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[Deathworks]

Hello!

Thank you.

I am not a history major, but I am a German born in the 70s. My critical attitude is probably mostly due to personal experiences with the irrational handling of things here in Germany. A minor contribution is probably thanks to my general philosophical views. So, I am just an amateur in this field.

Deathworks

[popers]

Why people find it hard to believe in Holocaust? Because such cruelty is unimaginable for the people of XXI century.  It simply fails to fit into our frame of references. It's pretty easy for me, since in my country nearly every family lost someone (shot, hung, gassed, famished - whatever, you name it)  during the nazi occupation but for someone from, say, across the ocean it's unthinkable and, frankly speaking, hard to believe. It's much easier to make up some conspiracy theory, as it happens in so many cases.

[Mulch Diggums]

Its not hard to believe at all, there are pictures after all. I think its either racism or maby perhaps some sort of german ties that make them stuborn over this topic.

-edit- Also, stop trying to derail the thread damnit, woose.

[Neonivek]

Why people find it hard to believe in Holocaust? Because such cruelty is unimaginable for the people of XXI century

I don't know if this counts... I mean... I think Stalin's Genocide was over 5 times larger (Death toll is still being counted... last I checked it was like 21 million)

Though I guess if we added the treatment in the camps rather then just plain killing people... then maybe

Note: Name may be incorrect.

[Hawkfrost]

Its not hard to believe at all, there are pictures after all. I think its either racism or maby perhaps some sort of german ties that make them stuborn over this topic.

-edit- Also, stop trying to derail the thread damnit, woose.

Hey, I'm not a racist or have german ties.
I just don't believe in anything.
People will always argue about everything, so I tend to stay neutral in these subjects.

[inaluct]

I just don't believe in anything.

What about Enki?

[Hawkfrost]

I just don't believe in anything.

What about Enki?

Why must you always attack me?
I have done nothing to you.

[Cthulhu]

You've chosen to remain neutral on subjects, the veracity of which only an ignorant or stupid idiot would deny.  That could be considered a personal offense.

[inaluct]

I didn't actually attack you.

Cthulhu isn't expressing the particular reason I asked that question, but he has a strong point. Being neutral on some things is like saying "uhhhmmmm im not really sure if gravity exists i guess." You can't really expect people to just see that as some kind of compromising view. They'll see it as stupid.

[Gunner-Chan]

Neutrality is very bad for some subjects, and impossible for others. Even worse is that neutrality can imply tolerance.

To be honest though, it's impossible to know for sure how many died from overt acts of genocide and how many were simply neglected to death, though most likely all the body's recovered from the confirmed death camps were deliberate acts of genocide.

[Neonivek]

"Neutrality is very bad for some subjects, and impossible for others. Even worse is that neutrality can imply tolerance"

It comes from a false sense of Neutrality that people attribute with growing older. That there is no black and white and only grey.

The fact of the matter is that the Grey area is often a Razor Blade...

Which is why the term Moderist has started to form into a negative connotation which refers to someone who will always take the middle road despite it often not being appropriate.

Mind you... there are crazy people who will turn a multifaceted situation and transform it into two decisions.

Ohh Black and White... Why must you perplex me so?

[Squeegy]

http://xkcd.com/258/

this is more relevant: http://xkcd.com/154/

[Neonivek]

Comic 154 is scary on two fronts

1) The Overimportance of Science
and
2) Everything else.

As long as people don't scientifically renounce ethics using science Ill be alright...

[inaluct]

1) The Overimportance of Science

What are you, some sort of baboon? The comic is right; science is extremely important. It's much more important to our future than religion, for instance.

It isn't like we're going to go Ayn Rand and all start being selfish assholes because we're all so "objective" or anything, either.

[Squeegy]

Make me believe in the Holocaust.

Okay, I'm sorry, but FUCK YOU. No one should have to make you believe in the Holocaust, just like no one should have to make you believe George Washington was once president, or that Rome existed. Those are undeniable facts. Are you saying that all the books written about firsthand experiences in the Holocaust are fakes? Made up? That people who were in concentration camps are lying? That Anne Frank's diary is a novel? Fictional? Honestly, fuck you. I hate Holocaust deniers worse than 9/11 deniers and moon landing deniers.