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[mattmoss]

I had an idea to create a fortress or "city" of hermits: dwarfs restricted to a cell with a bedroom, dining room, workshop, and meditation garden. Input stockpiles would provide the hermit with raw materials, while output stockpiles would hold the results of the hermit's labor, to be taken by haulers to other hermits as needed.

I have a basic setup working, although it could stand improvements. Check out:
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showpost.php?p=9527481&postcount=910

If you have a moment, comment there or here. I'd certainly appreciate any suggestions.

[uberubert]

This is interestingly pointless... I like it

Anyways, if you connect three doors, throw the lever, then connect the other three doors, wouldn't you have one lever to alternate all doors with one flip?

[mattmoss]

This is interestingly pointless... I like it

Anyways, if you connect three doors, throw the lever, then connect the other three doors, wouldn't you have one lever to alternate all doors with one flip?

No, IIRC, I tried something like that once before, but with floodgates, and it doesn't work. The lever has an on/off state, and everything connected to it matches that state. So if you tried it like you suggest, when you throw the lever again, only the first group would flip, and you've have all doors in the same state.

[Jim Groovester]

So you want to seclude certain dwarfs from the rest of society while at the same time having an army of dwarfs that supply them? Pointless is definitely a way to put it, but it's certainly doable.

What would be cool is if you could devise an automatic delivery system. One way I could see doing it is if you had a narrow path above the hermit guy's location with a distinct entrance and exit. On the path would be a narrow stockpile.

The way it would work is that the exit is blocked, so a dwarf has to go through the entrance. A pressure plate raises a bridge that blocks the entrance and opens the exit as the dwarf puts the item in a stockpile. As the dwarf exits, he triggers a pressure plate that briefly activates a waterfall to push the items off into the hermit's area, and on the last tile, a pressure plate will block the exit and open the entrance, ready for another dwarf to haul more goods to the pile.

I think the design has a few kinks to work out, but I could see it working.

[Frelock]

You know, if you added a 3x3 garden, and a brewery, then you could eliminate the need for food and drink inputs and barrel outputs.  Sure, it would take up more of your hermit's time, but it seems to me that a hermit should do his own gardening.

[mattmoss]

You know, if you added a 3x3 garden, and a brewery, then you could eliminate the need for food and drink inputs and barrel outputs.  Sure, it would take up more of your hermit's time, but it seems to me that a hermit should do his own gardening.

Yeah, my first inclination, actually, was to have the hermit do his own gardening. I actually irrigated the central 5x5 section to start this, and there is certainly plenty of room to have more workshops... up to four 3x3 workshops where the mason's workshop is at the moment.  It would certainly also give the hermit more to do, less idle time.

Can't remember why I didn't... of course, this was an experiment, so I think I was just focusing on getting *something* working, to see what did and didn't work. Considering the issues I had with food (other dwarfs scamming his booze, etc), having the hermit do his own farming/brewing/etc would be a definite win.

[mattmoss]

So you want to seclude certain dwarfs from the rest of society while at the same time having an army of dwarfs that supply them? Pointless is definitely a way to put it, but it's certainly doable.

Pointless? It's a game, a sandbox, and I imagine the point is to play and have fun. I wanted to see how effective a fortress of hermits could be where the majority would be enclosed... and see how far I could minimize the number of haulers.

What would be cool is if you could devise an automatic delivery system. One way I could see doing it is if you had a narrow path above the hermit guy's location with a distinct entrance and exit. On the path would be a narrow stockpile.

The way it would work is that the exit is blocked, so a dwarf has to go through the entrance. A pressure plate raises a bridge that blocks the entrance and opens the exit as the dwarf puts the item in a stockpile. As the dwarf exits, he triggers a pressure plate that briefly activates a waterfall to push the items off into the hermit's area, and on the last tile, a pressure plate will block the exit and open the entrance, ready for another dwarf to haul more goods to the pile.

I had an initial idea of having an animal pit over a narrow tunnel that was open at one end. The dog would be assigned to a hauler, so it always was nearby. The hauler would drop the animal in the pit and, on its way out, it would run over one or more pressure plates. I hadn't considered your idea of having the stockpile incorporated with that and just having the dwarf run over it.

Part of the reason I didn't try the pressure plates yet is simply because I never used them before. I knew how to use levers, so I just made a basic lever design first. But I may try the plates next.

But yeah... the goal is to make it as automatic as possible, because while the idea of a hermitage is cool, I don't want to be micromanaging everything. (Though I'm afraid the isolation will essentially force that.)

[uberubert]

Building mega clear glass towers is also pointless, but yeah, fun! I'm gonna try out variants of this technique the next time I play a fortress. Anything pointlessly and overly complexly automated = fun
Who knows, maybe it actually proves to be more efficient productionwize?

[KrunkSplein]

Reminds me of my idea for a Flintstones-style garbage disposal.  It was essentially a self-sustaining hermit wedged on a Z-level between the main fortress and an underground feature (magma, flowing water, or bottomless pit).  Here's a from-the-side mock-up:

F O R T R E S S
----   --------------------
H E R M I T
--------  ----------  -----
MORE FORT | C H A S M 

The hermit has his own little farm, still and craftsdwarf workshop.  There is a hole in his roof designated as a dump.  There are two holes in his floor - one for finished goods leading to the rest of the fortress, one is for refuse leading to the chasm.  Bones and shells dropped down get used in crafts/bolts, everything else gets dropped down the garbage chute.

Serves virtually no purpose, and it's fairly assured that the garbage man will eventually go crazy, but still seems fun.

Actually, you can extend the idea and create a bonafide caste system: the top layer has nobles and a few "servants" (read: porters).  Raw materials get dropped into various holes, and two levels down finished goods magically appear.  The workers trapped in the middle layer have to fend for themselves for food.

Yay for pointless!

[Arkose]

Actually, you can extend the idea and create a bonafide caste system: the top layer has nobles and a few "servants" (read: porters).  Raw materials get dropped into various holes, and two levels down finished goods magically appear.  The workers trapped in the middle layer have to fend for themselves for food.

I think it would be more Dorf-like to have the higher castes living deeper, with raw materials being dumped from above to be used below:

Surface Level: The Undesirables. Tree Cutters, Surface Farmers, Surface Fishers, Surface Hunters, Surface Herbalists. Live in small wooden huts, if they are lucky. PRODUCES: Wood, Food, Hides, Bones, Shells.
Depth 1: Trade Depot, Underground Farming and Carpentry. The Bookkeeper, sullied by trade with outsiders, lives here. CONSUMES: Wood. PRODUCES: Beds, More Food, Hides, Bones.
Depth 2: The Kitchens, Breweries, Leatherworks and Craftsdwarf's Workshops. CONSUMES: Food, Bones, Hides, Shells. PRODUCES: Crafts, Meals, Booze. NOTE: Alcohol is only permitted to Depth 2+ Dwarves. Pity the surfacers!
Depth 3: Masonry and Mechanisms. PRODUCES: Furniture, Stone Blocks, Mechanisms, etc. Minor nobility lives here.
Depth 4: Glass and Metal. PRODUCES: Glass, Weapons, Armor. The military elite resides here, along with higher nobility.
Depth 5: The Crown Jewelry and artifact treasure vault. There is never more than one Jeweler at a time; the rest are made into porters along with the soap smiths and cheese makers. The King and Queen live here, together with the royal guard.

Porters use special segregated tunnels (that can be dumped into from production levels, but can't be used to move goods the other way) to transport items to be traded to the outside.

There are special service tunnels that are usually closed that can allow military units to reach higher levels in order to put down uppity peasants. The levers that open these are securely located in the royal guards' headquarters, protected from any mad craftsdwarves or skulking filth.

[Sinergistic]

I was about to post what KrunkSplein said, about having holes in the ground marked as garbage dumps (the garbage dump needs to be NEXT to the hole, not over it, fyi) which seems like the best way to implement an 'air-lock' like system. Raw goods get dumped into the hermits area from above, and he dumps out finished goods to an area below.

It shouldn't take much micro. You will still need a stockpile for finished items (to get them out of the workshop/whatever for easy dumping), and instead of you (The Player) activating a lever, you would just mark them for dumping.

If you really want a more dwarf-controlled method, a bridge and a door might work, but I'm not sure about the on/off state of both of those linked together.

If it works like I think it would...
LEVER ON: Door is open(?) bridge is up(?)
LEVER OFF: Door is closed(?) bridge is down(?)

So a single pull of the lever raises the bridge and opens the door, allowing the hermit into the tranistion array, but not over the 'chasm' under the bridge. Another pull shuts the door and lowers the bridge, letting haulers in to take things away.

[Sinergistic]

Double posting:

This would make, as someone else already pointed out, a really cool caste themed fort. I would just reverse the order.

Raw materials come in at the top of the fort, near the surface, and get processed into shoots/transition rooms leading to various workshops with workers of differing quality levels.

Those workers, in turn, produce items, which are then shunted into other rooms, blah blah.

The theme would be that, as you (the dwarf) advance in skill level, you get to move deeper into the fort, replacing existing workers, who in turn get to move down.

The caveat, of course, is that almost all of the dwarfs (minus some haulers/fort expansion experts (miners/jack of all trade dwarfs)) are isolated. You might get a little social interaction during immigration before you sort all of your new dwarfs into there appropriate homes, but on the whole, very few friends would be made (hopefully, anyway). So, when a dwarf reaches reaches the bottom of the fort, it means he is legendary, or close it, and has almost zero friends.

As the fort goes on, you would end up with more and more dwarves ending up legendaries, and making their way to the bottom of the fort. After a while, all the dwarves would be at the bottom. That is no fun. So: Kill off the legendary when a new legendary shows up. Evil? yes. Fun? yes.

Then, more migrants show up, and the process repeats.

I have to run a fort like this.

[KrunkSplein]

So: Kill off the legendary when a new legendary shows up. Evil? yes. Fun? yes.

You missed the best part.  A new Legendary Jewelcrafter has arrived?  He has to fight the existing Legendary Jewelcrafter for the right to stay below!

And so it continues.

One Legendary of each skill lives at the bottom, getting their food and supplies delivered to them from above.

[Puck]

While I seriously like your garbage dump hermit ideas... how are you going to actually do it, without micromanaging dumping all the time? You cannot place stockpiles over empty ground. I mean, you could try a waterfall that washes down some stairs with grates on the lowest level to drain the water but keep the stuff. I dont know if you can designate stockpiles over grates, but on the lowest, the output level, its probably not necessary. (Right now I can see an ubar complex contraption of waterfalls, stairs and drainage grates to move items around - that's actually great stuff to try).

But like you guys described it, confined garbage sorting hermits would either need waterfalls or airlock systems.

[Sinergistic]

While I seriously like your garbage dump hermit ideas... how are you going to actually do it, without micromanaging dumping all the time? You cannot place stockpiles over empty ground. I mean, you could try a waterfall that washes down some stairs with grates on the lowest level to drain the water but keep the stuff. I dont know if you can designate stockpiles over grates, but on the lowest, the output level, its probably not necessary. (Right now I can see an ubar complex contraption of waterfalls, stairs and drainage grates to move items around - that's actually great stuff to try).

But like you guys described it, confined garbage sorting hermits would either need waterfalls or airlock systems.

What? Have you ever tried place a garbage dump (a zone, designated from the 'i' menu) next to a chasm or channeled out area? (Note the NEXT TO, that is important.) Dwarves will throw the things down into the chasm or channeled out tile instead of just placing them on the ground.

The stockpile would merely be a means to getting the items out of the workshop for easier dumping.