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[Mikademus]

The (this) suggestions forum is extremely intense and busy. We have hundreds of pages of threads, and thousands of individual threads. It is very difficult to keep track of what's being said where and by whom.

I don't know if it can be added to SMF but I'd like to see that each new thread started in the suggestions forum must select a category to which it belongs (or an "other" alternative and fill in a textbox with the custom tag).

The list box of categories could contain frequent topics like

* Magic
* Combat
* Zoning
* Technology
* Buildings
* World generation
* Interface
(* Meta)

This is basically to help us organise and structure threads, and find them more easily. The thread list might then look something like this:

Code: [Select]

[Magic] Creating a magic system                   UristMcPotter
[Combat] More detailed wresting interface         UristMcSlippery
[World generation] More megabeasts!               UristMcMasochist
[Magic] Runes or AD&D?                            UristMcRaistlin
[Meta] Roundup of all weapons threads             UristMcAdmin

I think this would greatly improve the suggestions forum by instilling a structure and facilitating finding existing or particular threads.

[Neonivek]

The problem is that they are vague and there is a lot of suggestions that go through multiple subjects or even none of them. (Are artifacts... Magic, Combat, World Generation?)

Which then causes "Forum Guardians" to become huge trolls. I mean look at the Underground Suggestion thread... They arn't trolling but look how many suggestions get the "You should have put this here"...

This doesn't add too much but adds more problems.

What would be better is if the ettiquette made people make the topic of their suggestion match the contents. So you don't get "Hey" and it is a suggestion about Pie...

Also some of these sections are really pointless namely "Magic" given the number of rather overarching magic threads.

I think I have overexagerated... I really don't know what is wrong with me lately...

[bjlong]

On the other hand, if support for tags could be added, this would be helpful. Also, add Dwarven behavior or Dwarven Skills to the list.

[Footkerchief]

I don't think we really need another way to bitch at newbies and nitpick their posts.  A notification saying "Please title your thread as clearly as possible" along with a more prominent "Search first" would be enough.

[profit]

This is a good idea, and another board I am on uses a similar thing with auto culling. 

   I cannot speak of specifics because I am under a NDA but the system works extremely well, keeps things organized and allows for an automated script to update the list of things that have been suggested for at a glance research.

[Mikademus]

I don't think we really need another way to bitch at newbies and nitpick their posts.  A notification saying "Please title your thread as clearly as possible" along with a more prominent "Search first" would be enough.

Point is that you wouldn't be able to post a new thread until you've picked (or made) a category for it, just as you currently can't post it until it has a title. Both a category AND a title would be mandatory.

[Footkerchief]

Yes, but you'd get people saying "Why'd you pick the Miscellaneous category when this clearly falls under Feces-Related Suggestions" and then people arguing back about how urine isn't really the same as feces, interspersed with general lamenting about how nobody ever reads the twenty-page sticky on How to Categorize Your Suggestion.  Meanwhile the newbie has no idea what the fuck he just started, he had a cool idea that he wanted to pass along and he picked the first reasonable category he saw, not knowing how uptight the regulars are here (myself included).

[Silverionmox]

It's impossible to tell which direction a thread will go before it has started. Tagging threads would be good with hindsight, for archive purposes: often, a thread will acquire a second focus and it should be tagged as such when it occurs. Not everyone will be maintaining their threads so consequently, though. I think prodding those who commit threads with unclear titles to clarify them - possibly with tags, why not - should be sufficient.

[Tormy]

+1, this is a very good idea.

This is a good idea, and another board I am on uses a similar thing with auto culling. 

   I cannot speak of specifics because I am under a NDA but the system works extremely well, keeps things organized and allows for an automated script to update the list of things that have been suggested for at a glance research.

Yep. I am not sure that the following is possible to implement or not, but here is my idea:
The users should be able click on the specific tags. When you click on a tag like [MAGIC], all threads which has the [MAGIC] tag will be listed.
Perhaps a forum feature like this would be helpful for Toady also. 

[bjlong]

Toady has said that he tags all threads with respect to their contents on his own--possibly he could put these tags on the server as well as in his own archive? That would certainly help with organization.

[Granite26]

The people that title their threads poorly are the same people who don't read the... guidelines about searching first.   (or that do search, but haven't managed to generalize the idea, so they don't really know what they're suggesting in the first place.)

[winner]

yeah I don't think people should be required to categorize their own suggestions.  A mod could go along adding tags to the thread title of every thread if they so chose.

[Mikademus]

First, let us agree on that this suggestions forum is one of the busiest and most chaotic forums in existence. The more chaotic something is the more it benefits from being provided a structure.

There will always be people that through malice or stupidity break a system, but striking beneficial functions because they CAN be abused is not a relevant argument, just as we're not striking requiring thread topics because someone can abuse them and enter "genital pie" as a title for his suggestion about burning undead moose.

Advantages:
* Provides structure
* Facilitates browsing for favourite topics
* Facilitates archival of and finding threads
* Helps searching for particular threads
* Helps scanning for already existing discussions on topicd
* Offloads manual categorisation that Toady does now

Disadvantages: None that I can see

---

@Silverionmox: "It's impossible to tell which direction a thread will go before it has started. Tagging threads would be good with hindsight, for archive purposes
I think prodding those who commit threads with unclear titles to clarify them - possibly with tags, why not - should be sufficient.".

First, prodding people will not work. Unless there already exists a strong culture of tagging threads it will not happen later on. Also, people that can't create a good name for their thread will not be very likely to provide a good category for it either. Thus, a set of common and recurring labels (and an option for a custom one) will help with both these things. Secondly, you inadvertently argued my case for me: updating the category in hindsight is a good thing, and beneficial for archival (searching) purposes.


@Footkerchief : (a) "A notification saying "Please title your thread as clearly as possible" along with a more prominent "Search first" would be enough." ... (b) "people will miscategorise, bitch about miscategorisation, and not read a 26-page guide on categories"

About (a), no, and no. We already ask people to name their threads reasonably, and search first, and they don't and don't. Since people name their threads poorly, fail to search first, and generally have no ability to structure, we need to help providing that structure. As for (b), there are only some ten or so frequent topics. Perhaps 15. Not 26 pages of topics. Yes, there may be some bitching, but then, there is already bitching about topics, drift, whatever.

Again, we should not strike a good feature because of the potential of arguments (there is always already arguments about everything). We do not strike a good feature because it CAN be abused (every feature can be abused, it is a question of how much a benefit it brings over any potential disadvantages, and here the certain benefits outweight the possible disadvantages enormously). Finally, we NEED a feature like this in this forum.


@Granite26: "same people who don't read guidelines"

Yeah, and that's why we enforce using categories, making selecting one mandatory for creating a thread. We help provide the structure they need, or help people understand what they're intending to ramble on about.


@winner: will not happen. Mods here are extremely hands-off and will not sticky or (usually) edit threads in any way. The reason for requiring categorisation is that most threads/suggestions are about a few continuously recurring particular things. The tag would emphasise this, and facilitate finding and browsing topics of interest, especially combined with Tormy's suggestion about clicking a tag.

[winner]

as long as people don't have to read a thread to find out about what they have to do then I am in support.

[Toady One]

Tagging them as I go through them wouldn't bother me so much, as I look at them all anyway (though to save time I generally only look at the ones that have dropped off the main page).  On the other hand, as far as archiving and browsing, would moving them off to subforums be better?  I think we had tossed this around before, and I feel more at ease with subforums and moving now that I've sorted the various nonsense games (ie, the forum doesn't take a crap and delete everything or change thread urls, unlike the last forum which was bad).

I'm not sure how this forum handles searches of subforums.  Maybe I should go try that...  hrm, it doesn't seem to search subforums from the search bar at the top if you are looking at the parent forum.  That might complicate things for people.  Let me look for settings...  can't find anything...