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A) Angled Square

30 (31.3%)

B) Smoothed Square

21 (21.9%)

C) Angled Circle

39 (40.6%)

D) Smooth Circle

6 (6.3%)

Total Members Voted: 95

[LegoLord]

but I don't think it makes much sense to focus purely on dreaming up a design without ever intending to implement it.

Exactly.  Remember the site finder utility?  By LordZ's logic, that utility never should have been made, which doesn't sound like a good thing to me.  Just because Toady might go Syler on a utility is not a reason to give up on actually making it.

[LordZorintrhox]

Mmm, indeed, the site finder is a critical feature.  And a 3D interface would open it up to more people, but would the fact that you had to install two things scare them off even more effectively?  There is a question: how to package such an application to meet the goal of increasing joe-shmoe appeal?  If that is part of the pros, then it must be packaged as one thing, or at least pose as it.

I speak caution largely because a listener program is, as I said, a hack.  On top of that, it is an interface hack for an ASCII art game that is only on version 0.40, and still full of bugs/gameplay features that could change at any time, and alter how the augmented interface should be designed.  As groovy as it could be, it is most likely a challenge that no one, including myself, would expect to be as hard as it actually is.  Good interfaces always are.

That is a lot of code to throw at a task with so little guarantee and precedent of working, though I am not well read on any similar attempts at such a thing out there already, if there are any save the aforementioned 3Dwarf etc.

So tempting though...seeing all those huge multi-z halls in isometric?  Analysis algorithms for the engraving structs that render an appropriate, though rather vague, image for a given engraving?

...Magma floods in 3D?  Damn, I should stop, might talk myself into it...and probably fail (I am not the most versed coder, for sure; more the graphics guy).

[Chubacca]

It would be really cool to see some isometric grafics 
But all visualizers of DF are 3d (
and I'm really interested in it.

/sorry,bad english

[tefalo]

I just checked the first images, but... THAT.IS.AWESOME.

[Khenstot]

So, no one's interested in at least trying it out?

Edit:
After looking at the Lifevis sourcecode, I found these:
http://code.google.com/p/dwarvis/source/browse/trunk/lifevis/Lifevis/df_internals.pm

http://code.google.com/p/dwarvis/source/browse/trunk/lifevis/Lifevis/df_offsets.pm

It's in Perl, but you can easily see the basics of how Lifevis gets the information from DFd40, I suppose, I'm not a programmer.
Here's the project page http://code.google.com/p/dwarvis/source/browse/trunk/lifevis#lifevis/Lifevis.

[Johnny Chthonic]

I have never used a graphical tileset but I would use the crap out of that GUI.

[Solifuge]

I'm still very much interested in seeing this happen, but like a lot of people my programming skills are a bit limited. I've got enough knowledge to recognize possibilities, but not to design this myself.

Still, good finds by Khenstot! We need to get in touch with one of the developers, and start getting a proper discussion in here.

[CobaltKobold]

Also don't forget that at least some of the output code is out there, though I know Toady REALLY doesn't want to work with anyone. (Or at least work with everyone. We did get that second code release, after all)

Also, C#? no. Platform compatibility, people.

On the side, Sol, you'd need a few more than two door tiles:

Code: [Select]

.O.  .O.  .O.
OD.  ODO  ODO
...  ...  .O. and rotations, just to point out the useful ones.

Code: ("Unuseful") [Select]

OO.  OOO
OD.  ODO
...  OOOI saw one mockup with a strange octagon thing that was supposed to sort-of-work in all cases, but I think just plonking down a square-filling cube might be best.

edit: Mind if I use your tiles and see what I can do about a full tileset, Sol?

Also, on implementation, you're fine with just transposing the grid- hexagonal/triangular(not recommended) can be indexed rectangularly if you're clever. (edit again: One of toady's posts linked abo'e points this out, that (slice) isometric tilesets might go into core with "just an altered draw order needed")

[Deon]

Can anybody answer me: what's the point in 2d sprites in 3d GUI thread? They are really beautiful (nice job Solifuge), but we'll need 3d objects, not sprites, right?

[Khenstot]

Can anybody answer me: what's the point in 2d sprites in 3d GUI thread? They are really beautiful (nice job Solifuge), but we'll need 3d objects, not sprites, right?

Yeah...I think Solifuge meant 2D Isometric GUI, not 3D.

Also, we'll need diferent sized water/magma tiles, to indicate water/lava levels.

[Solifuge]

The point behind choosing 2D Isometric (thats what these tiles are) is that it takes infinitely less processor power than 3D, can be run much more easily on older machines, and is easy for members of the community to add to and tweak, which are properties that mesh well with Dwarf Fortress as a whole.

In 2D, players could still create sprites for the Custom Critters they add in, without buying expensive software and studying 3D modeling (It's a lot harder than sprite GFX on MSPaint). After the first Slaves to Armok game, Toady has been avoiding full 3D for good reason, I'd say. Besides, it's an artistic decision on my part; 3D is vastly overrated for its relative power requirements, and lacks the charm of 16 and 32bit sprite graphics.

On the side, Sol, you'd need a few more than two door tiles:

The tileset is far from complete. I'd want different textures and colors for different stone, smoothed, and constructed wall types, boarder tiles to transition between grass and dirt, etc. I'm cranking them out at a slow pace, but more than these are done. My brother slapped together a Simple HTML Map Editor for testing tiles, and just for general mucking around with them too, if anyone wants to play with them.

[Footkerchief]

Solifuge -- while a tile tester is an awesome idea, the tile images aren't showing up on that page.

e: also I love the way you did the ice.  Reminds me of Commander Keen.  I also like how you did the water flowing along the wall -- it would be cool for water to be displayed that way when it has no floor beneath it, and walls on one or two sides.

In the next version, terrain can get spattered or dusted with any material.  That's how blood spatters, snow coverings, etc. are handled now, and it also allows for coverings of granite dust, molten gold, melted lion fat, or whatever else.  The coverings can occur in different amounts, so you might have puddles of blood instead of a small spatter.  Every material has an associated color.  What I'm getting at is that there could also be small sprites that get rendered on the floor (small/med/large liquid/powder), with the material's color swapped in.

Color-swapping (I know there's a better term but I can't remember it) is a technique that Baboonanza has been using to great effect in his 3D visualizer -- the color of microcline, for example, gets dynamically applied to the "rock" texture to create the final texture for microcline rock.  It would certainly come in handy for a 2D isometric visualizer too.

[Solifuge]

The site works fine. You have to select them from a text menu on the right. Like I said, the controls are a bit simplistic and wonky, but it's easy enough once you get the hang of it.

Anyway, away from the shiny pretty things for a sec, just what I/O code has been released, and where might one see it?

EDIT: Okay, it only works in Firefox and Safari, apparently.

[Footkerchief]

Aha, got it.  Any way to load a map after saving it?  I made a little desert island outpost but I hit "Save Map" instead of screenshotting it.

The first I/O source release was here, in the form of Battle Champs.  That was released so that people could rework it, so it's outdated by now, probably.  What you really want is the 40d## I/O source, which is probably publicly available.  I'd check but I have to run.

Also, in case you didn't see, I had edited my previous post with some musings that might be of interest.

[jonask84]

Hey guys, my first post ever on this forum

Have anyone started development on an isometric view yet?
I've seen some screens, not sure if they're mockups or not though.

Anyway, I'm dabbling with some isometrics myself, and using DFhack I made some stuff.
Here's a few pics from development.
I'd love some help on making sprites, if anyone's keen

Screendumps:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

You can kinda see the progression

Edit: Been looking more at the forums. Seems the image that inspired to do this was made by Solifuge? As you can see, some of the early art work is lifted from one of those pics. Hope I didnt step on anyones toes, they were just meant to be placeholders

cheers
- Jonas