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Which update would you like the most?

Randomized Backstories
- 67 (25.9%)
Genetic Additions
- 98 (37.8%)
Mess Hall
- 50 (19.3%)
Revamped Area
- 44 (17%)

Total Members Voted: 257


Pages: 1 ... 356 357 [358] 359 360 ... 950

Author Topic: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*  (Read 822474 times)

Apple Master

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5355 on: October 16, 2009, 02:24:06 pm »

Nailed it.
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head

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5356 on: October 16, 2009, 02:25:42 pm »

Data:

Do not take an antagonistic view to try to get us on your server, we prefer a certain play style and we value it more than we value features. The problem here isn't so much a problem of our code being mediocre, but that the serious role-play you seem to dislike is what drives us to this game, and better features wont make us turn our back at roleplaying and admin-player trust.

I'll say this, if you expect that putting out fires gives you the ability to park in firelanes, then your city is of no interest to us, even if it is easy to modify and add new structures. We prefer someone who takes pains to avoid parking in firelanes, but that doesn't mean he flat out cannot park in firelanes if it is convenient for him, but that if it happens, it happens once in a blue moon.

Coding for us is not a free pass to cause mayham. We want everyone to be able to enjoy themselves equally while on the server, regardless of whether they just dropped in, played with us from day one, admined for us or built the code itself.

If you want people from bay12 to join and enjoy themselves on your server, then you need to keep your audience in mind. We like our super serious roleplaying, and do not see anything wrong with it. When you foster a role-playing environment, we will join again. I don't think there will be any objections to that statement.

Yup. i told you all he would fuck up the otherwise great bay12 server
(even tho im banned)
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Data

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5357 on: October 16, 2009, 02:33:46 pm »

Do not take an antagonistic view to try to get us on your server, we prefer a certain play style and we value it more than we value features. The problem here isn't so much a problem of our code being mediocre, but that the serious role-play you seem to dislike is what drives us to this game, and better features wont make us turn our back at roleplaying and admin-player trust.

Hah. I have nothing against your so-called "serious role-play" apart from the fear that you might take things too seriously. The admins on the server are the same admins that Johbson appointed on his, and I have added no-one at all except for maybe Nameless2.

Coding for us is not a free pass to cause mayham. We want everyone to be able to enjoy themselves equally while on the server, regardless of whether they just dropped in, played with us from day one, admined for us or built the code itself.

Define "cause mayhem". I'm not causing mayhem on the server. Heck, I'm not even playing at the moment. But when I am playing, I'm role-playing all the way. It's just that I might give myself an advantage over other players. This is not only to prevent the game from ending very quickly for me, but it's also to give people some sense of goal.

From what I've seen, "serious role-playing" also involves sitting idly by while the captain handcuffs you to a chair. Such actions are only going to cause people to get mad, because they at least want to have some company around to remain role-playing.

If you want people from bay12 to join and enjoy themselves on your server, then you need to keep your audience in mind. We like our super serious roleplaying, and do not see anything wrong with it. When you foster a role-playing environment, we will join again. I don't think there will be any objections to that statement.

I can't foster a role-playing environment because I don't see it as my job to do so. I'm not one of the server administrators; I'm a developer trying to do his job. If you have been having problems with people not role-playing properly, then it's because of poor administration of the server. Administration which I have not appointed myself nor directly control myself.

My wish is to work together with you guys to try to make SS13 better. If you want to play a serious role-playing round or two, or even all day, then I have no objection to this. As advice I will ask you to keep in mind that there may be times when modes like "combat" are nice to host since it allows others to blow off some steam, but I'm not going to enforce anything. All I do is code, brag about the stuff I code, and occasionally play(test) a bit.

I await your response.
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QuakeIV

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5358 on: October 16, 2009, 02:50:59 pm »

bout 54 minutes until the party gets rolling. All i ask is for admins. :D
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beorn080

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5359 on: October 16, 2009, 02:56:29 pm »

Remove nameless from all admin powers now. He is horribly abusive, and removed my power during an attack I launched, just so his team could kill me.
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Jakkarra

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5360 on: October 16, 2009, 02:57:15 pm »

Quake, i shall likely be there.

Also, i'm going to assume Beorn is correct, i have only played with nameless for a few minutes.

chaoticag

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5361 on: October 16, 2009, 03:04:20 pm »

The admins on the server are the same admins that Johbson appointed on his, and I have added no-one at all except for maybe Nameless2.
There does seem to be a problem with Nameless2. I cannot say much in terms of direct contact, but there have been numerous complaints calling for his removal. At worst, he is abusing his power, at best he needs to earn his trust with the other admins and regular players.

Quote
Define "cause mayhem". I'm not causing mayhem on the server. Heck, I'm not even playing at the moment. But when I am playing, I'm role-playing all the way. It's just that I might give myself an advantage over other players. This is not only to prevent the game from ending very quickly for me, but it's also to give people some sense of goal.
Giving yourself the slightest advantage in a game is looked down upon. People already have a sense of goal on any game mode, even in extended (Do regular work counts as a goal, and people shouldn't have to expect more from that).

Quote
From what I've seen, "serious role-playing" also involves sitting idly by while the captain handcuffs you to a chair. Such actions are only going to cause people to get mad, because they at least want to have some company around to remain role-playing.
Serious role-playing means the captain doesn't abuse his power, and a mutiny against the captain is well within roleplay if the captain acts unreasonable.

Quote
I can't foster a role-playing environment because I don't see it as my job to do so. I'm not one of the server administrators; I'm a developer trying to do his job. If you have been having problems with people not role-playing properly, then it's because of poor administration of the server. Administration which I have not appointed myself nor directly control myself.
Fostering a role-playing environment is done at all levels, from administration to the common player. That means that OOC stays OOC, admins do not use their abilities to give themselves an advantage (no matter how small), people do not run around toolboxing others at the slightest provocation, etc. We do not expect administration from you, we just expect that everyone is put on the same level for most of the time.

Quote
My wish is to work together with you guys to try to make SS13 better. If you want to play a serious role-playing round or two, or even all day, then I have no objection to this. As advice I will ask you to keep in mind that there may be times when modes like "combat" are nice to host since it allows others to blow off some steam, but I'm not going to enforce anything. All I do is code, brag about the stuff I code, and occasionally play(test) a bit.
This much works with us. I thank you for the work that you have given us, and I don't doubt that you can help us improve our server. I think we do have some relaxed rounds, and we certainly enjoy them from time to time. I think your problem lies in your public relations though, it is not that we see anything wrong in your behaviour, but that you go ahead and do stuff before making sure that the rest of us know for sure what you are up to. The problem isn't that you don't tell us, but that you don't make sure we get it.
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Detrevni|inverteD

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5362 on: October 16, 2009, 03:14:17 pm »

Just to give my quick 2 cents,

I don't think that an admin should be able to both play the game and admin a session. You should either be a player the same as anyone else, and refrain from using any admin powers, or you should be spectating, and keeping an eye on everyone for that session, not roleplaying.
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The Survivor

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5363 on: October 16, 2009, 03:22:54 pm »

Wow man. Chaoticag, you just summed up EVERYTHING. Also, all these long posts are hurting my eyes, let's give the keyboards a rest. :D
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Micro102

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5364 on: October 16, 2009, 03:46:37 pm »

Soon, if we change the metal to dirt, this will become dwarf fortress online.

And as an idea for a macro, how about a button so instead of type HELP I WAS ATTACKED BY ******** IN *********!!!! which takes for longer to type then to talk and you cant move your guy while doing it, you just have a button that you press that registers your location and the last person that used a harmful action on you.
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QuakeIV

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5365 on: October 16, 2009, 03:49:43 pm »

Soon, if we change the metal to dirt, this will become dwarf fortress online.

And as an idea for a macro, how about a button so instead of type HELP I WAS ATTACKED BY ******** IN *********!!!! which takes for longer to type then to talk and you cant move your guy while doing it, you just have a button that you press that registers your location and the last person that used a harmful action on you.

Good idea.
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Keiseth

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5366 on: October 16, 2009, 03:50:15 pm »

Soon, if we change the metal to dirt, this will become dwarf fortress online.

Hi!

I know I have nothing at all to do with this, but I'd hope a Dwarf Fortress Online wouldn't be done in Byond. :P
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qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5367 on: October 16, 2009, 03:54:30 pm »

One question just bothers me, Why are we adding features from BS12 -> SS13
In my opinion
Data's version:
- Superpowers
- Few items
BS12:
- Redesigned engine
- Toxins separated from rest of the station
- Beards
- IMO better OOC, Radio and such texts.
- Nicer space background (Why would it be moving at a bit fast speed if it's a station?)
- Few jobs like Firefighter, Toxins officer and Head of Maintanence
- A bit easier to use sandbox (No permissions need to be given)

Anyway, I would like to have this flaming discussion have a quick short end, as short as the time it takes for a goblin to fall from a 14 level tower to the spikes below... and then get flooded with magma.



Especially the point where I suggested customizable text appearance by type. This is a feature the goons don't have, and won't have unless they steal it.
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Eh!

Data

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5368 on: October 16, 2009, 03:55:46 pm »

There does seem to be a problem with Nameless2. I cannot say much in terms of direct contact, but there have been numerous complaints calling for his removal. At worst, he is abusing his power, at best he needs to earn his trust with the other admins and regular players.

I will accept a majority vote from administrators to remove Nameless. Originally Johbson was meant to do this kind of thing but he's given up all hope for some reason, despite my willingness to adapt.

Giving yourself the slightest advantage in a game is looked down upon. People already have a sense of goal on any game mode, even in extended (Do regular work counts as a goal, and people shouldn't have to expect more from that).

I see my goal in the game as an entertainer; I only gain fun myself if others around me have fun. This weird scenario means that I'm effectively unable to cause much grief, as I don't like ruining the game for someone else.

I'm still trying to learn to which things I should and which things I shouldn't adapt. At the very least you should know that any behavior from me in the game will not mess things up too much. In special modes, I always leave control to the admin who held the mode without trying to divert attention to my character, but in generic modes where it starts to get boring I might actually do this just to spruce things up a bit.

At least when I do this in a generic mode, you'll know that the bad guy is controllable, and not prone to going on killing sprees or anything, so it's one less issue for moderators to handle.

Serious role-playing means the captain doesn't abuse his power, and a mutiny against the captain is well within roleplay if the captain acts unreasonable.

If the captain acts unreasonable and handcuffs my character to a chair, my game will effectively be ruined. The captain will of have griefed me. Even if I'm detained by security for vandalism and jailed, it still counts as grief in my book. However some grief is tolerated for the good of the many.

The key I have found to good role-playing in SS13 is respect. I always respect my fellow man, even if they do not respect me. Put me in a round with Johbson or even Rathen and I'll still act accordingly, not killing them despite what they may be blabbing over OOC.

Fostering a role-playing environment is done at all levels, from administration to the common player. That means that OOC stays OOC, admins do not use their abilities to give themselves an advantage (no matter how small), people do not run around toolboxing others at the slightest provocation, etc. We do not expect administration from you, we just expect that everyone is put on the same level for most of the time.

Except administrators are not on the same level as players. Indeed, an administrator is capable of hosting modes and making sure that custom modes are prepared. I think that sometimes it is good to have an administrator as a storyteller. I tend to automatically perform this role when rounds get too boring.

This much works with us. I thank you for the work that you have given us, and I don't doubt that you can help us improve our server.

Let me get one thing off the bat right away: I haven't given you anything. It's Nameless who gave the source to you guys because he wanted to abuse the crap out of you guys. I believe the only reason Nameless gave you guys the source in the first place is so he'd have a free "get out of trouble" free card plus full admin/developer access on the server.

My invitation to work together extends this far, but if you guys do not choose to work together I'd prefer if my work wasn't re-used.

I think we do have some relaxed rounds, and we certainly enjoy them from time to time.

Exactly. Of course, you have your strict rounds as well. I respect those rounds, and I do see the need at times for being strict, but you shouldn't be too strict. I've seen far too many RP servers (outside of BYOND though) that have messed up in this way.

I think your problem lies in your public relations though, it is not that we see anything wrong in your behaviour, but that you go ahead and do stuff before making sure that the rest of us know for sure what you are up to. The problem isn't that you don't tell us, but that you don't make sure we get it.

If there are questions about my behavior after I use adminsay to tell you guys what I'm doing, or if you want to ask a question on what I'm doing right now, you can always give me a message. I'm open to any questions you guys may have.

The thing is that I feel that the only way for us to be able to work together is to actually work together as equals. You shouldn't have the feeling that I'm hogging everything and trying to take control, but I shouldn't have the feeling that I have to report to you guys as if I'm some kind of code monkey who still needs toilet training.
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Data

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #5369 on: October 16, 2009, 04:00:24 pm »

Especially the point where I suggested customizable text appearance by type. This is a feature the goons don't have, and won't have unless they steal it.

Tbh I don't see the need for such a feature. The text is fine as it is, and it mimics the text seen in your version of Bay12. The only difference is that my OOC font still shows the [A]/[D] indicators for who is an admin, and that's a feature I'd very much like to keep.

Furthermore, it is already possible to completely focus on IC by switching to the IC tab that shows everything you do in the game, but not things like OOC. Note that the OOC channel will still display private messages of admins, so nobody can say that they weren't able to read it.

The best way to get ahead of the goons is by focusing on things that already exist and improving them. SS13 is regarded as a good example of "feature creep", whereby one feature is stacked upon another. This is why I'm focusing a lot on the HUD, moving old verbs like pull to grab, making an admin panel, etc.

Unfortunately most of the changes I make are internal. Some changes are made to existing features - some which people don't like - but people don't notice that I'm making things much cleaner on the inside.

I'm basically SS13's janitor.
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