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[Azkanan]

Toady, if you release DF on the 23rd, I will hate you!

That's my birthday. I won't be able to play it all day =[

Sadface.

[mendonca]

Anyway, today's dev log mentions adventurers interacting with the underground in some unspecified way... intriguing.  Awakening things that weren't meant to be awoken, maybe (although I don't know why that would require the area to be stored as a site).

Yes .. intriguing is just the right word. He is toying with us.

Could it be something to do with the previously mentioned animalmen hunting camps? Have I just made this up?

[Shoku]

Toadyverse kobolds are good at catching snakes, so presumably they could save up a bunch of venom and use that to bag larger game.  Wonder how much cobra venom an elephant could stand.  Or what it would do to one, for that matter...

Acetylcholine probably doesn't have much variation between mammals as if it did I don't see why cobras would have something so effective against humans if it didn't work on a wide enough group of things they'd ever want to eat/defend against.
*The venom is an analog of acetylcholine that blocks the nerve receptors and doesn't fall back out nearly as quick as acetylcholine, meaning you rhythmic muscle contractions get fouled up, which is slightly troublesome with the whole breathing thing.

[Rockphed]

Toady, if you release DF on the 23rd, I will hate you!

That's my birthday. I won't be able to play it all day =[

Sadface.

If memory holds, the final section will take at least a week to do.

[Quatch]

Will storing invisible sites cause places visited first in adventurer mode to be selectable as dwarf-mode fortress sites? or, more awesomely, can we reclaim with a different/overlapping footprint?

[Totaku]

Let me go an explain what Toady said back a while ago late last year since it seems some people are forgetting how long the final phase will take...

The "explore minor compat issues" could take a few days.

The "any remaining tests" is likely to take a while.  That consists of the kind of pre-release, "stop crashing!" kind of stuff I can't pass off to all of you, as well as all kinds of weird things that need tackling to get the presentation up around the low 40d standards (all wilderness tree names display as plurals now, to name one of a zillion little things that have cropped up -- they are all dirt easy to fix, but there are dozens and dozens of them), and there are a few promises I made and a few quick requests that made it in before I decided I can't take anything else on ("handle a few misc. bug reports and minor interface requests that have arisen").  You'll have more than your fair share of bugs to find, no doubt, and I'll be spending at least a month post-release cleaning those up and doing bugfix releases, as usual.

The 40d# merge will take an unknown amount of time.  On paper, I just need to structure my code files the same way as 40d#, do a few easy diffs and translate over all the interface tokens into the new format.  However, there's no way it's going to be that nice to me.

Anyway, I'm acting now as if I can get it out by the end of the year, and when that doesn't work out, there shouldn't be that much left.

Of course he also said he thought the underground could be done in a week. But it obviously took longer because there were lots of things he had to tackle (plus the H1N1 virus). But we are coming close to greening one of them now.

Judging on where we stand, it's clear Toady's going to tackle the rope ladders based on his dev blog. He's got most of the  elements there, there's just the programing that needs to be done and that could take several days to a week depending on the complexity of the rope ladder which is why I'm anticipating the underground to be completly green by the 31st (which will mean February 1st when he puts it up on the forum).

Then we follow up with the final section....

If everything is true, then compacting should take only a few days 3 -4 at most.

Any remaining test on the other hand could be the big monster. Even if Toady's been busy working on it though the time, it'll mean he'll have to run through Fortress Mode, Arena Mode, and Adventure Mode for a long period of time to see if everything plays out without crashing. And if what I heard about how Toady's computer is like, it'll take a little bit of time. (this could take anywhere between a week if nothing goes wrong, but if things start turning up it could be 2-3 weeks.)

The 40d## merge will really all come into play as Toady communicates with Baughn who's is doing this for him. And at the same time it's important to note that Baughn's still waiting for Toady to get done to a certain point so he can release the 40d17 version (which is the final version from what I recall) Personally though Open GL shouldn't be a hard process to cover, but communication is key here. I expect this could take somewhere between 2-4 days though he already performed the initial steps for that one.

But what didn't mention in the post are the other he'll be doing in the finalization...

Fixing the cat bug (that could be done in 15 minutes if he's taking the easy route, but if he's doing something differnt, then 2 days)

Fixing the hydras (This could require a mix of Arena and Fortress mode testing 2-3 days)

And fixing the interface and some bug issues that have been posted in the forum (this could takea few days to a week to do)

Overall I think February will be deticated to finalizing and we probably won't see the game's release till most likely late February or Early March. But I'm not going to truely say anything till the underground is done which I'm still expecting that section completed on the 31st of this month.

[smjjames]

Dang, the release just gets slowly bumped back (or forward based on the analogy) by a snowplow or something.

But hey, thats the nature of game development.

[SirPenguin]

I highly doubt we'll see rope ladders at all. That's a big project that affects a lot of areas all at once, especially pathfinding and the definition of a construction. If he didn't find time for formations or other venom features then I can't imagine he'd tackle something so big at this stage in the game.

Indeed, I'm very much hoping by Friday he'll be able to say he's done with all the major content pushes to the game, and can finally begin cleaning up.

[smjjames]

Yea, the rope ladders aren't critical since they were going to make things easier. Toady is likely already treating things as if he wasn't going to do the rope ladders to make sure that it is possible to access places whether by making a forward base or digging your way to it.

[Totaku]

I highly doubt we'll see rope ladders at all. That's a big project that affects a lot of areas all at once, especially pathfinding and the definition of a construction. If he didn't find time for formations or other venom features then I can't imagine he'd tackle something so big at this stage in the game.

Indeed, I'm very much hoping by Friday he'll be able to say he's done with all the major content pushes to the game, and can finally begin cleaning up.

Mmmmm... maybe your right, this might be bigger than expected, but I guess if there is one thing that comes to mind regarding the pathfinder, is asking how long did it take Toady to work on the path finder that made up the 3D world of DF (yeah I'm lazy and I could just look it up probably, but I'm sort of busy anyways..)

I mean we know this item was one of of Toady's possibly not going to be included for this version list. But so were some other things, heck even the booze for Soldier thing was on that list, but you what, it got done.

Still by the way Toady said this...

I'm hoping to be through with all the life-related checks for the underground tomorrow, which would leave the map-related stuff and that rope ladder issue.

It makes me think he's going to do this...

Regardless of that though wouldn't a rope ladder be treated in the same light to how stairs work?

I mean we can make ropes already that we tie our dogs to warn us of thieves and predators.
So couldn't we just make ladders act like a set of Up/down stairs with the exception of the top and bottom and call it a ladder?

Course there are some questions that I would be curious about... if we really our going to make a ladder work.

Main things like:

Would the rope ladder be constructed via (B)uilding or would it be done with workshops?

Would we be able to make a ladder vary in length much like how bridges and stuff our made?

Will our dwarves be able to pull the ladders up and drop them down in the location depending on if they need access to the area? And would that be done manually or automated like a switch, or both?

If we have a dwarf climbing a ladder and the other dwarf pulls it up will he be able to pull it up with him on it? And if so, would there be a weight limitation to how much a Dwarf can lift up at the same time?

Will the ladders be flamable, and can they be cut to prevent a vicious underground monsters from attempting to climb your ladder?

What method would the ladder be nailed or tied to the wall to prevent it from falling?

Would it be limited to only allow Dwarves and other humanoid creatures to use the ladder (last thing I'd want to see is a donkey or some other four legged animal that has no fingers of thumbs climbing it, but I doubt he's gotten that far with that.)

I think that covers all my bases of the rope ladder That does sound like alot, though I keep thinking he has plans to cover most of the basics on this.

[Exponent]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I highly doubt we'll see rope ladders at all. That's a big project that affects a lot of areas all at once, especially pathfinding and the definition of a construction. If he didn't find time for formations or other venom features then I can't imagine he'd tackle something so big at this stage in the game.

Indeed, I'm very much hoping by Friday he'll be able to say he's done with all the major content pushes to the game, and can finally begin cleaning up.

Mmmmm... maybe your right, this might be bigger than expected, but I guess if there is one thing that comes to mind regarding the pathfinder, is asking how long did it take Toady to work on the path finder that made up the 3D world of DF (yeah I'm lazy and I could just look it up probably, but I'm sort of busy anyways..)

I mean we know this item was one of of Toady's possibly not going to be included for this version list. But so were some other things, heck even the booze for Soldier thing was on that list, but you what, it got done.

Still by the way Toady said this...

I'm hoping to be through with all the life-related checks for the underground tomorrow, which would leave the map-related stuff and that rope ladder issue.

It makes me think he's going to do this...

Regardless of that though wouldn't a rope ladder be treated in the same light to how stairs work?

I mean we can make ropes already that we tie our dogs to warn us of thieves and predators.
So couldn't we just make ladders act like a set of Up/down stairs with the exception of the top and bottom and call it a ladder?

Course there are some questions that I would be curious about... if we really our going to make a ladder work.

Main things like:

Would the rope ladder be constructed via (B)uilding or would it be done with workshops?

Would we be able to make a ladder vary in length much like how bridges and stuff our made?

Will our dwarves be able to pull the ladders up and drop them down in the location depending on if they need access to the area? And would that be done manually or automated like a switch, or both?

If we have a dwarf climbing a ladder and the other dwarf pulls it up will he be able to pull it up with him on it? And if so, would there be a weight limitation to how much a Dwarf can lift up at the same time?

Will the ladders be flamable, and can they be cut to prevent a vicious underground monsters from attempting to climb your ladder?

What method would the ladder be nailed or tied to the wall to prevent it from falling?

Would it be limited to only allow Dwarves and other humanoid creatures to use the ladder (last thing I'd want to see is a donkey or some other four legged animal that has no fingers of thumbs climbing it, but I doubt he's gotten that far with that.)

I think that covers all my bases of the rope ladder That does sound like alot, though I keep thinking he has plans to cover most of the basics on this.

All of that focuses largely on an attempt to model rope ladders realistically.  For the time being, I'd be satisfied with simply being able to construct up or up/down stairs from above, where a down or up/down stair already exists.  To make it slightly fancier, make a separate type of stairs from the current type, make them only buildable using rope (or chain, cloth?), and make them only buildable either on the same level or downward, in contrast to the current stairs being buildable on the same level or upward.  Operate deconstruction in a similar reversed fashion.

You'd get none of the fancier effects, but you'd be able to extend downward, the main feature being sought after currently.  And if you had to build it with rope, then it would make it at least a little harder; you wouldn't be able to simply pick up a nearby stone and make it.  So it wouldn't feel like a complete exploit.

[tomato]

yay, underground should be ready by weeks end!

[abculatter_2]

How much power do you plan on giving modders over buildings?
Will we eventually be able to have buildings which require power to function, or which spawn creatures (particularly members of the player's civilization/race) as well as items?
Will we eventually be able to have buildings which allow teleportation, whether between two buildings or simply set to a waypoint? Will we be able to have migrations require and be spawned on a building?
Will any of this be possible with some kind of script?
Will it be possible to change the siege alert text (A vile force of darkness has arrived!) to something else?
Will we eventually be able to make vehicles, with customizable tiles and sizes and be able to set man/dwarfpower requirements on certain functions of those vehicles (such as a tank firing its gun, or a driller drilling) and attach skills to those positions, and have those skills affect performance?
Will this be possible with some kind of script?
When can we expect any of this, if ever?

[Azkanan]

How much power do you plan on giving modders over buildings?
Will we eventually be able to have buildings which require power to function, or which spawn creatures (particularly members of the player's civilization/race) as well as items?
Will we eventually be able to have buildings which allow teleportation, whether between two buildings or simply set to a waypoint? Will we be able to have migrations require and be spawned on a building?
Will any of this be possible with some kind of script?
Will it be possible to change the siege alert text (A vile force of darkness has arrived!) to something else?
Will we eventually be able to make vehicles, with customizable tiles and sizes and be able to set man/dwarfpower requirements on certain functions of those vehicles (such as a tank firing its gun, or a driller drilling) and attach skills to those positions, and have those skills affect performance?
Will this be possible with some kind of script?
When can we expect any of this, if ever?

You are supposed to Email these in.

[abculatter_2]

How much power do you plan on giving modders over buildings?
Will we eventually be able to have buildings which require power to function, or which spawn creatures (particularly members of the player's civilization/race) as well as items?
Will we eventually be able to have buildings which allow teleportation, whether between two buildings or simply set to a waypoint? Will we be able to have migrations require and be spawned on a building?
Will any of this be possible with some kind of script?
Will it be possible to change the siege alert text (A vile force of darkness has arrived!) to something else?
Will we eventually be able to make vehicles, with customizable tiles and sizes and be able to set man/dwarfpower requirements on certain functions of those vehicles (such as a tank firing its gun, or a driller drilling) and attach skills to those positions, and have those skills affect performance?
Will this be possible with some kind of script?
When can we expect any of this, if ever?

You are supposed to Email these in.

Oh.
Well, if anyone has the answer to them, they can tell me here.

Also, I forgot to mention in that post, for anyone who cares the questions are for an idea for a Warhammer 40K Ork Fortress mod in some future version.