Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Stove]

The dwarves in Dwarf Fortress have their origins in Norse mythology. Mead has a lot of significance in Norse mythology, so I find it unacceptable that Dwarf Fortress has no mead!

In fact, I have several problems with the way Dwarf Fortress deals with alcohol:

1. Though fungus is a necessary part of fermentation, it can not itself, as far as I know, be fermented into alcohol. I might be wrong, since I couldn't really find any info comfirming this, and I suppose we could just say that the fictional mushrooms in Dwarf Fortress do produce fermentable sugars, so it isn't really a big issue for me.

2. All types of alcohol in Dwarf Fortress are made in a "still". A still is for making distilled liquors, so it would make sense for rum and whiskey, but not for beers and wines and the like, which are not distilled. To be honest, I'm not sure what word would be ideal for this building. Beer is made in a brewery, wine in a winery, mead in a meadery... I'm not aware of any general term.

Similarly, the job for creating an alcoholic beverage in this building is "Brew a drink". Technically this would only refer to making malted beverages such as beer and ale.

3. The drinks are created almost instantaneously. In reality, fermentation takes at least a couple weeks, depending on the type of drink. Perhaps a wort/must barrel should be created instead, which is racked or distilled after two to four weeks, becoming the final product.

4. While grapes do not require the addition of water to become wine, creating beer does require water. The fact that you don't need water to produce any of the drinks in Dwarf Fortress makes me wonder... Is longland grass really juicy?


But the biggest problem I have is the lack of mead!

Perhaps beehives could spawn outside similar to the way cave spider webs do (but not so plentifully). A dwarf can gather it, turning it into a honeycomb object, which can be processed into liquid honey and beeswax (which would become useful when candles are implemented). The brewer would turn honey and water from a bucket into the must that would become mead.

Also, I imagine that, since the ingredients for mead come from the outdoors, some people might be inclined to suggest that mead be more of an Elven/Human drink than a Dwarven one. I disagree with this on the basis that the Mead of Poetry, from Norse mythology, was created by dwarves.

[profit]

1) Done this way because it adds fun, not realism.
2) Done this way because it adds fun, not realism.
3) Done this way because it adds fun, not realism. Also keeps frustration down.
4) Done this way because it adds fun, not realism. But this likely may change.

Beehives need bee's, Bee's need flowers'   Unless this was heavily abstracted it would cause massive lag.

If it was massively abstracted, odd things WILL occur with it.

Perhaps honey could be purchased from caravans, but beehives appearing on the land would require a lot of checks and calculations to make their appearance not appear arbitrary and random.

[Pilsu]

There's nothing "fun" in instant mix juice. It's done that way because cooking in general is a placeholder

I don't like plump helmet brewing personally, they're so easy to grow there should be a downside


Water usage is planned

Unless you can think of a better word, still it is. Breaking it into a dozen workshops wouldn't really add anything into the game. Making it bigger might make sense considering the amount of equipment it holds. Then again, I'd prefer if the equipment wasn't abstracted and the workshop was instead defined as a room

[Capntastic]

Beehives need bee's, Bee's need flowers'   

Minor nitpick, but there's no need for any of the apostrophes in this sentence.

Anyways, mead will mos' 'def be in, once there's more to food production than there is now.   Bear in mind that a lot of stuff in DF right now is placeholder stuff until more solid systems can be grown into the framework.

[qwertilliopasd]

But the biggest problem I have is the lack of mead!

Mod it in!

For example, putting:

Code: [Select]

[MATGLOSS_PLANT:HIVE_BEE]
[TILE:127][COLOR:2:0:0]
[NAME:bee hive][NAME_PLURAL:bee hives]
[DRY][BIOME:NOT_FREEZING]
[GENPOWER:1]
[DRINK:mead:2:0:0]
[DRINKVALUE:3]
[EXTRACT:honey:6:0:0]
[EXTRACTVALUE:20]
[EXTRACT_BARREL]
[EXTRACT_COOKABLE]
[SPRING][SUMMER][AUTUMN]
[SEED:0:0:1]
[FREQUENCY:100]
[CLUSTERSIZE:5]
[EDIBLE_RAW]
[PREFSTRING:gentle hum]
[SEED:2:0:0]into matgloss_plant.txt would create a "plant" called a bee hive that when brewed creates mead, and that can have cookable honey extracted out. They will grow in the wild, and you can "build beehives" by planting them.
(NOTE: I have not tried this plant. Before using, check for facepalm-level mistakes  )

[tsen]

I personally would welcome a more robust and challenging food and drink system, especially aging distilled spirits.

[Footkerchief]

1) Done this way because it adds fun, not realism.
2) Done this way because it adds fun, not realism.
3) Done this way because it adds fun, not realism. Also keeps frustration down.
4) Done this way because it adds fun, not realism. But this likely may change.

Beehives need bee's, Bee's need flowers'   Unless this was heavily abstracted it would cause massive lag.

If it was massively abstracted, odd things WILL occur with it.

We already have anthills and ants (as vermin), you know.  Bees could be handled exactly the same way, except with FLIER and a weak little VERMIN_BITE (like cave spiders already have).  The game could invisibly increase the traffic weight of areas near beehives so that dwarves could avoid them intelligently.  The honey collection itself could be as simple as taking a bucket to the hive and coming back with a bucket full of honey (optionally destroying the hive in the process?  maybe depending on a Beekeeper skill?).

Modeling nectar collection from flowers would be completely unnecessary -- herbivores don't even eat grass yet.

[Granite26]

1. Though fungus is a necessary part of fermentation, it can not itself, as far as I know, be fermented into alcohol. I might be wrong, since I couldn't really find any info comfirming this, and I suppose we could just say that the fictional mushrooms in Dwarf Fortress do produce fermentable sugars, so it isn't really a big issue for me.

Dwarves can live off of Plump Helmets... Ergo they have carbohydrates...  Ergo they ferment.

If they don't have carbs, there's worse problems in the game than that they ferment.

BTW, has Nutritional Value as a food item property been discussed?

[Footkerchief]

Dwarves can live off of Plump Helmets... Ergo they have carbohydrates...  Ergo they ferment.

If they don't have carbs, there's worse problems in the game than that they ferment.

Mushrooms do have starches, so yeah, they should be fermentable in some sense (I think fermenting yeasts produce their own amylase? maybe?).  They also have chitin which could maybe be converted to simple sugars as long as you had the right chitinases, but I don't know what that would involve.

[Seryntas]

If any humanoid race has chitinases in their digestive tract, it's dwarves.

[Hectonkhyres]

I, for one, can't wait for the day booze is handled in-game as it is in mundane life. It would make things quite interesting to have to warehouse your wine in casks in a sealed room for at least a season or two before it is drinkable... with further seasons adding quality modifiers right up to the point the stuff turns drinkable.

This is right up there with actually being able to build bars for your dwarves to fill their alcohol fuel cells at. Anything to throw a couple extra twists in the soul-eating routine of running a fortress is a good idea. Anything. Mead, distilled pinecones that make you go blind (brand named 'Glug' for bonus points), whatever.

[Footkerchief]

If any humanoid race has chitinases in their digestive tract, it's dwarves.

Maybe you could use dwarf stomachs for brewing, like with calf stomachs and rennet.  That'd be an interesting fell mood.

[Hectonkhyres]

The dwarf would shovel a dozen kilos of vaguely fermentable material down his gullet, drink several liters of fluid, and then run around frantically (foaming at the mouth, of course) before vomiting copious amounts of alcoholic dwarf-hurl into every available container in the fort?
...
I really don't know how I should feel about this.
On the one hand, frothy mugs of dwarf-hurl. On the other, frothy mugs of dwarf-hurl.

[Footkerchief]

On the one hand, frothy mugs of dwarf-hurl. On the other, frothy mugs of dwarf-hurl.

Like Edward Fortyhands!

[Hectonkhyres]

It would be simpler, and possibly more awesome, to just install and old fashioned spigot in the dwarf's navel. He would have to turn the spigot (with the characteristic *squeeky* sound), hold the mug under the nozzle, and then grind down like he is immensely constipated. Then you have a mug of beer.

The funny thing is that I don't see such a thing putting the drinker off one damn bit.