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[Footkerchief]

how about you just add in "deflect" as a rating too. i.e. plate armor has a high deflect rating, so it takes less damage from attacks, if there isn't a critical. and it has a chance to completely skim away enemy attacks, at a cost to wear and tear.

Therefore, chain, which has links to hold an attacking weapon has absolutely no deflect rating.

leather would be pretty low too, unless it's studded, with gems or something.

I think what you're getting at here is an item-specific "friction" modifier, maybe compounded with a material-specific friction modifier (yes, I know a coefficient of friction is between two surfaces).

[Tack]

sort of.

But then you'd have to put in type of armor, and possibly quality, i.e. dents and lumps...

i was just thinking that steel axe will rebound off steel plate, 40% of the time

steel maul will rebound off steel plate 70% of the time, but rebounding stops less damage and causes more damage to armor, (as in the hammer will cave in the armor)

bolt will rebound off steel plate 97% of the time. (hits will only be criticals, hits in joints, hits in gaps, etc. and do very little damage to the armor.

[Granite26]

The issue is, if someone swing a 50 lb maul at the side of your head, that force still has to go somewhere.

Sure, really good armour deflects the force so the it slides off without spending it's power, but if the power gets spent on the armour, the force (and thus the damage) has to go somewhere.

really good armor just spreads it out and puts it on load bearing structures.

[Draco18s]

Therefore, chain, which has links to hold an attacking weapon has absolutely no deflect rating.

Clearly no one has ever swung a sword at you while you're wearing chainmail.

Chain is very good at deflecting slashing types of weapons.  You're right that it wouldn't deflect any piercing types and it has no structure to deflect bashing.

[woose1]

bolt will rebound off steel plate 97% of the time. (hits will only be criticals, hits in joints, hits in gaps, etc. and do very little damage to the armor.

What?

Im sure you mean just steel plate armor.... right?

[Granite26]

Therefore, chain, which has links to hold an attacking weapon has absolutely no deflect rating.

Clearly no one has ever swung a sword at you while you're wearing chainmail.

Chain is very good at deflecting slashing types of weapons.  You're right that it wouldn't deflect any piercing types and it has no structure to deflect bashing.

Vocab check on deflect versus protect...  There's a difference between sliding off without absorbing the force and protecting from an edge.

[Fieari]

Mail can protect against piercing too.  The key is the size of the rings and the material of the rings.  Imagine, if you will, chain mail made of adamantine, with the gap between rings smaller than the arrow.  There's no WAY that arrow is going to pierce through.  On the other hand, it's not going to deflect the force much either (it will a LITTLE, but not much) so there'll be a hefty bit of bludgeoning damaging given to you, but arrows don't hurt that much when they don't pierce anyway.

Now, replace your adamantine mail with, oh, I don't know, lead or silver, and the arrow may very will get through, by deforming the rings.  But there are ways of reinforcing the rings by hammering the links that may work regardless.

And lets not forget scale mail, where each ring has a scale of overlapping metal attached to it.  Scale mail is darn good stuff.

[JoshuaFH]

I always thought it was weird how DF doesn't include the "padding" or whatever it's called that was traditionally worn underneath armor, ala RL knights.

[woose1]

I always thought it was weird how DF doesn't include the "padding" or whatever it's called that was traditionally worn underneath armor, ala RL knights.

They do. I have seen soldiers with a full set of leather, mail, and plate armor, most of whom, by the way, almsot never die.

A crossbow bolt or even a spear can shred unpadded plate armor like tissue paper.

[Muz]

My solution has been to divide it to two damage types - blunt and sharp. Blunt deals full damage to "hard" armor, but is partly absorbed by soft ones. Sharp damage is reduced by thickness and armor material. Steel sword vs leather does more sharp damage than wood sword vs leather.

Both are then multiplied together after armor for the final damage. I find that it works - spiked maces work right. Chainmail greatly reduces damage from swords, but not maces. And sparring equipment functions great too, considering the fact that skin is also a form of armor.

If it deals enough damage to bypass the first layer of armor (armor, skin, or otherwise), it then deals damage to the next layer. So on until it hits an internal organ. Piercing weapons do great at this because they deal a lot of damage, but on a small area, so it has a lower chance of hitting a vital organ.

[Neonivek]

I always thought it was weird how DF doesn't include the "padding" or whatever it's called that was traditionally worn underneath armor, ala RL knights.

The real problem is to make Dwarves actually use that "Padding" you have to do quite a bit of micromanaging... You have to take care to make sure they wear leather, chain, and Plate.

[Footkerchief]

Is there a historical precedent for wearing leather under chain/plate?  Leathor armor is pretty different from a cloth gambeson.

[Neonivek]

Is there a historical precedent for wearing leather under chain/plate?  Leathor armor is pretty different from a cloth gambeson.

I don't... though to admit metalic Armor can get pretty cold... So I am pretty sure they would wear something under all that.

[Muz]

I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that there's always some kind of padding under metal armor. I think the clothes count for it

I'm quite sure Toady will actually do it some time in the future, maybe after version 1.0.

[bjlong]

The difference between piercing and slashing damage is only the wound's profile, really. Peircing damage has a small profile, so it can't do as much wide-spread damage as slashing damage, but can go through more layers. Slashing does lots of damage to whatever layers it is able to get to, but is not able to go through layers as easily, since it runs into more material.

There's no president that I know of for leather armor under plate armor. Possibly chain, but plate... not so much.

Plate armor's big advantage over chain isn't necessarily its strength, but more of its capability to deflect slashes and piercing hits. Certainly it had great strength, but someone should give it some ability to deflect attacks that use a sharp edge.