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[Siquo]

Also, Siquo, you're not clever. Planck time is provable.

Like the Higgs boson, it's something that should exist according to current theory. It's never been measured directly or indirectly.
You have a very broad definition of provable, and should work on arguing-without-ad-hominems.

Neruz, bluntness has never worked with me, try arguments and links to relevant sources. you've clearly shown to have no understanding of the basics of science. I did study physics in university, and if I had had more discipline, I'd be a poo-slinging phycisist myself (and believe me, they do fling poo at eachother. Working at a scientific-journal publisher taught me that much...).

[Neruz]

I make one comment about chimpanzees and everyone leaps on me? The hell?

I mean, if i was running around screaming swear words and making depricating comments about his mother i could understand that reaction, but come on. It's not even an original insult; calling somone a chimp as a means of pointing out that they're being an idiot is older than dirt.

--EDIT--

Oh look; here we go again.

Also, Siquo, you're not clever. Planck time is provable.

Like the Higgs boson, it's something that should exist according to current theory. It's never been measured directly or indirectly.

No Siquo; it's something that if it exists, will cause alot of things that don't make sense to make sense. It is one of many competing theories, all of which will probably turn out to b partially true.

The Higgs boson is actually an excellent example; it's one of the rare things in physics that cannot be proven to exist without first measuring it. This is actually quite interesting, as technically it should not be the case.


Additionally; the Higgs Boson itself is not even the thing that these theories need to make sense; rather a particle with some of the properties assigned to the Higgs Boson is needed, the Higgs Boson is a theoretical particle that is predicted to exist by several theories that have otherwise strong foundations and proofs. If it turns out to not exist, then those theories are disproven and it's back to the drawing board, where a thousand more lie.

Neruz, bluntness has never worked with me, try arguments and links to relevant sources.

Been there, tried that, didn't work.

The entire internet is full of relevant sources to prove things like Planck time, and if you want to do it properly, your nearest University will have everything you need. Go away and come back in a decade or two when you understand this, or fix your trust issues. I don't care either way, but this is beyond farcical.

I did study physics in university

I doubt that. You may have attended physics courses (you seem intelligent enough, when you're not being dumb) but i sincerely doubt you actually studied them.


--EDIT2--

I will give you this though; if your posts in this thread are any indicator, you'd make an excellent politician.

[Jackrabbit]

I make one comment about chimpanzees and everyone leaps on me? The hell?

I mean, if i was running around screaming swear words and making depricating comments about his mother i could understand that reaction, but come on. It's not even an original insult; calling somone a chimp as a means of pointing out that they're being an idiot is older than dirt.

My goodness, you're right. You only insulted him, and it wasn't even an original insult.

That makes it alllll okay. I can't believe I didn't see it before.

[Neruz]

I make one comment about chimpanzees and everyone leaps on me? The hell?

I mean, if i was running around screaming swear words and making depricating comments about his mother i could understand that reaction, but come on. It's not even an original insult; calling somone a chimp as a means of pointing out that they're being an idiot is older than dirt.

My goodness, you're right. You only insulted him, and it wasn't even an original insult.

That makes it alllll okay. I can't believe I didn't see it before.

:|

Ok now i know you're deliberately missing the point.

[Vester]

The point is that you're being a douchebag. Now, sure, you're irritated with Siquo, but insulting him isn't going to solve any problems.

[Jackrabbit]

The point being that you're just constantly insulting Siquo and in general being a flaming douche, right?

[Neruz]

The point is that you're being a douchebag. Now, sure, you're irritated with Siquo, but insulting him isn't going to solve any problems.

Made me feel a little better, solved that problem.


If you want to get rid of the insults completely, then this needs to stop being an argument and start being a debate. No-one in the thread has shown any inclination of turning this from an argument into a debate though, so i don't like your chances.

The point being that you're just constantly insulting Siquo and in general being a flaming douche, right?

I'm trying not to, honest to god i am, but some of the lines he is pulling are not merely flagrantly incorrent and bastardisiations of the term, nor are they some of the most appaling word twisting i've ever seen outside of politics, some of them are just plain stupid. This has gotten particulary annoying lately because Siquo has repeatedly shown that he is not and idiot and is in fact quite intelligent, he just appears to have his head up his ass. Or something, i don't know.

[Neruz]

Now that i think about it; if you really want to engage in a debate in this thread, then the first thing that needs to be done is for the thread to be locked, because nobody in this thread is correctly equipped to properly debate the issues being raised.

[Jackrabbit]

So why are you still posting in it? Is it to insult Siquo because you totally disagree with him?

Because if so, then don't go looking for sympathy, just a mute.

[Neruz]

Who knows Rabbit. Why are you telling me off for a minor insult on the internet? Same reason.

Ironically, XKCD put it far better than i ever could:





Why am i doing this? I can honestly say i don't know. And i bet you don't know why you're doing it either.

[Jackrabbit]

Who knows Rabbit. Why are you telling me off for a minor insult on the internet? Same reason.

My reason is because all you've done for the last month or so is flame Siquo. That's all I see when I come into this thread, all I ever see. You say that the only reasonable thing is for this thread to be locked because nobody is going to debate this without falling to insults, but you continue to come in here and generally act like an ass. It's not a single unconnected minor insult, it's this big connected string of douchebaggery that I wouldn't expect from a rational person, not one from this forum. It's the way you act surprised when people call you out on it. It's you being an tosser like you have the right to be. It's infuriating, is what it is.

Why do you think I wouldn't know why I'm doing this? It's because just letting you be an ass and saying nothing isn't just the wrong thing to do, it's the cowardly thing to do.

[Neruz]

Who knows Rabbit. Why are you telling me off for a minor insult on the internet? Same reason.

My reason is because all you've done for the last month or so is flame Siquo. That's all I see when I come into this thread, all I ever see. You say that the only reasonable thing is for this thread to be locked because nobody is going to debate this without falling to insults, but you continue to come in here and generally act like an ass. It's not a single unconnected minor insult, it's this big connected string of douchebaggery that I wouldn't expect from a rational person, which you clearly are. It's the way you act surprised when people call you out on it. It's infuriating, is what it is.

And now you know how i feel when i see Siquo is still saying things like:

Like the Higgs boson, it's something that should exist according to current theory. It's never been measured directly or indirectly.
You have a very broad definition of provable, and should work on arguing-without-ad-hominems.

If you mean why have i degenerated into the slow insults, it's out of frustration. Nothing i have done has had any impact upon him, so if nothing i do will have any effect, i might as well do something that lets me blow off some steam.

I suppose if you want to go deeper; i very much dislike stupidity, but i can forgive it where it is justfied. What i can never bring myself to forgive is when smart, rational, intelligent people willfully engage in idiocy; that always hits every single one of my buttons. An absolute way to cause me to instantly degenerate into a frothing maniac is to say something stupid and mean it. I don't know why it does, but it does.


Again, like i said; i'll be happy to engage in polite debate with Siquo, but since he seems to be the one challenging established sciences, i would respectfully request that he takes the side of the opposition, and thus he needs to go first, stating his meaning and argument in a clear and concise manner that affords no chance of misunderstanding. Since at the moment all i can see out of him is dancing around in circles shouting "SCIENCE IS RONG!" which is even less use than dividing by zero.

[Cyx]

I got kind of lost : why is whether science is absolutely right or not so relevant to the existence of God ?

I'd think : if science is actually wrong about most of the universe, logic is still valid. And logic tells us that if we can not explain the universe, the nature of God is unknown and his existence uncertain, thus he is irrelevant. I still don't get how Siquo got out of this one argument : if we can know the truth about God, then the fact than anything he supposedly does can be explained by natural causes tells us he isn't likely to exist, whereas if we are incapable of knowing the truth about God, he might as well not exist since we can't possibly know whether he exists or not and how it affects us.

You only need science to be an atheist if you're inclined to believe in a God in the first place ; reason is enough if you aren't. What people don't get is that when they "feel God", it can be explained very easily by either some philosophy, psychology or neurology : it is not an argument at all. If we disregard everything but the absolute truth, no we have no idea whether God exists or not. But why do people keep thinking it means they might just be right, ignoring what they could actually learn from it : the very concept of a God outside human reason is utterly absurd in the first place.

[Siquo]

Since at the moment all i can see out of him is dancing around in circles shouting "SCIENCE IS RONG!" which is even less use than dividing by zero.

No, just you. You're claiming that science is something that it's not. Provable, for instance. Science is built upon Assumptions. Things That Cannot be Proven. Therefore everything it claims can never be fully proven, as you'll always end up at those basic assumptions. Even Mathematics has its Axioms that cannot be proven. There is nothing wrong with that, but there is with claiming that everything is provable and True, that lands you in the same category as religious zealots with hands on their ears shouting "lalala I can't hear you".

Also, I'd really like to see one link that shows that the Existence of Planck time has been proven, observed, or otherwise detected.

I'll give you a small primer: Planck time is the smallest amount of time that we could theoretically measure. Any smaller unit of time, whether it exists or not, would be useless. This is, of course, only true with our current knowledge, and within current theories. Alternate theories without discrete units of time, or different ones, also exist.

Now, please come up with some definite proof that it does exist. I know you won't, because A) It cannot be found and B) You never came up with any proof for any of your allegations, so why change now? Just be blunt and call more names, that'll help.
Really, if you're so worried about not having an effect, come with some backup to your statements. Even wikipedialinks are valid. Anything. At all. I have, you haven't, and you really cannot expect people to change their mind if you just call them stupid, and have nothing to show.

[Ampersand]

Siquo, http://physics.nist.gov/cuu/Constants/RevModPhys_80_000633acc.pdf <- Read that please.