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[Sowelu]

actual game design stuff

I am curious what criticism a Puzzle Pirates in Space would get.  Is this post (linked by the quote) too simple?  Not simple enough?  Fun, unfun sounding?  Ideally your ship would get a couple friends and then hire some random filler players, then accept some scientific or military mission, heading out somewhere, get in a couple fights, do a couple plot puzzles, then head home after 30-120 minutes of workfun...

[Servant Corps]

Physics is HARD to handle right, and not because the simulation is difficult.  It's hard to make it fun.  Go play "Terminus" if you want a realistic physics space game.  It's pretty comical sometimes, like when you fill up your freighter with gold and head back to base and your ship doesn't move because you are so massive that youre thrust barely accelerates you, and then once you're moving the collision light comes on before you can even see the starbase, and you only avoid a crash by frantically, slowly dodging off to the side.  But you quickly discover that fast maneuverable ships have INSANE advantages, and also that space combat is pretty boring that way.  Early BC3k versions had messed up combat where fighters would go by so fast you couldn't even see them.  But it's realistic!  Heck, even Terminus put horribly arbitrary caps on velocity, because otherwise the game would suck.

* Servant Corps plans on downloading Terminus.

[Sowelu]

* Servant Corps downloads Terminus.

Unfortunately, the game balance is also hosed.  If you get attacked by pirates when hauling that gold you are totally dead.  But if you don't, that one haul pretty much gets you enough money to afford anything in the game.  In less than an hour or so.

[Ampersand]

Einsteinian Physics Fail.

If you actually could travel at the speed of light and throw a peanut straight in front of you, such that it actually was surpassing the speed of light, which it can't, it would travel back in time and hit the other spaceship before you even decided to throw the peanut, thereby breaking causality.

[beorn080]

Seriously though, use a missle. If you go at your max speed and then launch the missle, it has relative speed, plus the speed generated from it being launched. It could probably go straight through an entire ship, just leaving a hole through it. You get bonus points for putting a rope on the missle and repeatedly using that one missle to string multiple ships together. Sow a sweater out of all the ships!

You don't know physics do you?

No clue whatsoever.

I do know physics, and what he suggests is possible given greater then lightspeed drives, at least depending on how lightspeed is acheived. If you slide into another dimension, that tactic won't work. If however you simply break the speed barrier, it is possible that that attack plan could work.

Another fun strategy is if you have lightspeed and your opponent only has slower then light sensors. Then you can burst inwards at the opponent and attack before they even see you leave.

Also Einstein was a poser.  We are assuming lightspeed is possible, and thus are assuming Einstein would be, in that game world, acting like a dervish in his grave.

[Sean Mirrsen]

There's a problem with throwing ANYTHING out of the airlock at lightspeed. By the time you push the button to open the airlock, you will have overshot the target by several thousand parsecs because of relativistic time compression.

[Sowelu]

Einsteinian Physics Fail.

If you actually could travel at the speed of light and throw a peanut straight in front of you, such that it actually was surpassing the speed of light, which it can't, it would travel back in time and hit the other spaceship before you even decided to throw the peanut, thereby breaking causality.

...then drop a peanut out the airlock...

No throwing involved.  And really, even if you're only travelling at point nine cee, you're getting more than four-fifths the energy of the peanut half of a peanut-antipeanut explosion.  The only problem is that when you go much slower than light speed, your enemy gets the chance to DETECT you and raise shields...and that's not something you want.

And Beorn, I don't know of many sci-fi series that actually claim to break the speed barrier.  Mostly they warp space, including Star Trek and I think also Star Wars, so "there" is right next to "here" and then they just trundle across before unwarping it.  Makes it a lot easier to stop that's for sure!  Getting up to near light speed with impulse drive is actually way harder than going to warp in many settings, and often requires less energy with whatever exotic stuff they have.

There's a problem with throwing ANYTHING out of the airlock at lightspeed. By the time you push the button to open the airlock, you will have overshot the target by several thousand parsecs because of relativistic time compression.

So you drop the peanut at a light-minute out SUBJECTIVE.    God knows how far out you are, but surely you can do something like that.

[Yanlin]

Einsteinian Physics Fail.

If you actually could travel at the speed of light and throw a peanut straight in front of you, such that it actually was surpassing the speed of light, which it can't, it would travel back in time and hit the other spaceship before you even decided to throw the peanut, thereby breaking causality.

Or you could just fly a bit slower and have DF style throwing.

There's a problem with throwing ANYTHING out of the airlock at lightspeed. By the time you push the button to open the airlock, you will have overshot the target by several thousand parsecs because of relativistic time compression.

THIS is the real problem.

[Sean Mirrsen]

There's also the problem that space isn't empty - and if you generate some kind of forcefield to avoid annihilating yourself with microparticles and space dust at lightspeed, then whatever you throw will instantaneously be vaporized.

Oh, and if you like Newtonian battles, play Independence War 2 - Edge of Chaos. Even when you employ flight assist (vector-to-course and space brakes), most battles consist of either tailing or jousting.

[beorn080]

I've read a couple of books that had "plausible" methods for obtaining greater then lightspeed without sliding to another universe.  Besides, I did say that it would be impossible to do such a tactic if C+ speed was acheived through alternative travel.

[Empty]

I think I'm going to make a capital ship sim demo in my opengl engine.

 

[Sowelu]

I think I'm going to make a capital ship sim demo in my opengl engine.

 

Ooo!  What's the gameplay going to be like?

[Yanlin]

I've read a couple of books that had "plausible" methods for obtaining greater then lightspeed without sliding to another universe.  Besides, I did say that it would be impossible to do such a tactic if C+ speed was acheived through alternative travel.

We must harvest the conservative scum to build light speed engines!

(LCS reference.)

[Sowelu]

I giggled.

[dreiche2]

I do know physics, and what he suggests is possible given greater then lightspeed drives,

Uhm, that's not proper physics anymore, anyway.

Also, "almost" light speed is good enough for the peanut example.

There's a problem with throwing ANYTHING out of the airlock at lightspeed. By the time you push the button to open the airlock, you will have overshot the target by several thousand parsecs because of relativistic time compression.

That is nonsense. Hey just saying!