Hmm, I still haven't seen the absurdly high damage that you claim. I kicked the butt of an orc siege (mostly wrestlers) with a largely untrained army, this being the spring of the second year. I lost one dwarf our of sixteen. One dwarf.
It's not absurdly high damage. Its absurdly high base damage for a fist. Titans, for instance, have 1:2 damage with their fist. Size modifies it, but that has nothing to do with the fact that an unarmed attack for a "normal" fist is 1:2.
Giving orcs 1:6 implies that they have "special" fists or something.
Also, didn't The13thRonin just say that damage depends on size, not just the damage modifiers?
Ie. Demons with damage 1:6 do more damage than orcs with 1:6 because they are bigger. So titans with 1:2 and size 20 could do more actual damage than orcs even though orcs have bigger damage modifiers?
I know damage depends on size. However, the BASE damage for an attack is based on the type of thing used. IE, a snakeman bites for 1:6. A normal creature's fist (A grasping hand used for an unarmed attack) does 1:2. Right now, orcs have "Snakemen bite attack" fists.
... If you wonder why you get (and should get) massacred if you charge a siege of seasoned fighters with peasants then I have nothing to say. Trying to attack a superior force with untrained militia and then complaining that you got everyone killed? What gives?
I'm not complaining that everyone died. I'm saying that everyone died, except for three people, which was actually rather badass. My point was that if I would have left the broken orc base damage in, we would have been slaughtered utterly.
Currently the AI is really, really stupid. If there is a path, they will charge through it. No matter if noone has ever come back alive from that corridor, or if they just watched their mates get sliced to pieces by glass serrated disks. Giving orcs trapavoid forces players to rely on something other than the oh-so-exploitable trap corridors. Sure, you could play without relying on trap corridors. And sure, you can still make exploitable traps like water-filled corridors and the like. But part of the appeal of this mod is that it forces players to rethink DF strategy. If a corridor lined with traps no longer keeps you safe, and you no longer can swarm invaders with untrained wrestlers, the game gets a whole new kind of urgency. Now there is actually a reason to build intricate defenses.
The answer to this problem is simple. If a player wishes to exploit the retarded AI and build 3298734 traps, then that player shouldn't complain about it being "too easy". On the other hand, someone who builds a moderate amount of traps tactically shouldn't have to be "forced" to rethink a strategy.
I'll take realism over gameplay any day of the week, to any extreme.
P.S. Actually 1d6 makes their attack to depend on their skill more, which makes sense. If they had 1d2 or 1d3 they'd hit like horses/cows (which have too low damage IMO, horsekick should be deadly in most cases to an unarmored person).
So a goblin does 1:2, a human does 1:2, a titan does 1:2, and an orc does 1:6. Does this mean that your typical orc is a monk? Some kind of martial arts guy? Maybe they wear leather gloves with lead shot in them at all times? They have adamantium knuckles?
Also, consider that horses DO kick excessively hard in this game, because of their size modifier. 1:2 damage is acceptable when you factor in size bonuses for ANY creature. Giving orcs a 1:6 fist damage is basically giving them a claw attack that does bludgeoning. That wouldn't be a bad thing if it wouldnt try to get passed off as a "Fist attack", or swept under the rug with cries of "Its challenging".
It's unrealistic, that's all.
Anyway, if it's too hard for you mod the orcs and shut up.
I did mod the orcs to the standard 1:2 bludgeon damage for a creature with a normally shaped fist. Their size modifier will increase that to a realistic level, and any levels of Wrestling will further increase that.
...And it was never "too hard" for me. I played with the original orc mod, which stupidly had their damage at 4:8 (Which was obscene). Nothing is "too hard" is Dwarf Fortress, just "realistic and acceptable" or "gamey nonsense that detracts from ambient flavor". Orcs with NOPAIN, NOFEAR (Possibly NOSTUN), 1:2 Bludgeoning, LOCKPICKER, all seasons active, iron weapons of doom, those are "realistic and acceptable".
Orcs with fists that do the same base damage as the fanged maw of a snakeman for "more challenge" would be classified as "gamey nonsense...".
Hell, for extra challenge I've modded the Orcs to be size 14 and called them "Hordebeasts". Nomadic giants that raid for survival and generally wipe out settlements. They hit HARD, they have HUGE weapons...
...
...
...And they still only do 1:2 base damage with a fist.
