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[Hoborobo234]

How would a nuke even work? haha i could see a giant firestorm that destroys buildings that would roll over your entire map--maybe have it trigger cave ins? TOADY I WANT TNT TO MINE WITH!

Think about it, its the perfect counter to walls! have it destroy and collapse walls so it could help you mine out large areas and for sieges you could have petards with barrels of black powder to smash your fortifications.

TNT is extremely undwarfly.

You're right, It's too stable

[smjjames]

How would a nuke even work? haha i could see a giant firestorm that destroys buildings that would roll over your entire map--maybe have it trigger cave ins? TOADY I WANT TNT TO MINE WITH!

Think about it, its the perfect counter to walls! have it destroy and collapse walls so it could help you mine out large areas and for sieges you could have petards with barrels of black powder to smash your fortifications.

TNT is extremely undwarfly.

You're right, It's too stable

How about Dynamite or Nitroglycerin? I think Dynamite is a somewhat more stable form of nitro, but still somewhat unstable.

Theres gunpowder if we are keeping to the time period...

[Hoborobo234]

How would a nuke even work? haha i could see a giant firestorm that destroys buildings that would roll over your entire map--maybe have it trigger cave ins? TOADY I WANT TNT TO MINE WITH!

Think about it, its the perfect counter to walls! have it destroy and collapse walls so it could help you mine out large areas and for sieges you could have petards with barrels of black powder to smash your fortifications.

TNT is extremely undwarfly.

You're right, It's too stable

How about Dynamite or Nitroglycerin? I think Dynamite is a somewhat more stable form of nitro, but still somewhat unstable.

Theres gunpowder if we are keeping to the time period...

No. Gunpowder is too "modern". I say using a high-alcohol booze.

[smjjames]

Well, Toady chose the 1400's, which was right at the beginning of the 'modern' era vs the middle ages, so there are many things which overlap.

Someone needs to find out what explosives were used before the development of gunpowder in China and its introduction to Europe.

Theres this Greek Fire stuff, but it sounds more like a flamethrower with burning tar or something than an explosive.

[Hoborobo234]

It catches fire, not explodes. Thats been around for millenia though and maybe we could have some bloated demonic thing that has an [EXPLOSIVE] tag or what ever and acts like a suicide bomber. We could have the opportunity to catch and tame one and then extract a fluid from it that is an explosive.

[Playbahnosh]

Well, Toady chose the 1400's, which was right at the beginning of the 'modern' era vs the middle ages, so there are many things which overlap.

Someone needs to find out what explosives were used before the development of gunpowder in China and its introduction to Europe.

Theres this Greek Fire stuff, but it sounds more like a flamethrower with burning tar or something than an explosive.

Well, if Toady chose the 1400's, gunpowder is a viable solution.

The first reference of gunpowder is possibly the passage of the Zhenyuan miaodao yaolüe, a Taoist text tentatively dated to the mid-800s CE:

But I agree, it's not very dwarfly. I suggest strong spirits, tar or crude oil, maybe plant-oil. Or... as I suggested in the turd-thread: methane!

[Neonivek]

Yes but when Toady said 1400s it is more of a rule of thumb then absolute. It between history and style: So while Toady looked at pre-1400s medicine for where to put it he has also said no to such ancient devices as batteries

Toady said he would support Gunpowder through mods but it won't be in Vanilla if I remember correctly.

[madjoe5]

Yes but when Toady said 1400s it is more of a rule of thumb then absolute. It between history and style: So while Toady looked at pre-1400s medicine for where to put it he has also said no to such ancient devices as batteries

Toady said he would support Gunpowder through mods but it won't be in Vanilla if I remember correctly.

Yea, I see what you mean. Gunpowder wasn't used in much else other than some siege weapons and fireworks anyway. Plus guns weren't in use till about the 15th century anyway, less that 10 or so years after the 1400 mark anyway, so make of that what you think.

Plus these cannons, guns and contained explosions were still overshadowed by the mechanics and brute force of other weapons anyway.

[Playbahnosh]

Yes but when Toady said 1400s it is more of a rule of thumb then absolute. It between history and style: So while Toady looked at pre-1400s medicine for where to put it he has also said no to such ancient devices as batteries

Toady said he would support Gunpowder through mods but it won't be in Vanilla if I remember correctly.

Well, modding in gunpowder is so easy I think it will be completed even before release. You only need to add a puff of smoke and call it "gun" insted of crossbow, and make it shoot bullets instead of arrows. Also, substitute ballistae with cannons, add puff of smoke and add the "make cannonball" job to the foundry and make it use iron. Also, gunpowder barrels that explode when come in contact with fire. That's all there is to it. But I think I still think it's very undwarfly.

[barkalot]

I've been checking this latest developments almost everyday for the last few months as well as this thread, and I still have no idea when the new version is going to come out.  Can we get some sort of a rough estimate on a date?  I can't keep doing this.

[smjjames]

Sometime next month....

[atomfullerene]

Alcohol explosions may be more dwarfy (but would they really want to waste the booze?), but widespread use of gunpower for war actually predates widespread distillation of alcohol for drink, which just barely squeezes inside the 1400 guideline.  But hey, whatever works...

[PTTG??]

While I'm all for whatever Toady One's ideals are for the world, I think supporting gunpowder as a modding possibility is a perfectly reasonable thing, even if it takes a little extra time. After all, a lot of natural and magical effects are similar to gunpowder explosions.

[SirPenguin]

I've been checking this latest developments almost everyday for the last few months as well as this thread, and I still have no idea when the new version is going to come out.  Can we get some sort of a rough estimate on a date?  I can't keep doing this.

Due to the holidays and sickness I wouldn't expect anything earlier than the first week of February

[KillerClowns]

I hope I don't regret this.
Potential reasons to use leather over plate, not all of which will be implemented next version:

Generally cheaper (not as much in the case of dwarves, though)

Requires less training to use effectively (for, say, militias)

Lighter (will be more important if thin ice, pit traps, and such get implemented)

Generally easier to maneuver in (I've heard of plate mail clad soldiers being able to maneuver unhindered, but I feel safe in assuming this is more true of ☼Steel Plate Mail☼, and possibly ≡Steel Plate Mail≡, than of Steel Plate Mail churned out by freshly grabbed cheese makers)

Possibility of non-standard leather (megabeast leather armor, depending on the megabeast, might be like wearing Kevlar)