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[Strife26]

Sorry for the double post.

I just looked at my new unit thing, one of my bow units became the light cavalry one. So, yeah.
And I gave two of my warriors iron swords and axes, so shouldn't they change too?

[Luke_Prowler]

OK, a few things. First off, you forgot that I ordered two groups to explore. Also, you are slightly cryptic about the progress on town building. Do I need to research more or is something else in the way?

Last one, what would I expect to gain from researching Medicine?

[mainiac]

Two turns back, the Jerrans crafted 3 units of jewelery.  1 of those was traded.  What happened to the other two?

[Vanigo]

Sorry for the double post.

I just looked at my new unit thing, one of my bow units became the light cavalry one. So, yeah.
And I gave two of my warriors iron swords and axes, so shouldn't they change too?

I thought you only had two bow units to begin with? When did you make a third? As for the warriors, you're quite right. I fixed that.

OK, a few things. First off, you forgot that I ordered two groups to explore. Also, you are slightly cryptic about the progress on town building. Do I need to research more or is something else in the way?

Last one, what would I expect to gain from researching Medicine?

Oh, right. Let's see here... South your units find nothing but trackless forest. East, following the river, they find the forest thins out to grasslands in the north.
Town building, you're making progress.
Medicine, you don't know; try it and find out.

Two turns back, the Jerrans crafted 3 units of jewelery.  1 of those was traded.  What happened to the other two?

I'm... not sure. I'll fix that.

[Strife26]

I had two, but then one got equiped with horses and spears, so now I'd only have one.

[mainiac]

I think there might have been another unit stockpiled too, I'm making a quick little excel sheet right now because I am that much of a nerd.

[Vanigo]

I had two, but then one got equiped with horses and spears, so now I'd only have one.

Oh, that's what you mean. Okay, fixed.

[mainiac]

Looks like the food bonus for the archery camp was ignored for a couple of turns, but other then that I think everything else adds up but the pearls, which should be at 3 right now.

Can I broach the trading issue and ask; is there any profit in trading in this game?  It appears to me right now that it's based on the principle of equivalent exchange: i.e. 3 cloth is worth 2 spices, so they are willing to trade 2 spices for 3 cloths.  But even in today's globalized marketplace, that isn't how trade works, the value of goods changes a lot by area.  And historically, sea going powers were able to strike very, very profitable deals.  So what's the lowdown here.  Am I just not seeing the profit because I'm still doing this on too small a scale?  Or is there no profit in trading?

[Vanigo]

What makes you think two spice is worth three cloth? Spice is rare; clothes can be made pretty much anywhere.

[mainiac]

Clothes can be made anywhere, but we are looking at a very limited market here.  In that limited market, there's no one willing to pay a lot for spice.  Therefore while it would be very valuable otherwise, it's dirt cheap right now.  Likewise the value of pearls is lower in Jericho then in the native village or at the Citadel or at Rag'tich, etc.  But look at the value of cloth vs. spices inside the native village.  What's the relative value inside the native village?

Spoiler: I thought of a way of putting it more simply... (click to show/hide)

There's apparently enough spices to go around as long as Bonnie is only buying a little.  Therefore there is no scarcity issue for spices.  Likewise, there is no scarcity issue for cloth in the village.  However, what's the labor cost of these two items?  By the sounds of things, they are laking an organized cloth industry, so the cloth is worth about twice as much labor to them as the spice is.  So Bonnie can come into this village and say "Hey, I got cloth here.  It would take you guys ages to make this much cloth.  How much spice is this worth to you?"  The answer is, a lot.  Yes, the spice is worth a lot more to her, but she is one potential customer while they are many.  The native whom the cloth is worth the most to is going to be easy to find and sell to.  Inside the native village, there is a market for the cloth Bonnie is making, the natives can just start making new cloth.  However they can't start finding new customers any time soon.  So therefore they'll go with what's a good deal on their terms.  And for the villagers, the cloth is worth more then the spice.

Then when we get into the whole thing with the jewelery, not only does Bonnie have the whole supply, but the jewelery has a high labor cost back in Jericho.  Yes, it's intrinsic value is the same as the spice, but it really, really shouldn't be trading on parity with the spice.  Bonnie should be able to find the riches native and trade 1 jewelery for a lot more then one spice.  Now, I can understand how there's a limited spice production and eventually the market will be swamped.  But even before I've started trading the market looks swamped.  Even look at food from their perspective of labor.  How much labor does it take them to harvest a unit of spice?  How much to harvest food?  If the same amount of labor can harvest two food or one spice, why wouldn't they trade a spice for two food?

In the end, negotiation always strikes the balance between the competing wants of the parties.  But the Jerrans have the ships and can sail somewhere else.  They also have a city that is more then happy to use it's own luxuries.  The trade thus should be heavily biased in the favor of the Jerrans.  Historically, the whole notion of sailing up to some place without anyone else to trade with was insanely profitable.  Many very powerful empires were built on the principle.  The Dutch had more ships then all other European nations combined at one point and this is how they paid for it.  Various Mediterranean powers made a killing this way long before they got a slice of the silk trade.

more simply...
When the trade happens, comparative advantage kicks in and there's profit for the two sides to split, both Jerrans and natives come out ahead.  But if you look at it historically, the Jerrans are going to enjoy the bulk of these benefits.  In a nutshell this is because Bonnie can cut a deal with anyone in the village while there's only one outside merchant they can trade with.  So Bonnie should be able to make a vastly profitable deal for herself as long as it leaves the villagers even a little better off then no deal at all.

I get waaay too wordy when it's past my bedtime.

[Strife26]

Go play nationstates would be my recomendation. I'm sure that the exchange rates would change over time, and modeling supply and demand properly is hard (read impossibly, economics is guesswork that claims to be a science and a math).


Do my scouts retain the use of both their bow and their short spear?

[mainiac]

I'm not asking for a realistic model, I'm just asking for enormous profits. 

I have put a damn big amount of investment into chasing these profits and am disappointed by the measly size. 

edit: although to be fair, much of my behavior can be attributed to the fact that I was reading grasping reality w/ both hands in the other window...

Also, we don't need to worry about changing exchange rates due to trade because we are all in defacto merchantalism economies.

[Strife26]

One more question (my RP is about half done now).

If I make some iron shields this turn, can I get them equipped on a unit that is going into battle right now?

[Nirur Torir]

If Vanigo is being consistent, then no. The shields will be ready at the end of the year.

[Strife26]

Oh well, I'll do without then.

If zefie saddles involve two zefies per horse, then should my one unit (100 zefies) only use half a unit of horses? This gets confusing fast, doesn't it. Or does a unit of zefie saddlers have 200 zefies and 100 horses?