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[Eduren]

We forgot ToonyMan/eduren/Free Beer. They are the bystanders, watching us kill each other, especially given the lack of effort on ToonyMan's or eduren's part. Free Beer certainly has been asking questions...

Which of the three is most scummy?

Can one of them be working with someone from your "two teams"? If so, who seems likely?

You didn't really ask any of us questions, all you did was say "Look over here!"

[webadict]

We forgot ToonyMan/eduren/Free Beer. They are the bystanders, watching us kill each other, especially given the lack of effort on ToonyMan's or eduren's part. Free Beer certainly has been asking questions...

Which of the three is most scummy?

Can one of them be working with someone from your "two teams"? If so, who seems likely?

You didn't really ask any of us questions, all you did was say "Look over here!"

Am I supposed to be asking lots of questions? I'm merely explaining a possible fallacy in our groupthink.

And you are indeed the most scummy. Hence why I quoted you. And yes, I suppose someone from those two teams could be working with one of them. I have no idea who's the most likely. It could, essentially, be anyone. Who do you think is most likely?

Let's ask some question then:
eduren, explain why you thought Vector was a good choice to lynch today?

If you thought he was a good lynch, then why were you willing to vote dakarian if Jim voted dakarian?

Doesn't that seem to be scummy?

Why is it that you contribute nothing to the conversation, except to say, "Hmm, that's interesting. Why this, this and this?"

Who do you think is scum?

[ToonyMan]

Woah.  webadict, I think for certain you're scum now.

Unvote.

Vote webadict.  You don't want to get lynched tomorrow because you know Vector is town.

[webadict]

Woah.  webadict, I think for certain you're scum now.

Unvote.

Vote webadict.  You don't want to get lynched tomorrow because you know Vector is town.

So, have you decided to finally show up too, ToonyMan?

And yes, if I got lynched tomorrow because Vector was indeed town, we would, in fact, lose the game. I feel that two town lynches are bad. Do you agree, or do you think that my analysis is flawed in some way? Please, feel free to improve upon my thinking.

[ToonyMan]

YOU SCUM.  :V


You didn't respond to what I said.  You know that Vector is town, because you're mafia.  If Vector comes up town then you would be lynched.  The only problem is I'm not sure of your partner right now.  But once I do.  Town will win.

[Eduren]

eduren, explain why you thought Vector was a good choice to lynch today?

As I already explained, dakarians plea seemed reasonable. I already had suspicions about him and so I went with someone i suspected rather than dakarian.

If you thought he was a good lynch, then why were you willing to vote dakarian if Jim voted dakarian?

At that point i thought Jim to be the scummiest (still do) and thought that if we both called dakarian on his bluff then we might have a better standing tomorrow to take him down.

Why is it that you contribute nothing to the conversation, except to say, "Hmm, that's interesting. Why this, this and this?"

Im pretty sure that that contributes to conversation. I voice my opinion, ask a few followup questions and update people on my suspicions.

Who do you think is scum?

Jim and Toony OR Jim and Vector.

[Free Beer]

eduren, explain why you thought Vector was a good choice to lynch today?

As I already explained, dakarians plea seemed reasonable. I already had suspicions about him and so I went with someone i suspected rather than dakarian.

If you thought he was a good lynch, then why were you willing to vote dakarian if Jim voted dakarian?

At that point i thought Jim to be the scummiest (still do) and thought that if we both called dakarian on his bluff then we might have a better standing tomorrow to take him down.

Wait, what? dakarian's plea was OK when Vector was the target, but when dakarian decided to first target Jim, the person you feel to be most scummy, the plea is suddenly not OK?

[webadict]

eduren, explain why you thought Vector was a good choice to lynch today?

As I already explained, dakarians plea seemed reasonable. I already had suspicions about him and so I went with someone i suspected rather than dakarian.

If you thought he was a good lynch, then why were you willing to vote dakarian if Jim voted dakarian?

At that point i thought Jim to be the scummiest (still do) and thought that if we both called dakarian on his bluff then we might have a better standing tomorrow to take him down.

Why is it that you contribute nothing to the conversation, except to say, "Hmm, that's interesting. Why this, this and this?"

Im pretty sure that that contributes to conversation. I voice my opinion, ask a few followup questions and update people on my suspicions.

Who do you think is scum?

Jim and Toony OR Jim and Vector.

None of what you just said added up. Free Beer has beaten me to the punch, but you're saying that it MIGHT be Vector, but you'll gladly lynch dakarian so that Jim dies tomorrow, instead of voting Jim today and saving a townie?

Also, you said we instead of town. We who? I hope you're not referring to anyone out here, because nobody is a we in this game. There is simply a town and a mafia. You are part of one, but you do not speak for either.

YOU SCUM.  :V


You didn't respond to what I said.  You know that Vector is town, because you're mafia.  If Vector comes up town then you would be lynched.  The only problem is I'm not sure of your partner right now.  But once I do.  Town will win.

Really? Once you find my partner? Are you for real? I can give you two situations. I'll give you a hint, though, that the first one is correct and the second one is hypothetical.

One) I'm town, and don't have a partner. Anybody you could possibly find for my "partner" is indeed not my partner.

Now, here's your thinking of situation two, which is very much false:
Two) If I were scum, would I really betray my partner like that? Hence, wouldn't I want you to think someone else was my partner other than who actually was my partner? I think not. By that reasoning, wouldn't my partner be... (Drum roll, please): Vector, the person I've been trying to lynch since Day 1, including giving my analysis of the A-G situation.

And, I did answer your question. I THINK that Vector is town because he gave rather compelling arguments, which I thought were heartfelt and true. Perhaps I was a little over-reactive to him alone, since I felt very adamant about his guilt.

Oh, and ToonyMan: If I were mafia, who do you think would be my partner?

Also, where were you before this whole conversation, and why weren't you helping like you usually do?

[Jim Groovester]

webadict, I find that your appeal and proposal is fairly convincing, but I need to do my due diligence just to be sure.

You're starting a lurker hunt with this proposal. It could be said that this is a mafia ploy on your part to divert suspicion towards the least active players. What are your thoughts on this?

[webadict]

webadict, I find that your appeal and proposal is fairly convincing, but I need to do my due diligence just to be sure.

You're starting a lurker hunt with this proposal. It could be said that this is a mafia ploy on your part to divert suspicion towards the least active players. What are your thoughts on this?

Honestly, it sounds like something I might consider as mafia. But, I just had a feeling I was horribly wrong and that we'd lose if we continued the way we were.

I realize it looks bad, but I suppose that I was safe the way I was, was I not? I mean, would anyone try to lynch me after all that? No, you two would simply lynch each other and I win. I can keep trying to tell everyone Vector is scum, while their off lynching you and dakarian. I could easily keep that going.

I thought some better perspective would be better, and I feel like eduren might be scum (Which also looks bad for me, after I had previously stated I thought he was town with a fakewagon on him.)

And if I were mafia and I caught a scum, I'd also be stupid, because why would I lynch my own teammate? I'd have him lynch me! I'm obviously suspicious, and it would help their credibility.

I guess I had a bad feeling about what I was doing and so I figured I'd explore alternative explanations. There simply had to be a better way to explain than two people vs. two people; wow we caught our scum!

[Jim Groovester]

Alright, that's basically what I was looking for. I already thought up a few reasons for why you wouldn't be scum, and you mostly addressed them directly.

Unvote webadict. All my accusations and evidence are still lingering up in my head, but your recent actions have gone a long way towards satisfying them. You'll have to forgive me if I hold onto my vanishing doubts for a little while longer.

Moving on:

eduren, ToonyMan, and Free Beer have pretty much skated by through all of today while we all beat the hell out of each other. During Day 1, both eduren and ToonyMan faced scrutiny for being scum, and they even voted for each other at the end of Day 1. However, Free Beer has had pretty much a free ride.

Free Beer, I won't answer your suspicions, not yet anyway, because I've already done that a bazillion times today from pretty much everybody. You can answer mine, instead. Somebody could accuse you of lurking, and they would be right. You only pop in to ask questions, you don't interject into any discussions unless somebody asks you, and the only other time you participate is to deliver an accusation.

Is there any particular reason why you're trying to stay out of the fray?

Goodness gracious, I can't believe nobody asked this sooner. Free Beer, you voted for BloodBeard at the end of Day 1, and he shows up dead at the beginning of Day 2. What's behind that?

[dakarian]

First off.. I guess this means the end of people looking at me as scum.  There we go then.

Sidenote: the idea is still on the table.



However, something is VERY wrong here and I'm not liking it.  Not liking it at all.

A question, Web:  Why DO you feel that Jim is town?  You're among the first to believe that you should trust no one automatically.  Jim's been acting VERY anti-town for a good while now and had a horrible excuse for not accepting my bet (You're scum, but I STILL won't vote for you!)  You didn't even QUESTION it.  You've now accused everyone BUT Jim.  Why?   Up to now, he's the ONLY one to have failed my attacks against him, and I threw some GOOD ones against Vector and Eduren. 

Now that I don't have to keep getting the "I believe YOU are scum, not him" thrown at my face (otherwise, you would've just 'called the bluff' and voted for me).. WHY is Jim innocent?


I haven't forgotten the others.  No one, to my eyes, is truly confirmed town yet: just less or more suspect.  However, just reminding me of them and seeing Jim try to wiggle out of my attacks to go after someone else is NOT enough to make him look good all of a sudden. 

So, you can forget my gamble, or keep it in play.. but if you want me to hedge away from killing Jim you're going to need a GOOD reason why you keep defending him.  You don't want a double town lynch.  I don't either: so much so that I'm willing to kill myself to avoid it.

Right now, you're telling me to skip over who I wholeheartedly believe is scum to take a gamble even BIGGER than what I propose. 

No.  That's not enough.

I'm listening to your statements Web, but you actually have a harder job than the others now.  You not only have to defend Jim, who can't defend himself, but do so in a way that doesn't make you look bad.

For now.  Vote stays on Jim.  As for my request to everyone, it says: If you don't plan on voting me, then get Jim.  I'll add this: Vote jim or explain why Jim is acting like the biggest scum in all of Mafia.

[dakarian]

Unofficial whiteboard:

Jim Groovester: dakarian, Free Beer
Vector: eduren,
webadict: Vector, ToonyMan



A theory.  If the bet continued, I would die, then Jim would die.  If Jim flipped town, Web, who is the only one really defending him, would be heavily suspect since Vector defended himself so well.

The Mafia would LOVE to see me bomb a townie on myself.  The mafia, however, would HATE if I took a mafiamate with me, especially when the partner already has some suspicion on them... especially if the mafia was planning to bus the OTHER person and 'clear' the first one. 

Aka:

Jim Busses Web, using Vector  as 'townie bait'.  Web dies mafia.  Jim is a hero.  Jim then aims to kill another, perhaps me, perhaps someone else. 

However,  Jim Busses web, putting lots of suspicion on him.  I derail it and attack Jim.  Web and Jim jump me, casting me in suspicion and try to tempt me towards Vector rather than Jim.  Vector would flip town, I would be lynched next and that's game over.

HOWEVER, A helpful post causes me to aim back at jim and put him in an unwinnable situation.  Jim CAN'T kill me since that would kill him when it was Web that was meant to die.  Vector defends himself, removing suspicion from himself.  All that's left is Jim and Web.  They try to discredit me, but I prove insane enough to go with it.  They try to make excuses but the others call them out on it. 

So they try to derail.  OH LOOK, MORE PEOPLE. LOOK AT THEM!!!


I was thinking while I was working on my job (you guys notice I'm always gone between 1pm-2am EST?)..the only way to stop what I did is to 1. stop attacking me and/or 2. make someone else suspect.  Mafia CAN go and bus but only if everyone has remained hidden.  If both foes are in the spotlight, it's WAY too risky.

That isn't my direct statemnet of how I think it happened.   It's just an idea on HOW a web/jim alliance would work. 


So Web.. why IS Jim oh so innocent?  You already know I HATE unexplained defending: that's HOW Jim got into this mess.  You're making too many slips.  We're also almost out of time and tied votes = no lynch which we can't accept..

Unvote   Vote Web

Note, while everything said earlier does make you look bad, my vote is due to your defense of Jim.  Don't stray to other topics, like how other people look bad or how "I" look bad, or whatever.  You're defending the person I most wish to die. 

[dakarian]

Curses the lack of editing. 

"A theory.  If the bet continued, I would die, then Jim would die.  If Jim flipped town, Web, who is the only one really defending him, would be heavily suspect since Vector defended himself so well."

I meant if Jim flipped Mafia.  Wouldn't make sense otherwise .   

[Jim Groovester]

dakarian, if I were scum, why didn't I go after Vector today? At any time after webadict and Free Beer voted for him, he was the easy lynch, and as we all know from webadict, scum love the easy lynch. Instead, I went after webadict, who could be considered the most difficult target to go after because of his experience and skill with the game. If you say, "Because Vector is your partner," you would have to suspect Vector again of being mafia, by relation to me, and you already cleared him. I only needed to post a detailed analysis of Vector's behavior listing why I thought he was scum, and then I could have voted with him along with webadict and Free Beer.

That's all it would've took to go after the easy lynch. What gives?