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Author Topic: What turns you off about DF?  (Read 308839 times)

Reasonableman

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1170 on: December 17, 2009, 12:19:51 am »

I've never really hit that performance barrier, myself. But then, my only problem with DF might be the reason behind that: I'm a terrible perfectionist, so all my forts turn out almost perfectly... identical. I follow a very set formula for building them and so it gets pretty dull pretty quickly. I'm hoping that, as interaction with the world beyond your fortress increases in complexity, so will the possibilities for fort design.
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Blacken

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1171 on: December 17, 2009, 12:21:47 am »

Performance.

Yeah, I know it can't be fixed easily. But I have learned to adapt to pretty much everything else. It's just that there is a not-all-that-hard-to-hit limit after which I can't play anymore because the framerate implodes. Then I stop playing DF for a couple weeks.

It's kinda funny.  My first week or so playing this I made the comment that it was rather ridiculous to need a $5000+ computer to play a game with hardly any graphics.  I thought I was exagerating at the time....  Someone even made fun of me for saying it.  I think in retrospect this appears to be a very, very common and serious drawback to the game.
I play on an $800 laptop and can swing pretty big fortresses, usually 5x5 or 6x6 with mountains. I intentionally limit myself to 100 dwarves and kill off any extras, but I mean, seriously, all the cool stuff tanks performance. Rivers? Ow. Waterfalls? OW. Sieges? OH GOD OW. Clowns? AAAAAAAAAAH MAKE THE SINGLE FRAMES STOP (well, flaming clowns anyway). I love the detail, and as a programmer myself I know how much of a cast-iron bitch it can be to make complex stuff run at a reasonable pace, but it still really is what throws me out of playing.
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Roxorius

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1172 on: December 17, 2009, 12:34:49 am »

Performance increases only somewhat on better machines, sadly. Clockspeed has been pretty static for years, and parallel processors make up the new trend of "faster" computing power. I mean, it does probably handle DF better than an ancient computer, but until DF supports multi-threading there's no way to have a blazing fast fortress at 200+ dwarves.

The real problem with DF? Interface issues and three different keys (like F9, Enter, and Space) often doing the same function in different contexts. The controls need far more uniformity and logic.
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Halmie

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1173 on: December 17, 2009, 12:53:10 am »

Links at the download page to a guide. I tried three times to play DF till I found this.

I just didn't understand how to do anything. A simple guide that says: -> that is the designations menu, press d then d again if you want to dig would of helped immensly.
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Graebeard

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1174 on: December 17, 2009, 12:55:41 am »

Idiot dwarves.

Actually, this is one of the things I love about the game.  It frustrated me to no end when I started, but now I (gladly) view it as a challenge and play accordingly.  Don't want to wall in your dorfs? Designate walls in the proper order and they won't get stuck.  Don't want them to go halfway across the world to get raw materials for workshops?  Learn the custom stockpile system.

If it were any easier, or if the dorfs were any smarter I think I'd have gotten bored already.
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Cheddarius

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1175 on: December 17, 2009, 01:12:34 am »

Actually, this is one of the things I love about the game.
To each his own, I guess. But for my part, I think I'd rather make a challenge for myself (glass tower, etc.) than have the challenge be that all your dwarves are compulsively trying to kill themselves.
But hey - again, to each his own; let every player find fun his or her own way.
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Asmodeous

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1176 on: December 17, 2009, 09:56:43 am »

...but the stupid dwarves are the source of 90% of the "lulz" (it hurt me to type that) that you get from DF.
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Andir

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1177 on: December 17, 2009, 01:10:53 pm »

There is mouse functionality for designations, but it's not very good.  You should be able to use it as if you were using a mouse in MSPaint when it's zoomed all the way in.  Drawing boxes, fills, circles, etc.

It would be nice to be able to select a dwarfs, right click and have a menu open with context sensitive options for what you have selected.  Also, right hold drawing: Right button hold, draw a box, release button, menu pops up, select dump, hide, harvest or whatever is possible with said items.
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Halmie

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1178 on: December 17, 2009, 07:52:33 pm »

There is mouse functionality for designations, but it's not very good.  You should be able to use it as if you were using a mouse in MSPaint when it's zoomed all the way in.  Drawing boxes, fills, circles, etc.

It would be nice to be able to select a dwarfs, right click and have a menu open with context sensitive options for what you have selected.  Also, right hold drawing: Right button hold, draw a box, release button, menu pops up, select dump, hide, harvest or whatever is possible with said items.

Not enough mouse control. You got my vote.
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Flaede

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1179 on: December 18, 2009, 07:05:31 am »

On a similar note, I don't like having to go rescue dwarves that accidentally strand themselves on top of a perch or behind a wall during construction. I nearly lost 5 dorfs that way.

Bahaha! They're idiots, it's why you're in charge.
I LOVE that part. It reminds me of Lemmings.
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Cheddarius

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1180 on: December 18, 2009, 12:34:36 pm »

On a similar note, I don't like having to go rescue dwarves that accidentally strand themselves on top of a perch or behind a wall during construction. I nearly lost 5 dorfs that way.
I heard there's a fix for that: Suppose you want to wall up a room. Build one wall inside the room, adjacent to your "real" wall, and suspend it. Build the "real" wall. Your dwarf will go to build the real wall, but he can't do it while standing on a suspended construction, so he'll do it from the other, safe side - from outside the room. When you're done, remove the order for construction on the fake wall.

However, if you're building an actual long wall with 10 tiles, you'd have to build each tile individually which would be annoying.
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Graebeard

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1181 on: December 18, 2009, 05:24:51 pm »


However, if you're building an actual long wall with 10 tiles, you'd have to build each tile individually which would be annoying.

Actually, I just build 9 at once, and then go back for the last one when they're done and all my dorfs are safe.  It also works really well to just build corners either first or last, depending on whether you're on the inside or outside of the walls.
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numerobis

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1182 on: December 18, 2009, 08:08:23 pm »

Lack of uniformity in the UI is the biggest problem with DF at the moment, has been forever.  I've been playing a long time, and I still get confused whether I need k, q, v, or t to look at what I want to know, and the f8/enter/space issue, and arrows vs +- vs the secondary selection, and so on.

There are some excellent tutorials out there, and there's the wiki.  They're all third-party, but I think it's low priority for DF itself to incorporate any.  If you want to avoid linking directly to somebody's website, link to a google search for dwarf fortress wiki and dwarf fortress tutorial.

Better speed would be nice, too, especially faster pathfinding.  I feel dirty whenever I figure out there's an ambush because suddenly the world stopped.  But that's not what gets me annoyed at the game, and it's not what drives my friends away: the UI is.
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Devast

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1183 on: December 19, 2009, 04:08:16 am »

Idiot dwarves.

This.
Dwarf walling himself in=kinda frustrating but nothing serious
Dwarfmarksman wondering aimlessly by himself outside the fort AFTER I tell the squad to stand down=WTF arhhhh.
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CanadianWolverine

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Re: What turns you off about DF?
« Reply #1184 on: December 19, 2009, 07:03:31 pm »

There is mouse functionality for designations, but it's not very good.  You should be able to use it as if you were using a mouse in MSPaint when it's zoomed all the way in.  Drawing boxes, fills, circles, etc.

It would be nice to be able to select a dwarfs, right click and have a menu open with context sensitive options for what you have selected.  Also, right hold drawing: Right button hold, draw a box, release button, menu pops up, select dump, hide, harvest or whatever is possible with said items.

Not enough mouse control. You got my vote.

Agreed, between not having the above mouse selections (which seems odd considering all the functionality seems to be there, just with a vast list of keys to be memorized instead), ASCII, and no in game tutorial for beginners, those were what first stumped me big time. Er, what am I saying, it still stumps me, I just boot up DF and watch the original party go crazy and die of neglect or the wildlife and then read stories about other people's amazing forts, like Boatmurdered and stuff. Still love DF though - I know, I am crazy.
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