Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Il Palazzo]

I Let's just be glad that it's not to the level of the inquisition.

Is it not?(even when considering the popular belief about inq.)
What about Guantanamo?

[mainiac]

What about Guantanamo?

Being cynical does not give you a blank check to express any negative view and have it be reasonable.

Guantamano Bay is a place where 80 likely guilty people have been denied habeous corpus and another 200 not particularly guilty people endure illegal imprisonment.  No attempt to influence the prisoners religious beliefs has been made.

The Inquisition refers to intentional religious persecution across an entire country.  For every person held illegally at Gitmo, 10 people were tortured to death in the inquisition.  For every 1 at Gitmo, 50 people were imprisoned then forced into a belief by the inquisition.

There's plenty of real, legitimate reasons to criticize the Bush presidency.  But coming up with stupid, baseless statements like gitmo is an inquisition is just being a jackass who thinks too much of himself.  But then again, being a jackass who thinks too much of himself is what being a truther is all about.

[Il Palazzo]

Jeez, mainiac. Did I really give you any reason to call me a jackass?

Sure, the comparision is a long shot, but not completely unbased:
Inquisition(in popular culture) = otherwise unlawful imprisonement and torture of people labeled as 'heretics'.
Guantanamo = otherwise unlawful imprisonement and torture of people labeled as 'terrorists'.
In both cases the label in question is enough to discard the local laws, so that one can get rid of people deemed dangerous to the ruling powers. In both cases the presumption of innocence is ignored. In both cases the propaganda is in motion to make populace accept the blatant unlawfulness of such actions.

For every 1 at Gitmo, 50 people were imprisoned then forced into a belief by the inquisition

Should it operate as long as the inquisition did, the numbers would be just about right.

Sure, the motives for being labeled heretic and terrorist are different, but the mode of action is similar enough to justify comparisons.

Also, if by thruther you meant a believer in a 9/11 conspiracy, then you're shooting at the wrong target.

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

Well now that Obama is president, Fox News can finally start believing in government conspiracies again.  That ought to be "highly entertaining" to ironically quote some Fox News bimbo.

[Jude]

It's always really funny watching conservative media cry me a river about how Obama is going to ruin the country

The irony of the last 8 years it seems is utterly lost on them

[mainiac]

For every 1 at Gitmo, 50 people were imprisoned then forced into a belief by the inquisition

Should it operate as long as the inquisition did, the numbers would be just about right.

Sure, the motives for being labeled heretic and terrorist are different, but the mode of action is similar enough to justify comparisons.

The Spanish inquisition was technically in effect for 400 years, but the vast bulk of the persecution happened in the first 10 years.  Gitmo has been going for seven years.  It's no where near the inquistition.

Yes, the label "terrorist" is used against opponents all the time, often incorrectly.  And the US does indulge in this behavior.  But Gitmo isn't in any way shape or form a manifestation of that labeling.  Countries label a group terrorists because they want the right to unilaterally deny recognition; like Isreal called Fatah terrorists to kill the notion of Palestinian independence or Putin calls Chechnyans terrorists to avoid having to talk to them.  Bush and friends labeling of the Gitmo detainees is completely different.  They didn't imprison Bin Laden's driver because he had a legitimate complaint against us and they needed to shut him up.  They imprisoned him because they thought (stupidly) that he really was conspiring to forward the cause of terrorism.

An inquisition is the persecution of beliefs that people are entitled to have.  There was no belief that Gitmo was ment to suppress.  Any comparison between Gitmo and an inquisition is highly disengenious and I can't respect an opinion that lumps them together so casually.

[Il Palazzo]

I think you're overreacting.

Take out the 'belief' part and compare these notions now.
The whole point is not in the reason for these persecutions, it's in the simple fact that there are persecutions, and the way they're executed.

In the same fashion, I'd readily compare 'war on terrorism' with any other religious war out there, not because I suggest that Bush's adminstration is(was) filled with holy wrath against muslim faith, but because it uses the same form of propaganda to justify/disguise it's political and military goals.

[Fishersalwaysdie]

It's always really funny watching conservative media cry me a river about how Obama is going to ruin the country

The irony of the last 8 years it seems is utterly lost on them

He won't fix it either, I guess you prefer ruin as your status quo.

[Jude]

He won't fix it either

I'm glad you are able to know this based on 5 days of his presidency

Can you tell me what stocks to invest in for when the market comes back, too? Or how I can get the girl up the street to smash with me?

[mainiac]

Take out the 'belief' part and compare these notions now.
The whole point is not in the reason for these persecutions, it's in the simple fact that there are persecutions, and the way they're executed.

Your so called "inquisition" was done to save lives.  The actual inquisition placed very little value in human life.

You can't just say something doesn't matter because it doesn't fit into your argument.  We're talking morality, and morality can't be judged without the context.  If I got in a plane, hunted you down and killed you, that would be murder and I would be rightly condemned for it.  But if you killed me, it would be self defense and people wouldn't condemn you (baring further context differences.) The same action, completely different moralities.

But you are taking two actions that aren't even particularly simuler and saying the must have have the same morality because it's easier to understand that way.  Very fallacious.

[Fishersalwaysdie]

He won't fix it either

I'm glad you are able to know this based on 5 days of his presidency

You might be more glad to know I knew it before he became the president.

Can you tell me what stocks to invest in for when the market comes back, too?

No, but I could tell you that if you don't invest in any you won't make profit.

 Or how I can get the girl up the street to smash with me?

Remove your nerd integrity, you can start by shaving the beard. And try to interact with her instead of posting about her on a forum about dwarves.

[Jude]

You might be more glad to know I knew it before he became the president.

That's even better holy shit

I guess you can call the 2016 election winner at this rate easy

Remove your nerd integrity, you can start by shaving the beard. And try to interact with her instead of posting about her on a forum about dwarves.

I should have added she likes me but she doesn't smash so how do I engineer the situation please tell me with your infinite wisdom

but tbh I'm more interested in hearing precisely how Obama's going to run us further into the ground

[Captain Hat]

Easy fellas, you all remember what happened last time we got into politics.

[Torak]

Easy fellas, you all remember what happeneds last every time we got get into politics.

[Ioric Kittencuddler]