Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Neonivek]

Yeah but it removes an "Edge of the world" sorta deal

Then again I am also reminded that Toady isn't entirely against a HFC layer.

As for HFC becoming like a Bottomless pit... It makes perfect sense. Afterall it isn't that it is bottomless it is that it leads to an even bigger HFC outside the field of play. (Yay I didn't even need to use spoilers)

[SirHoneyBadger]

It doesn't remove it, it only makes you search for it a little bit harder.

[Mel_Vixen]

Well for what do we use bottomless pits right now anyway? Mostly only for garbage disposal, dumping water and alike. A real use they dont seem to have.
The new caves work fine for the critters a bottomless pit would spawn right now. garbage disposal might be a bit more tricky now but i think magma-incinerators and quantum-compactors work fine enough for that.

And no artefacts get lost in the nothingness any more.

[SirHoneyBadger]

All good points, although I do still hope that Toady will use the HFS idea, whatever it may be. Having truly bottomless pits show up now and again would still be awesome, and making them rarer (along with the epicness of connecting them to HFS) would enhance that.

[Footkerchief]

I, for one, would prefer it if the hole were so deep that you had to explore (as per the new system) to find the bottom. By leaving it unexplored, it effectively IS bottomless.

This doesn't cover the contingency of what happens if a falling dwarf gets a glimpse of each Z-level before he dies, but that could be handled easily by making exploration not happen while airborne.

Big holes and chasms would still be welcome, but they don't need the Bottomless tile at the bottom.

Agreed.  I don't care whether a gaping crevice is really truly bottomless as long as helpless creatures can get hurled into it and fall out of sight.  Oh, and garbage.

[SirHoneyBadger]

Question (or a couple?) for Toady: You've mentioned that currently, there is only the potential for a single "growth spurt".

I'm assuming that is directly equivalent to the current "Child" to "Adult" transition, that we're currently seeing in the game?

Also, is that single growth spurt set in stone? Or could there be more in the future? I really strongly feel that enabling a set of dramatic changes (as opposed to straightforward growth) over the course of a being's lifetime would be a lot of fun to play with and very useful, when applied to many monstrous critters, as a modding tool.

I'm fine with it taking a long time to add, but I hope that you'll atleast consider it for sometime in the possible future?

[Narmio]

I, for one, would prefer it if the hole were so deep that you had to explore (as per the new system) to find the bottom. By leaving it unexplored, it effectively IS bottomless.

This doesn't cover the contingency of what happens if a falling dwarf gets a glimpse of each Z-level before he dies, but that could be handled easily by making exploration not happen while airborne.

Big holes and chasms would still be welcome, but they don't need the Bottomless tile at the bottom.

Agreed.  I don't care whether a gaping crevice is really truly bottomless as long as helpless creatures can get hurled into it and fall out of sight.  Oh, and garbage.

This is an interesting question.  What will happen if you pour water and/or items into an extremely deep cave you haven't explored?  Will the game simulate the water flows in the unrevealed section?  Will the water just disappear?  Will the items? 

[Footkerchief]

Question (or a couple?) for Toady: You've mentioned that currently, there is only the potential for a single "growth spurt".

I'm assuming that is directly equivalent to the current "Child" to "Adult" transition, that we're currently seeing in the game?

Also, is that single growth spurt set in stone? Or could there be more in the future? I really strongly feel that enabling a set of dramatic changes (as opposed to straightforward growth) over the course of a being's lifetime would be a lot of fun to play with and very useful, when applied to many monstrous critters, as a modding tool.

I'm fine with it taking a long time to add, but I hope that you'll atleast consider it for sometime in the possible future?

It's a bit more complex than that.  Quoting from the last page to save you the trouble:

The appearance modifier (hair length, etc.) growth factors work that way, but size is a little more versatile.  You can define a series of time points and the average size of the creature at those times.

Dwarves currently have:
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:100]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:1500]
[BODY_SIZE:12:0:6000]

Which makes them grow linearly between the last numbers at the year:day numbers on the left (I haven't thought about the actual numbers much, so ignore those).  You could just as easily do:

[BODY_SIZE:0:0:100]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:1500]
[BODY_SIZE:12:0:6000]
[BODY_SIZE:15:0:6500]
[BODY_SIZE:18:0:8000]
[BODY_SIZE:50:0:16000]

to make something grow along a different curve.  Individual size variability is handled via body appearance modifiers like body length, and those can only have one spurt.  So a creature can grow in total size along a weird curve, but only have one growth spurt per dimension.  BODY_SIZE itself doesn't set up infinite growth, but you could set up modifiers for body length/width/height that all constantly grow like hair at the same rate forever, and this would have the same effect.

So gross size can change in pretty much whatever way you want, but more specific measurements can only have one spurt.

[SirHoneyBadger]

Yeah, that's what I'm wondering about--whether there will someday be the option of having more than one "growthspurt", rather than just accumulated size, and additionally, whether that "growthspurt" can also alter/enhance the form and/or nature of a being in question, as the being ages (A classic example would be a caterpillar transforming into a butterfly.).

[Tormy]

Yeah, that's what I'm wondering about--whether there will someday be the option of having more than one "growthspurt", rather than just accumulated size, and additionally, whether that "growthspurt" can also alter/enhance the form and/or nature of a being in question, as the being ages (A classic example would be a caterpillar transforming into a butterfly.).

Perhaps...who knows. I am quite happy with the upcoming system to be honest, even tho your idea sounds fun. [Especially from the modding perspective..]

[Zironic]

What about religions, can we mod into the rars, (in the future) specific deities?

[Topace3k]

I know this may sound insane, but I would like to suggest that Toady One take as much time as he needs to get this update done fully.  If it takes another 6 months, so be it.  I think the community would benefit greatly with a huge patch that updates the game's fundamentals massively and also expands the enjoyability and playability of fortress mode without rushing any of the new features.  Better to do things completely and even spend a few more weeks adding that extra touch to make the game that much better. 

This goes particularly for the underground diversity element, as I'm sure once all the complex fundamental work is finished adding in rare, special, and otherwise unusual elements that we won't see every game will be relatively easy and go a huge way in extending playability, hooking new players, and keeping the current playerbase active and donating.  I say leave no item on the list unfinished, and make this patch everything we hoped it would be.

[Neonivek]

I know this may sound insane, but I would like to suggest that Toady One take as much time as he needs to get this update done fully.  If it takes another 6 months, so be it.

True but unlike ordinary companies where delaying a game for longer periods of time means that it costs a bit more. When Toady does it by 6 months his only source of income, which he needs to avoid rejoining the workforce, becomes affected.

So he may have no choice but to fast track it. That and even he may be pining for this version to be released.

That being said however I agree with you. Take all the time you need to do it right.

[Pnx]

So wait, how about you have creatures develop traits as they grow by having a system where the creature is affected by what bracket of growth it's in. So a baby Giant Cave Spider might not have a venomous bite until it's second life bracket, until then it has a nibble attack that's replaced by the bite at that point in time. To steal from those previous probably nonsensical numbers it might look like this:

[BODY_SIZE:0:0:100]
[(baby attack tag)]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:1500]
[(remove baby attack tag)]
[(adult attack tag)]
[BODY_SIZE:12:0:6000]
[(web tag)]

This could allow for some interesting metamorphosis like real life animals undergo, take the salmon for example, it looks completely different by the end of it's breeding cycle. Or tadpoles, that eventually change from being aquatic to becoming amphibious frogs.

EDIT: Hey when magic finally eventually comes into play like we all know it will. There can be some fun messing with transformations, like how werewolves change at night under the full moon, or how merpeople might lose their tails and gain legs on land and vice versa.

[Qmarx]

Toady, are you getting tired of constantly pausing when

Scamps cancels Store Item in Stockpile: Too injured x3



So, anyway are priests scheduled for showing up in fortress mode again?