one year you built a wagon for them out of metal instead of wood. You tell them "hey! heres a wagon, hope to see you next year!"

That the traders show up at all means you have something they want. So it stands to reason that trade would increase over time. The gift wagon would just facilitate that.

Thought considering a single wagon gets dissasembled into 3 whole units of wood, a single wagon would take alot of metal.

Anyhow, im straying a lot from the original topic but i will give this a bit more thought  

[Core Xii]

I didn't bother reading through the second half of the thread, but I'd like to be able to engrave letters. This way I could name stuff in a visible-to-me -way as opposed to in-game-fantasy.

[DDouble]

Like choosing which symbols get engraved on a wall? That'd be kinda fun.

DINING+ROOM

(door in the middle there)

[Core Xii]

quote:Originally posted by DDouble:
<STRONG>Like choosing which symbols get engraved on a wall? That'd be kinda fun.

DINING+ROOM

(door in the middle there)</STRONG>

Precisely!

[Tamren]

That would be handy, you could use it to label levers and what they do.

i can imagine some hilarious alternate uses.

Taunts!

IF YOU CAN READ THIS, ITS TOO LATE!  

(right in front of the floodgates forming a magma trap)

[ June 01, 2007: Message edited by: Tamren ]

[Draco18s]

DO NOT PULL LEVER ---> ó

[Xenomorph]

Which, of course, practically guarantees that someone will pull the lever.

Which is why you mark it like that in the first place!  

[Locus]

I personally wouldn't use "visible" words made out of individual lettered tiles, due to fourth wall breakage, but I definitely like the idea of being able to customize engravings.

Of course, all deep customization decreases the random humor and surprising elements in this sort of thing, but I think it would be worth it. Ideally, I would like gradated options for engraving:

Free - You could tell a dwarf to do the whole dining room however he wanted. He would move at a normal speed, and you'd get images of bucklers and a self-portrait of him surrounded by cockroaches.

Genre - You could specify a type or theme of engraving. Say, "landscape", "industry", "victory", "battle", "defeat", "myth", "monument", etc. He would move slightly slower. So your dining hall is filled with pleasing landscapes, glorious historical figures, and images of cheese, with no disquieting images such as an "engraving of a dog. The dog is screaming".

Commission - This would be a designing interface, allowing the player to assemble generic as well as specific items and people into an image. You could leave some elements random if you wanted, such as the name. It would then be placed on a specific tile. A complicated commission would take a much longer time to produce, but could create some great results. A simple example: portraits on the walls behind each important dwarf's assigned table in the dining hall. More complicated example: a wall-length mural made from individual engraved tiles depicting traveling elves - trading elves - a deer leather hood - an elf striking a menacing pose - a dwarf striking a menacing pose - dwarves and elves fighting, a dwarf shooting an elf, a dwarf raising an elf-bone mug.

These advanced options could come from an engraver/artist's guild noble.

[ June 03, 2007: Message edited by: Locus ]

[Core Xii]

quote:Originally posted by Locus:
<STRONG>I personally wouldn't use "visible" words made out of individual lettered tiles, due to fourth wall breakage</STRONG>

And you giving dwarfs all these different orders and the dwarfs following them doesn't break the 4th wall?

Besides, I fail to see how for example the name of the fortress engraved on the entrance hall floor break anything at all.