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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items  (Read 3576552 times)

Neruz

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7530 on: November 28, 2009, 04:53:51 am »

Why would you dive-bomb with a ranged weapon, unless you're dropping it?

Reese

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7531 on: November 28, 2009, 04:58:51 am »

Gameplay wise this gives us two-four mechanics for people ontop of mounts.
1) Natural Aim difficulty for attacking while on mounts
2) Bodyplacement for mounting, hands required
3) Movement alterations for body placement
4) Chance movements (moving the mount in specific ways to improve aiming but little else)

maybe more

got another rule for ya, though it might more apply to use of whatever riding skill is implemented: quality of gait.  Horses and otehr ungulates run using primarily their legs, predators like felines and canines tend to use their whole body to bound forth at high speed (watch the worg riders in Peter Jackson's two towers movie) Horses tend to make fairly stable archery platforms (for an experienced rider who can compensate for what movement does occur, anyway... just look at Mongol horse archers as a historic example) Quality of a mount's training might also have an effect on how stably it moves... give ya a reason to train up a legenrady animal trainer.  ;D

Now, I would like to see multiple dorfs with crossbows in a howdah on a war elephant.
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G-Flex

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7532 on: November 28, 2009, 05:48:24 am »

The point was, I don't think it's a good idea to assume that all mounts make aiming harder. Who knows if some animal is very smooth in movement? Birds gliding for example. *points at Giant Eagle mounts* It's a very simple task to aim then.

If that eagle's moving, yes, it's going to be harder, because the arrow has momentum in the direction of the eagle's flight.  This requires the archer to aim their shot in a way that your typical archer has absolutely no familiarity with.

Exactly. You literally cannot aim at the spot where your target is, since you have to take your own movement vector into account.
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CobaltKobold

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7533 on: November 28, 2009, 06:07:47 am »

Exactly. You literally cannot aim at the spot where your target is, since you have to take your own movement vector into account.
Unless they're moving same as you. Then it's about right. (Why not perfect? Air resistance will be different. Acts like a wind the other way.)
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Moddan

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7534 on: November 28, 2009, 06:34:27 am »

I have to two questions regarding the new release.

The first one ist how metal or stone skinned creatures like bronze collossus and ironman perform now against
normal weapons. Do you still have a chance to impale them with a copper spear or does the new layering system prevent that?

The second one is about the needed sparring time to achive champion status. In my opinion it's too fast as it is now in 40d. In my new fortress I got my wrestlers to champion status in less than a year, giving both attackers and roaming monsters a very hard time.
Will it take longer in the new release to train military up to elite and champion status?
I think it should take 1/2 to 1 year to train to normal, 2-5 years to elite and at least 8-10 years to achive champion status, making them very rare.

I remember to had great fun with a bronze colossus in one of my first fortresses. It was an earlier build so it didn't get roflstomped in world gen.
Back then I didn't now how to train my soldiers and so my half-assed attempt to get rid of him failed. Because I couldn't defeat him and since he was endangering migrants and merchants alike, I build a great wall around him. Had a great time learning that he can topple walls...
But it was great fun to create several plans to destroy the collosus, including ballistas, cave ins and alike.
Now I would just train my military up in no time and a squad of champion wrestlers would take him down without any problem.

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Footkerchief

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7535 on: November 28, 2009, 06:48:33 am »

The first one ist how metal or stone skinned creatures like bronze collossus and ironman perform now against
normal weapons. Do you still have a chance to impale them with a copper spear or does the new layering system prevent that?

I believe a copper spear won't be able to pierce a bronze colossus, although it could probably dent it or even shatter it, if the wielder were very strong.  It will definitely be a lousy weapon against a bronze colossus, regardless.  They'll be very hard to kill.

The second one is about the needed sparring time to achive champion status. In my opinion it's too fast as it is now in 40d. In my new fortress I got my wrestlers to champion status in less than a year, giving both attackers and roaming monsters a very hard time.
Will it take longer in the new release to train military up to elite and champion status?
I think it should take 1/2 to 1 year to train to normal, 2-5 years to elite and at least 8-10 years to achive champion status, making them very rare.

Wrestlers in particular level up way too fast in the current version, yes.  The system for skill/attribute gains has been totally reworked, so yeah, you can expect some changes for the better.  Also, "champion" is now a title bestowed by the baron on a single soldier
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Outcast Orange

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7536 on: November 28, 2009, 12:47:18 pm »

A bug free test? Unheard of.
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Christes

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7537 on: November 28, 2009, 02:56:51 pm »

It will definitely be a lousy weapon against a bronze colossus, regardless.  They'll be very hard to kill.

I would love to see a SoF take on a Bronze Colossus, though.
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JoshuaFH

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7538 on: November 28, 2009, 05:10:13 pm »

Will temperature be handled differently in the new version?
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Footkerchief

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7539 on: November 28, 2009, 05:13:45 pm »

Will temperature be handled differently in the new version?

In terms of creature damage, yes.  I'd elaborate but I'm not sure that's what you meant.
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Neonivek

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7540 on: November 28, 2009, 05:14:15 pm »

Will temperature be handled differently in the new version?

I wouldn't see why other then allowing body temperature to affect things a creature touches instead of through tags.
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JoshuaFH

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7541 on: November 28, 2009, 05:17:50 pm »

Will temperature be handled differently in the new version?

In terms of creature damage, yes.  I'd elaborate but I'm not sure that's what you meant.

Let me try to elaborate real fast. Will there be a thermometer so we can tell how hot or cold it is in any given location? Will body temperature be taken into account when things live under for a long time? Will things like insulatory and conductive materials be used at all to help protect from the cold?
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Footkerchief

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7542 on: November 28, 2009, 05:33:34 pm »

Let me try to elaborate real fast. Will there be a thermometer so we can tell how hot or cold it is in any given location? Will body temperature be taken into account when things live under for a long time? Will things like insulatory and conductive materials be used at all to help protect from the cold?

Thermometer: no, not in dwarf mode (as far as we've heard, anyway).  Adv. Mode already has this (shift+P).

Body temperature when things live under... ground?  As of 11/07/09, there aren't major temperature variations in next version's caverns (except for magma-dwelling creatures, obviously).  It was mentioned a long while back that fixed-temperature creatures might become somewhat more vulnerable to hostile climates, but I don't know where that's at now: "Individual tissue layers on body parts can sluff off or boil now, after suffering melting/boiling effects while remaining intact for a short time. They can also be damaged by heat/cold/burning as before. I still have to handle temperature effects for liquid and gaseous layers -- the only vanilla DF cases are things like magma-men, which wouldn't currently take damage because they have fixed temperatures. I'll either put that off or move them away from fixed temperatures to just enough homeothermy that they can stand being in caves but not out by glaciers, or something. The more relevant applications might be mods involving water creatures that could freeze or boil during regular game conditions."

Insulation: here's the most recent word on it, sounds like it isn't changing that much from the current system:

Quote from: Igfig
how do tissue layers interact with environmental effects, like temperature and gases?  Do outer layers insulate and protect inner ones?  Can poisons and wounds affect that by, say, changing tissue permeability or exposing inner ones?

Temperatures are still tracked by BP, so insulation uses tissue properties but still just determines the overall number.  There are some pervasive ramifications in extending it, so it's not necessarily an easy project.  Wounds have some exposure effects, but not on temperature.  I think contact poisons do a bit with it, but there are also some BP-pervasive effects where there shouldn't be.
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Neonivek

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7543 on: November 28, 2009, 06:10:15 pm »

Hmm Adventurers have Thermo vision?
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Footkerchief

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Re: Future of the Fortress: List of Remaining Items
« Reply #7544 on: November 28, 2009, 06:16:18 pm »

I think it just pops up a little announcement, like the weather button does.  Checking it now.

edit: yeah.  "It is warm."
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