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Author Topic: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)  (Read 74282 times)

Jiri Petru

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #195 on: July 08, 2010, 12:43:41 pm »

...
Also, recipe should be able to create several items: For example, "full clothing" recipe with contains leather boots, socks, trousers, etc..
Brilliant!

Also, make the "full clothing" recipe a default one  :) By clicking "make set of leather clothing", you would get "make any leather headwear", "make any leather bodywear", "make any leather handwear", etc. All in one click! This is something I always wanted to have in the vanilla game and now it actually seems easy to do! I would set my clothier's workshop to make full sets on repeat and never care again!

EDIT:
Quote
While we are at it, i would also like ability to "clone item" - say, i have this golden breastplate with image of lion in rubies in it and decide i want several, so i let my dwarves examine it and create recipe for it.
This would, I think, be accessible from the k-z menu of an item. Amongst dump/melt/forbit there would be something like "make recipe" which would create a new recipe, name it after the item and then automatically add it to the appropriate workshop. You could later open the workshop menu to use or edit the recipe.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2010, 12:46:09 pm by Jiri Petru »
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Lord Shonus

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #196 on: July 08, 2010, 04:53:03 pm »

I've been thinking, and I think that the announcements should be handled in a Simcity 3k/4 style news ticker.
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smjjames

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #197 on: July 08, 2010, 04:57:34 pm »

I've been thinking, and I think that the announcements should be handled in a Simcity 3k/4 style news ticker.

Might be a problem if the announcements come at a high rate of speed.
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Lord Shonus

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #198 on: July 08, 2010, 04:58:25 pm »

It would still be less delayed than the current system.
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SirHoneyBadger

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #199 on: September 01, 2010, 06:28:47 am »

"dwarfs carry drinks and 2 rations" should be a default setting, that you have to manually turn off to get them to go anywhere without bringing their own 6 pack and a footlong.
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CobaltKobold

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #200 on: September 02, 2010, 07:19:29 pm »

Of course there are going to be players who want DF's interface to stay the same or at least similar to what it is now. I'm sure a lot of people were attracted to DF from rogue-likes and their interfaces. But DF isn't a rogue-like in any sense (it didn't even support text until Baughn added it recently),

I'm pretty sure "roguelike" and "text-based output" are distinct concepts. Also, it was in there at one point.
It should be fun.  The number is going to be stuck for a few days while I set up support for open gl text, 256 characters curses and 128 character curses.

allowing 800x600 might be nice but I don't think anyone actually uses it any more
I find it useful as a windowsize.
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rephikul

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #201 on: September 22, 2010, 09:15:54 am »

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

1) Remove the boundary cells, that's greatly increase workable areas
2) Stick idlers and conflict notifier together because players watch them like hawks
3) Somehow allow context menu and minimap to be displayed on the same column if df window has sufficient vertical length. In this case, the context menu has been made thinner (but the same height) and can fit in with the minimap starting from 47 cells vertically using 16x16 Phoebus

Other suggestions
Military Screen
 + Allow larger squads, maybe make squad creation gradual like how militia captains are added
 + Allow tagging individuals to fixed CIV status. tagged squad members will not listen to squad commands and schedules and otherwise treated as civilians. This help with many micromanagement headaches i.e. having to keep making new squads to keep people civved when they are unhappy with drafting and still have them wearing the same uniform.

Job Screen
 + Sort ALL "Suspended Construction" and "No Job" on top.
 + Allow managers to priotize work. Such as, priotize "Tan Hide" over "Haul Refuse" over "Haul Food" over "Cook" over "Butcher." Right now manager can queue jobs, but has no sway over the order they get carried out. In fact, game processing is carried out at the exact opposite preference as outlined above which'd leave alot of rotten waste, especially hide.

Unit Screen
 + Allow to hide deceased people
 + Allow to sort dwarves by name

z-status Screen
 + Change "Stone" submenu into "Material" and allow wood management as well... I just want to use feather woods exclusively.
 + Allow to sort animals by type or name, instead of fixed order of creation.
 + Units on health screen should be sortable as well.
 + Make CLEAR distiction on owned / not owned objects on stock menu. Maybe just dont display stuff not owned by the fortress all together. It causes alot of issue when unknown cavern or caravan objects show up on it.
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Jiri Petru

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #202 on: November 01, 2010, 06:39:28 pm »

EDIT: Sorry, I've mistaken Quote for Edit again.
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konzill

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #203 on: November 01, 2010, 10:51:40 pm »

A dwarf summary screen that lets you do all the setting for one dwarf from one place. Currently this just lists possessions.  But I would really like a full character sheet for one dwarf that lets me see:

* all their skills with a marker for which ones have turned on at the moment.
* current happiness level
* Squad membership with a shortcut to actually assigning them to a squad
* Burrow membership
* Gives per dwarf equipment control
* what percentage of the time they have no job
* relationships / pets
* navigation buttons that move to previous next / living dwarf in the fort so that I can cycle through all the dwarves and ensure and set them up .


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zwei

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #204 on: November 03, 2010, 07:06:59 am »

Alernate stockpile display.

Lets consider this bar stockpile:

Code: [Select]
xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx

and this alternate display:

Code: [Select]
25 irn brs
80 stl brs
200 gd brs
2 lead brs
50 ccl brs
20 cke brs
1 slver br
==========
==========
==========

Of course, this would only work well for larger stockpiles which would have enough space to display textual representation of content, seems that even 10x10 stockpile is too little, but it would be very powerfull feature as you would be able to see how much of something you have exactly without having to check stockpiles menu a search for it.

Sowelu

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #205 on: November 03, 2010, 01:29:58 pm »

Nah, most stockpiles aren't that big, what happens if two stockpiles abut, it becomes unreadable if anything else is sitting on it, it only works if you have a very limited number of types in it...

If you could display how much stuff was in a stockpile in a menu to the right though, that would be cool.
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Jiri Petru

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #206 on: November 30, 2010, 08:39:29 am »

The Military Screen

We all hate it so I decided to make a new one. Inspired by Zwei's military screen, this is my take. Although I'd prefer a mouse interface, I tried to make this design text-only (with possible mouse support) with no graphics, to make it easy to program and maintain.

There are several things that are wrong on the current DF military screen. First of all, it has too many options hidden in too many sub-screens and it's very difficult just to comprehend what's going on. This can be partially fixed by reducing the number of screens, fitting more information and functions in a single screen, and arranging the options and information around the screen in a more logical, helpful manner. Thus my first goal was to reduce the clutter of screens, and even get rid of some screens entirely, like the ammunition or supplies screens (you'll see).

Second, the current DF military system requires too much setup. The player has to manually toy with many options and in too many screens just to make the military barely functional. We all remember how easy was it in the old version (draft a dwarf, tell him what weapon and armor to use), and how horrible is it now (more than ten separate actions, incl. setting up ammunition, schedules, alerts, etc.). I will demonstrate how, with clever use of interface functions and default option, you can make the military require as few clicks as possible. My goal: the player should be able to set up a functional military in a single screen, and the only thing they should be required to do is ideally just moving a dwarf to a squad. Everything else should be handled automatically (while keeping all the customisation options).

Here is the mockup of the screen. This time I've probably gone too silly with the colors, I don't like the looks of it. Focus on the content, not on the looks, please.



From the top...

First there is some quick info bar filled with random stuff. None of it is really important.

Then there are three tabs: SQUADS, EQUIPMENT, SCHEDULES. These are the only subscreens of the military, and we are currently on the first one. The player should be able to play the whole game without using anything else than SQUADS. The other two are for customisation and are completely optional. So optional that I won't deal with them in this post at all. You'll see.


Making a squad
You click "n" for a new squad. If there is a commander/captain, already appointed, it simply creates the squad. If there is none, a pop-up appears, asking you who the squad leader will be. This way, the player doesn't have to go to the nobles screen every time he wants to create a new squad.

Another pop-up asks you for the uniform you want the squad to use (as in the current game), and just another pop-up asks you what schedule should the squad use (in absolutely the same way how it asks for uniforms). It's important to ask for schedules now, because having to do that later confuses many a player (at least it confused me when I created a squad, and it still wasn't doing anything). Voilá! You now have a fully functional squad, the only thing remaining is to put dwarves to it. You do that simply by clicking an empty position - a pop-up appears asking you whom you want to draft:



I believe that utilising simple, context based pop-ups like this is simpler and easier to understand way how to deal with intricacies of the military system.

Let's explore the details:


Schedules
When I started to learn the new military, I couldn't understand the relationship between alerts and schedules. What are they? What's the difference? Do I have to set up both (turns out I do)? This is one of the most confusing parts of the military, and it needs to be simplified - by getting rid of alerts altogether!

See, you don't need alerts for anything. The only use of alerts for military is to switch between active/inactive, and this can easily be done by schedules. We do have an "off-duty" order, right?. Then you could have a schedule that reads:
  • Granite - Training
  • Slate - Training
  • Felsite - Off-duty
  • etc...

If you don't want a backup squad that doesn't do anything, you simply create a schedule that contains only "off-duty" in each month of the calendar. It's exactly the same like setting squad to "inactive" in the current DF, with the important difference that the player doesn't have to learn and control a separate subsystem.

To make this feasible, schedules would be created/saved/named/applied in similar fashion as uniforms. There would be some useful default ones, players could create and save their own, and switching a schedule to an already created one would be a matter of two clicks. In terms of interface, creating schedules would be done in the SCHEDULES tab, but switching schedules could be done simply via a pop-up in the main SQUADS screen. With clever default schedules, players wouldn't have to ever visit the SCHEDULES tab.

Meaningful defaults: the game needs to come with default schedules that are useful and don't have to be changed. In the current version, AFAIK all players are advised to immediately change the default "training" schedule by lowering the number of dwarves that is required to train. This means the default need to be changed.

A suggestion: instead of setting the squad to "Train, 6 dwarves minimum", what about "Train, 60 % of the squad". This way, the game would accommodate to the size of the squad automaticaly, and the player wouldn't have to change the schedule every time he drafts or undrafts new soldiers.

Other than the "Train" schedule, other available defaults could be "off-duty" or even "patrol the underground" which would patrol a default underground burrow (this is a separate matter but I feel the game needs a default, already set burrow that can send all civilians underground without the player having to designate a burrow first).


The still is use for alerts, though: and that's limiting civilians or even squads to certain burrows in time of emergency. This functionality should however be separated from the military interface, as it's hardly ever needed for the military, and instead merged with the burrows interface where it logically belongs. I mean: when I want to order my civilians to go to a burrow, I'd expect the command to be in the burrows screen, not hidden somewhere deep in the military screen.


Uniforms
The current uniforms system is almost perfect. It offers several useful default uniforms, players can define and save their own, and it's very easy to apply it to soldiers. The uniform system is so good that it could be extended to schedules (see above) or even workshop orders.

When you create a squad, a pop-up asks you for the squad uniform, and automatically applies it to all the members of the squad. You can then manually change certain soldiers to use a different uniform. Again, this should be done from a pop-up in the main screen, it definitely shouldn't require going into a separate screen. See:



The pop-up offers you to create a new uniform - clicking the option would switch you to the EQUIPMENT tab (but you can go there manually, of course). But as with the schedules, once you define the uniforms you want, there's no need to come back to the EQUIPMENT tab, you can simply assign the uniforms via a pop-up. And as with the schedules, with clever defaults, a player wouldn't be required to ever visit the EQUIPMENT tab unless he wants to customise.

You can see in the mockup there are some soldiers with "custom uniform". These are those whose equipment has been individually customised in the EQUIPMENT tab, so they don't use any of the available uniforms now.

Meaningful defaults: The current "any headgear" etc. options are perfect, the squad is able to upgrade equipment automatically, and the system even recognizes partial matches. This is how clever the game should be in all matters interface. But there are still some ways how the default uniforms could be improved.

First, the heavy infantry (metal armor) uniform should support armour layering, ie. it shouldn't say "any armour" but "ani chainmail" + "any breastplate" (ideally recognising leather armour as a breastplate). The same for caps and helms, etc. This a change I always have to make to the default metal uniform, which I otherwise like.


More importantly, move quivers, arrows, food and drink to the uniforms! I hate having to set them up in separate screens, it makes no sense. Why can't I instead have an archer uniform that says, for example:

  • Any headgear
  • Any armor
  • Any legwear
  • Any footwear
  • Any handwear
  • A ranged weapon, individual selection
  • 1 quiver
  • --- 15 bone or wooden arrows (for training)
  • --- 15 metal arrows (for combat)
  • A backpack
  • --- 2 rations
  • A waterskin
  • --- 1 drink

Sure, this means we move the "supplies" settings from squads to individuals, but is it really a problem? Changing is as simple as opening the EQUIPMENT tab and toying with a couple of options - ie. it's the same as doing it in a different screen, but again it doesn't require the player to learn a new subsystem.

The arrows are a major pain in the ass for a lot of players. I think most would agree the old system where you didn't have to care about ammunition was better. In any case, having to set up ammunition before soldiers can start using it is bad! Even if you decide not to move ammunition to uniforms, the game must be set up in such a way that by default, soldiers can use ammunition without the player changing anything.

Moving the ammunition to uniforms means you lose control over hunters' ammunition, but does anybody care? Just let hunters use anything they can find. It worked well in 40d and noone was complaining. Again, having to set up ammunition for hunters before hunters can start hunting is a very bad interface decision, and it confuses a lot of players.


Quick-drafting civilians
Normally, when you draft a dwarf you click on a AVAILABLE position and choose the recruit from a pop-up (see above). This is very similar to how it currently works.

However many people were complaining there's no easy way to draft the entire fortress in times of emergency, like it was possible in 40d. Therefore I present you with the quick-draft option. At the bottom of the SQUADS screen is a list of civilians (but it could easily be in a separate tab, eg. QUICK-DRAFT, as it's completely optional), ordered by their weapon skill. When you click on any of them, the game automatically places the dwarf on the topmost available position. When there are no free positions, the game automatically creates a new squad with the dwarf as its captain (a normal pop-ups asking for schedule and uniform would appear).

This is a completely optional, alternative way to draft soldiers, and players would never have to use it.


Meaningful defaults
As I've said in the beginning, I believe the game needs to come up with default settings that allow setting up the military in as few actions as possible. As a general rule of thumb: if there is an action that players have to do to make a functional military, it should be automated if possible.

I've already mentioned some defaults, but I'll list them here again and add some new:
  • When a squad gets created, immediately ask for a schedule and an uniform so the player doesn't get confused that he needs to do this on top of recruitment.
  • Default schedules that don't have to be changed to work. Have at least two: "Train all the time" and "Be off-duty all the time". But you can add more if you have good ideas.
  • Get rid of the alerts system than only adds a completely meaningless action on top of schedules.
  • Several default uniforms that offer anything you might ever want from a uniform.
  • Supplies set in a way that doesn't need changing. This is actually well and true in the current game, I've just suggested to move supplies to uniforms to make it even simpler.
  • !!! Ammunition set by default in a way that doesn't need changing !!!
  • All barracks should start with training for all squads enabled, not disabled. The player should be required to customise only if they don't want their soldiers to train, not if they do want them to train.

If all goes well, the player only has to:
- Create a squad (choosing from a list of default schedules and uniforms)
- Draft soldiers
- Close the military screen and watch the soldiers train!

Anything on top of that is "customisation" and should be completely optional.


The end
That's about all that I had in mind. Please post your comments and questions, I'll try to react as the time allows.
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Inglonias

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #207 on: November 30, 2010, 04:34:00 pm »

Simple: Make the stock screen searchable.
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JujuBubu

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #208 on: December 02, 2010, 07:22:38 am »

Simple: Make the stock screen searchable.

THIS

and

[[ Include a option to save custom uniforms and schedules.

mostly everybody knows by now the optimized setup of a uniform,
but setting it up in every new game is kind of annoying.

So like WorldGen Settings, make a file for uniform settings so you don't have to create your standard uniform
again and again in every new game. ]] -- the search option says its allready in your wall of text, but I cant find it.




« Last Edit: December 02, 2010, 07:36:25 am by JujuBubu »
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zwei

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Re: Total Interface Overhaul (now with sparkles)
« Reply #209 on: December 02, 2010, 08:55:26 am »

...

and

[[ Include a option to save custom uniforms and schedules.

...

And stockpiles. Everyone makes special stockpiles to hold cookable/brewable items, over and over again.
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