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[PTTG??]

Afterburn damage is drastically increased, but only lasts as long as you're alive. Toss in some HP reduction too. Now you have to run in, ignight, and get away again without being killed.

[miauw62]

Default afterburn needs a buff imo.
i dont know how much damage it does atm, but i can hardly get any kills with it.
Say, we keep the afterburn time, but we increase the damage so it does 100 damage when not healed. (i'm certain it does less damage now).
That would actually make it a threat to most classes, instead of the quite-weak thing it is now.

[Enzo]

Default afterburn needs a buff imo.
i dont know how much damage it does atm, but i can hardly get any kills with it.
Say, we keep the afterburn time, but we increase the damage so it does 100 damage when not healed. (i'm certain it does less damage now).
That would actually make it a threat to most classes, instead of the quite-weak thing it is now.

It seems particularly strange for someone hating on ambush-pyro weapons (backburner, for instance) to be supporting increased afterburn.

Afterburn deals 60 at max (slightly more with minicrits) if I'm correct, with about a thousand ways to extinguish yourself before then. Lighting a bunch of people and running away should be no more than an annoyance or a last-ditch option, which it is now, rather than a legitimate damage-dealing strategy. I make no exaggerations when I say that the first thing I learned in TF2 was how to run into a group of enemies and light them all on fire. Don't bitch about newb pyro weapons and then say afterburn needs a buff.

[miauw62]

I dont hate on the ambush part of the backburner, i hate on the +10% damage part.

[The Scout]

The 10% Dmg doesn't mean much. The crits from behind are more concerning.

[cameron]

So, in an effort to bring my spyplay up I've been trying to learn to use the Amby effectively. I figured out a bind to disable viewmodels when using the Amby (to prevent my precious auto-reloads from totally blocking the screen), that's helping a lot. But I just played a few rounds of knifeless spy and I need some assistance. Y I no got headshoots? Is there some trick to this, or just lots of practice?

I did manage to get the achievement for headshotting 3 scoots though. Still need the Sniper one.

mostly its just practice, some other things that can help are disabling mouse acceleration and making a bind to lower sensitivity for when you are trying to make a shot

[miauw62]

The 10% Dmg doesn't mean much. The crits from behind are more concerning.

The crits from behind, pff, i barely see them used.
If you are an ambush pyro, you should not be able to take on a default pyro on straight-on.
Recently i made a anti-bb tactic.
Its basically making sure they cant reach healthpacks, and keeping your back to one if you need it, then just doing the regular pyro versus pyro combat.

So, in an effort to bring my spyplay up I've been trying to learn to use the Amby effectively. I figured out a bind to disable viewmodels when using the Amby (to prevent my precious auto-reloads from totally blocking the screen), that's helping a lot. But I just played a few rounds of knifeless spy and I need some assistance. Y I no got headshoots? Is there some trick to this, or just lots of practice?

I did manage to get the achievement for headshotting 3 scoots though. Still need the Sniper one.

mostly its just practice, some other things that can help are disabling mouse acceleration and making a bind to lower sensitivity for when you are trying to make a shot

Also, i dont use the ambassador, because the default revolver actually does ALOT of damage, you wouldnt say at first, but a few good shots can take out most low-health classes (if i'm right, 4 of the 9 classes), granted they are already damaged.
But the ambassador needs time between shots to do crits on heads, i think.

[Siquo]

Because when I think of skill-full flame-thrower use rewarding people for merely touching foes with a bit of flame immediately comes to mind.

Depends on what you define as skillful. Twitch aim is a skill, but putting yourself in a tactical position so you can hit&run is a skill as well. The increased afterburn (damage or time?) would also increase the usefulness of extinguishing, suddenly jarate is more useful, for instance.

So we've got: Slow Boil
+afterburn damage
+afterburn duration
-damage
-health
-damage cone

I'd play that.

As for the ambassador, it can only headshot when the crosshair is at it's smallest, and then the shot will hit the exact center of that crosshair. After that first shot, you need to wait a second or so until it's at it's smallest again.

[miauw62]

Hm, now we only need somebody to pump up a model.
What would it look like?
I *could* try and see if i can blender something togheter, even tough i'm not really expirienced with that.
Also, remember, we already have a lazer flamethrower, a home-made one, a even more home-made one and a home-made one with a special nozzle.
Soooo...
Mayby this could be a specialized flamethrower, comparing to the normal flamethrower as a racing bike to a normal city bike.
Aka, cool streamlines, neat and smooth textures...

[cameron]

I think some kinda loss to health would be neccesary as just buffing afterburn at the expense of particle damage would just lead to suicide charging pyros

somthing else you could do instead of just lowering particle damage is greatly lower max ammo (say cut it in half), that with a health reduction would push pyros to retreat instead of just flamming till they die

[Siquo]

I think some kinda loss to health would be neccesary as just buffing afterburn at the expense of particle damage would just lead to suicide charging pyros

And this is different from the current pyros how?

[miauw62]

I think some kinda loss to health would be neccesary as just buffing afterburn at the expense of particle damage would just lead to suicide charging pyros

And this is different from the current pyros how?

Oh, so true xD
Well, its diffrent from good pyros.
Survival is the key to victory.

[cameron]

I think some kinda loss to health would be neccesary as just buffing afterburn at the expense of particle damage would just lead to suicide charging pyros

And this is different from the current pyros how?

presumably you did not want to add a weapon so that people could play exactly as they do now

[Strange guy]

The crits from behind, pff, i barely see them used.
If you are an ambush pyro, you should not be able to take on a default pyro on straight-on.

Considering how the flamethrower mechanics (S+M1 gets you out of range unless they W+M1 but particle mechanics mean the retreating pyro will win, airblast) turn pyro fights into 'who has the shotgun' (and whose better with it if both do) backburner pyros should be equal. And even if it does come down to flaming the two 'Aero' flamers shouldn't be the better option. The backburner is fine, sure it's the straight up best option for terrible pyros, but it's not good enough to maker them a threat and at higher skill levels it's not a problem (though could do with some tweaks, I use the degreaser but people who use the BB say the crit angle isn't really enough).

Afterburn is easy to apply, and often easy to remove. You'd need to complicate things a bit to make a decent afterburn based flamethrower, and even then getting the right mechanics wouldn't be easy. Also backburner and degreaser are very good for what they do while being decent all rounders as well (especially degreaser). It would be hard to make a sidegrade to them.

[miauw62]

Yeah, i read that.
But i think we need to remove/reduce the bonus anyway, since you have now convinced me that the 10% is not a big deal, we should convince the terrible pyros it isnt a big deal either, so they have a bigger chance of choosing something else. AKA, reduce bonus to 5%?
Also, mayby expanding crit angle is a good idea.
Not 180 degrees tough, that would be too much. 140 degrees? a bit less? a bit more?