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Keep it as is

3 (12%)

Change it to a full Jester, with game-end on win

1 (4%)

Change it to a full Jester, but without game-end on win

5 (20%)

Change it to a full Jester, with game-end on win AFTER day 3

3 (12%)

Change it to a Jester with the loss of the Next Day phase

4 (16%)

Remove it entirely

9 (36%)

Other (explain)

0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 25

[BloodBeard]

The thing about the next most popular vote, watching only one person a day, is it will be a useless role by day 2. On day 1 only mafia will be talking, so they'd get roughly a 25% chance of finding a scum before nightfall (which is still pretty powerful on day 1). On day 2, lots of people will be pming after getting the results from their night options.


Odds are pretty high also that scum would keep quiet until day 2, so that would make the role even more useless. I'd just scrap it.

[Pandarsenic]

Watcher is either overpowered or near-useless. Either way, we have quite enough power roles anyway. Kill it.

[ToonyMan]

I can't really say my opinion of anything except on past games I wasn't a part of.  My only role I really got to play as was a townie.

[dakarian]

looking through a game helps though.  just reading the old paras show that the survivor in late game can lean anti-town, ghosts are horribly overpowered and so was  the old watcher. 

As for the watcher, the problem is the Purpose behind it's ability.  Most abilities have some purpose/result that's unique to the ability.  Cops directly determine innocence/guilt.  Doctors are good at preventing a bad action if they know the target.  Roleblockers are mostly for when you know the source rather than the target.  Reporters are great for confirming suspicions (i.e. if a 'doctor' claims to have protecting someone, the reporter can help confirm if they did). The list goes on.

What's the main use of the watcher's ability?  Yes, they can tell when someone is actively speaking to another, but there's only one real use for it: determining who is using Dopp chat.  It's just a roundabout way of finding scum, like a very awkward Cop.  Once the townies start Pming each other, the watcher's basically an Insane Cop.  That's why it's so hard to balance it: either it's a cop that can inspect EVERYONE or it's an insane cop who's findings are useless. 

That's why I suggested it would be a tech power for the aliens and allows you to hear random PMs or the PMs of a targeted player.  That way, it lets the alien better find the hidden alliances and perhaps catch who is supicious of who.  I can also see it being a VERY powerful dopp/cult role that can help cut down the advantage of the PM-syled town base. 

I'm all for masses of roles in Para (perhaps we need OTHER games started with just the basic roles), bu the roles have to have unique purposes. 

[Xegeth]

I agree with the watcher being removed for the reasons everyone else has been giving. I think the scientist should probably be left unchanged until it's included in a game without the watcher to see how powerful it actually is.

[dakarian]

As far as the scientist, I believe it's not so bad, BUT, it's slightly leaning pro-town, similar to how the survivor slightly leans pro dopps.  The scientist can easily grab a townie and can hunt for an alien, but will have a harder time finding a dopp.  Meanwhile, the town can easily give up one friendly for a dopp kill. 

I'm just wondering if they really need 2 slots to do their job.

[Kashyyk]

My suggestion for Intel is that although it gives all the roles and abilities, it doesn't say which role has which ability either, because apparently it does do that currently..

[JanusTwoface]

My suggestion for Intel is that although it gives all the roles and abilities, it doesn't say which role has which ability either, because apparently it does do that currently..

Although that was really helpful last game, I think it was doubly helpful because I only had 2 roles left to figure out by the end and one had a mind shield.  In a game without a watcher, I don't think that the Intel would be quite as broken.  (Because the Intel doesn't say who is what race).

[Mephansteras]

True, but I think that it might be unfair for the Intel to give info on what the other Aliens have, since they're frequently at a disadvantage against the scientist as it is.

I think I'll make the following changes for next round:
  -Intel will no longer give abilities or tech
  -Plasma Bomb and Assassin Bot are triggered remotely, and can be used while captured

That should let Aliens take care of being captured, but they have to decide if they're more worried about an Alien Scientist or about other threats (like dopps).

We can revisit this issue after the next time the Scientist shows up. (Might be this game, might not. I haven't run the role script yet).

[JanusTwoface]

Fair enough.  I think I'm arguing from the point of having just been the Scientist.

In all likelihood, I'll probably never be the Scientist again (of course now that I said that, I will be this next game again (of course now that I said that... (*insert head exploding here*)))

Anyways, whooo for new round!

[Mr.Person]

Fair enough.  I think I'm arguing from the point of having just been the Scientist.

In all likelihood, I'll probably never be the Scientist again (of course now that I said that, I will be this next game again (of course now that I said that... (*insert head exploding here*)))

Anyways, whooo for new round!

You're WIFOMing yourself

If I were to use an assassin bot to kill the alien scientist, would the people inside the ship learn who else was in the ship? Would they learn who I was?

[Mephansteras]

The Alien Scientist and any captives of his can all speak to one another. So, yes, you would know who else was a captive on the ship (although nothing else about them unless the Scientist chose to share).

No one would know who used the Assassin Bot on him (since that could just have easily been a non-captured player). Once the Scientist dies, the ship goes into self-destruct mode and releases any captives, so you'd all be free at the end of the segment (So you'd be back for Night if he was killed by an Assassin Bot/lynch, or Day if he was night/morning killed).

[Mephansteras]

Had a new thought about the Watcher role that might be interesting and fun.

First off, it becomes a 3rd party Role.

• Watcher
      Race: Alien
      Goal: Survive
      Rules: The Watcher is a strange Alien, Member of an Ancient order that has guided the Universe for Eons behind the scenes. The recent conflicts on Earth have drawn their attention, and they are devising ways of using this conflict to their advantage. The Alien's goal is to keep the humans and doppelgangers/cult occupied long enough for them to complete some preparations. Once the preparations are complete the Watchers will be able to control the outcome of the situation in a way that suits their goals best. Therefore, the Watcher must keep the game going for (#Players/2) -1 turns. This is longer then usual for a Paranormal game, but doable. The Watcher wins as long as this condition is met even if he dies.
      Tech: 2 Slots
      Victory: Game lasts for X number of turns
  

 

Thoughts on this? My idea here is to have an Alien who has a lot of information about the situation and is carefully working to keep all sides as balanced as possible in order to draw out the game. This nicely avoids the "Why doesn't he just tell X side everything?" question, I think, since he won't want to give any particular side too much power.

[JoshuaFH]

Kind of reminds me of this.

[Mephansteras]

Hmmm. Kind of, yeah.