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Author Topic: My fortress design - any comments?  (Read 1378 times)

Lav

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My fortress design - any comments?
« on: May 21, 2009, 07:11:22 am »

Presently this is my favourite design strategy. To be repeated N times vertically. Provides 16 rooms per floor == 240 rooms per 15 layers. Living area on some middle floor (usually -5 to -7) is usually mined out completely, creating the Royal Dining Room (maybe with the floor above used as mist generator). Top floor bedroom area is usually mined out as well to create barracks. Workshops alternate with storage space or may be replaced by water/magma channels where necessary.

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Expansion:

1. Any two adjacent bedrooms can be quickly converted to one 3x3 bedroom.
2. Internal 3x3 space can be used to expand bedrooms or place personal offices/dining rooms/statue gardens/etc.
3. Design can easily be replicated horizontally, creating alternating columns of housing/workspace. Dunno why that would be needed unless the popcap is set to 300+.
4. Any three adjacent workshops can be replaced by two 5x5 workshops where necessary.
5. Blueprint incorporates one 3x3 bedroom and one 3x3 communal bedroom, as well as two 5x5 workshops.

Compatibility.

1. Design is 100% compatible with 15x15 exploratory mining pattern.

Distances and noise.

1. Typical distance from dwarf's bed to his workshop is about 6-8 tiles.
2. All beds are at least 5 tiles away from workshops (noise factor 4).
3. All beds are at least 10 tiles away from digging/mining space (noise factor 8 ).
4. Typical distance from workshop to stockpile is within 5-7 tiles.
5. Distance from any bedroom/workshop to the dining room (located approx. on -7 floor) is within 10-12 tiles.

Miasma.

1. Miasma-generating workshops/stockpiles can be placed in the corner areas, only accessible diagonally.

Trade.

1. Trade depot located on the surface in the very center, with tradegood-generating industries clustered at the top floors. Distance between tradegood stockpiles and depot is usually within 10-12 tiles (plus any distance that needs to be walked on the stockpile).

Defense and security.

1. All workshops are isolated and can be locked if when necessary.
2. Fairly complicated surface defence structure assumed (not covered here).
3. Nobleproofing not covered. The easiest method is to dig a separate living space for nobles outside of the main structure including all the necessary "precautions".

Comments and suggestions are welcome. :-)
« Last Edit: May 21, 2009, 07:18:27 am by Lav »
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Duke 2.0

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2009, 07:14:21 am »

 I would be concerned about noise, but you could just make two different shafts for working and living connected at the top by a massive dining room and several tunnels between the levels.
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Lav

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2009, 07:17:42 am »

I would be concerned about noise, but you could just make two different shafts for working and living connected at the top by a massive dining room and several tunnels between the levels.
There are three noise generators.

First, workshops. Noise factor 4. Typical distance between beds and workshops is 5 tiles. Safe.
Second, mining. Noise factor 8. Minimal distance between beds and mining areas is 10 tiles. Safe.
Third, furniture placement. Alas, cannot do anything here.
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Neruz

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2009, 07:30:13 am »

Doesn't the Wiki say that dwarves aren't disturbed by mining?

Lav

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2009, 07:34:44 am »

They are not woken up by mining. But their sleep is disturbed and they get a negative thought from this, just like from workshop noise.
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Neruz

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2009, 07:37:51 am »

Ohwell, i always install mist generators into my forts so negative thoughts be damned.

Lav

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2009, 07:40:59 am »

Yeah, but even the Greatest Inventor Of Mist Generators says they're overpowered so I suspect mist effects will be seriously nerfed in the next version. :-)

Besides, I do not buy that "build a mistgen and forget about bad thoughts" theory. I'm an optimizer. If something can be optimmized, it should must be.
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Neruz

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2009, 07:59:35 am »

Optimal configuration would be to cram everything into as small a space as possible; this would cause Dorfs to constantly be interrupted in their sleep by workshops and the like, so a quick mist generator to counteract those negative thoughts would be required.

Lav

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2009, 08:09:13 am »

That's what happens when you only optimize distance and disregard all other factors like noise, accessibility, traffic management and finer control over production sequences.
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Neruz

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2009, 08:26:32 am »

Compacting everything down as small as possible would be the most optimal configuration for everything except noise.

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2009, 08:40:16 am »

 Also, a good two or three levels would need to be opened up and made expansive for stockpiles. Other than that, looks good.
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Muz

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2009, 10:43:01 am »

Lol, I should have a design, rather than tossing things about randomly.
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Martin

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2009, 10:51:07 am »

Optimal configuration would be to cram everything into as small a space as possible; this would cause Dorfs to constantly be interrupted in their sleep by workshops and the like, so a quick mist generator to counteract those negative thoughts would be required.

Not true. You need to allocate space for workshop, stockpiles, and bedrooms. The stockpiles actually take the most space. Simply put them between the workshops and bedrooms and you can have an optimal configuration without having noise issues.

I've never found the need for mist generators to keep dwarves happy. Just give everyone exceptional quality beds, chests, cabinets in a room with a masterwork door and put masterwork doors at all choke points - paths to the depot, food, etc. Only have one cook so a few years in he only turns out exceptional and masterwork food. Dwarves will be ecstatic even when their kids are getting cut down by gobbos.

Leafsnail

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2009, 03:17:14 pm »

Are walls between rooms actually necessary, or are they just for decoration?  I'm pretty sure a dwarf is just as happy to sleep in a 4x4 square of tiles as in a 4x4 room.  Would this mean that the optimal layout is completely open plan, for maximum accessibility?  The obvious problem is security, but it may be possible to divert enemies round a long and pointless corridor and still keep your open planned-ness.
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Martin

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Re: My fortress design - any comments?
« Reply #14 on: May 21, 2009, 03:40:06 pm »

Are walls between rooms actually necessary, or are they just for decoration?  I'm pretty sure a dwarf is just as happy to sleep in a 4x4 square of tiles as in a 4x4 room.  Would this mean that the optimal layout is completely open plan, for maximum accessibility?  The obvious problem is security, but it may be possible to divert enemies round a long and pointless corridor and still keep your open planned-ness.

That's basically my usual plan. It's a 5x5 grid of 9x9 rooms with the 4 rooms one in from the corners each having 4 up/down staircases. No hallways, but 2 doors connecting each room to its neighbors. You have very good accessibility but you can lock down rooms as needed. In fact, you can lock the doors and hatch covers to create a maze around things, and you can use it to herd problems in the direction you want. Helpful for tantruming dwarves or fey moods gone awry since you can easily lock people in and starve them, or wait until your marksmen are stationed. It takes a HUGE number of doors, but you can very comfortably fit 200 dwarves in roughly a single embark tile. The upshot to the doors is that with legendary masons you can put masterwork doors along high traffic areas giving everyone good moods.
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