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[Eater of Vermin]

I'm thinking of making a water based mega-project; a tower with cascading waterfalls on all sides as well down the central stairway.

I'm aware that this is an FPS killer, so will be using the obvious tweaks (2x2 embark, pop cap = 50, etc.) to improve things.

However, I usually have the display set to show water depth.  AFAIK this doesn't normally slow things down, but I'm wondering if this is true on a grander scale?  After all, each extra dwarf doesn't slow down FPS significantly, but we all know what happens when you get enough of 'em.

(Guess I'll find out for myself in a few game years, but I'd still like some idea of what to expect...)

[Haedrian]

Well, water depth is still going to be there anyway, whether its shown or not.

The only problem I can think it'd cause is it'll increase the Graphics Processing, since it needs to change the particular tile so often, but I don't really forsee a problem.

[Derakon]

I don't think it'll make any difference. As Haedrian noted, the depth is still handled behind the scenes; it's just drawing something different. Every tile still gets drawn.

[Albedo]

If you're graphics card is the bottleneck for fps speed, then yes.  If your graphics are using your computer CPU to drive them, it's certainly possible (perhaps likely).

But, as mentioned above, the math/rendering is the same.

[Derakon]

Albedo: how do you figure? Something has to be drawn for the tile in any case; it's just a question of if a number is drawn or a tilde.

[Haedrian]

Albedo: how do you figure? Something has to be drawn for the tile in any case; it's just a question of if a number is drawn or a tilde.

I personally use the partial refresh init option to help increase my FPS (works like a charm) - in that case it'd defentally slow down because of the need for refreshing all of the tiles

[Derakon]

You assume that it wouldn't redraw the tildes. Keep in mind that when you aren't displaying depth, the game uses the tildes to indicate direction of flow, which proceeds at a similar pace as depth change displays do.

[Puck]

I can only guess, but I'd say it would only apply to water on screen anyway.

So when you push it, and specifically design such a setup, you could get your whole screen to display water tiles that get drained and filled again in rapid succession.

And I bet it still wouldnt make all that much of a difference, even with the weirdest grid settings.

[Albedo]

Albedo: how do you figure? Something has to be drawn for the tile in any case; it's just a question of if a number is drawn or a tilde.

If it's just a tilde, it's stable, never changing, never re-rendering.  If it's changing each x-frames, it's more demand, more things to "think about".

I'm thinking of vast seas of depth-changing fluids, and systems that are already borderline (since they're asking).  (I believe I'm right, but I know I could be wrong.) 

[Untelligent]

I'm going to agree with Albedo on this one, to an extent; my understanding of Partial Print is that it doesn't re-render a tile until it has to, so if you have it on, it could alter the speed depending on your water.


If you have a river you're not using for anything, you'll get slightly better FPS if you show fluid depths, as the tildes on a river are constantly changing, while the water depth remains a constant 7/7.

If you have a pool of water (magma pipe?) that's shallow for some reason, the tildes might be stable, but the depth is constantly bouncing around.


Regardless, it's only going to have an effect if you're actually looking at it, and any FPS change isn't going to be all that great. Showing fluid depth is too convenient for me not to use, anyway, even if it looks iffy.

[Hyndis]

If the water is stationary, it will cause very little FPS impact. However if the water is moving then it can kill your FPS.

To demonstrate this, create a large artificial lake above ground, such as creating a dam between mountains. Fill this lake up with water with a very large number of pumps. Your FPS will grind to a halt.

However as soon as the lake is full and water stops flowing, your FPS will shoot back up.

[Psychoceramics]

moving water kills your fps regardless of the display setting :p

[Albedo]

Yes, but does the display setting have an additional effect?

To demonstrate this, create a large artificial lake above ground, such as creating a dam between mountains. Fill this lake up with water with a very large number of pumps. Your FPS will grind to a halt.

No one argues that.

We're discussing whether the graphics associated with that have an impact, or it's just the math involved.

(Grab the reins people - the conversation has moved past the basics.)

[Psychoceramics]

shouldn't be hard to test.

make yourself a water tower, save before turning it on.
Turn it on and watch your fps, savescum, change partial_print, load up DF and turn it on again

in all probability, it depends more on where the bottleneck is in your system. My fps only really drops when all 50-70 of my idlers suddenly have something to do and start pathing.

[Albedo]

As I suggested above, it's only going to be a noticeable diff (~if~ at all!) if the vid card is the chokepoint, and/or if it's using the CPU and that's borderline. 

Any "real" machine won't even (visibly) flinch.