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[Adragis]

unless you worship Jivya

[Tiruin]

I think it's safe to answer any question that contains "How good of an idea is it to go to slime without rCorr" with "Absolutely not." You can squeak through sometimes, but it's just not smart and it's way too easy to lose a really solid character to corrosion.

It is actually very possible to finish Slime Pits without any rCorr at all Being able to hit and damage faster than those slimes can corrode you (as well as run and take a break, since all levels before the 6th have a FINITE amount of slimes, which along with the perimeter of the 6th can become a relative safezone to weather the corrosion). You can even just go straight to the staircase on each floor and clean the surrounding area--slimes don't accumulate at each stairway due to them not being able to hear well or see well.

Taking on the Royal Jelly in a few shots and then running up the stairs to avoid all those Azure/Death jellies is also a very useful idea. It's not impossible to finish with rCorr (because I'm one of the 'not smart ones' who has always--in the characters who have lived--gotten the Slime rune as their 3rd rune post-2-other-lair-branch runes). x3 Instead of focusing on something that applies Corrosion, given the increments of -4, what is better is hitting quick, hard, and getting away given the change of 'permanent corroding' to 'temporary corroding', especially since the combination of 'which slimes corrode' + damage potential = inadvisable prolonged fights.

Though those are my experiences alone ._. I remember when corrosion was a KILLER and something totally needed to ward off by resistance (A few versions earlier, the 'red jelly' was amongst the most hated early game enemies because they both eat things, and apply -1 decrements to your weapons/armor, permanently). Now, it's less of a 'need' and more of a convenience to focus or redirect your generic amulets/rings on.

[TheDarkStar]

And I finally won with a MiFi^Oka. It wasn't too difficult, but I had a few close calls. Notable events:
Got the Sword of Jihad, which makes the normal endgame a joke
Just after grabbing the orb, I got surrounded by a bunch of demons and pan lords and got down to 3 HP before reaching the stairs
I found the +0 cloak of Jigsaw {rF- Str+7 Dex+3 Slay+5} at the bottom of Lair, which made things much easier
I ate/quaffed every single ingestibale source of mutation I could
My base Str was only 24, but I had +17 through items
Until late Depths, the only resistances I had were rF++ and rPois. I only got all of them after clearing the Crypt and Elf.

Also, how was the order I used (Dungeon down to Lair, clear Lair, clear Dungeon, clear Orc, clear Snake, clear Vaults to 4, clear Shoals, clear Depths, clear Vault:5 clear Elf, clear Abyss, clear Zot)? Are there issues with my character build? How far could I have taken this character?

Code: [Select]

Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.18.1 (tiles) character file.

2407086 Gulomuof the Swordmaster (level 27, 182/273 HPs)
             Began as a Minotaur Fighter on June 21, 2016.
             Was the Champion of Okawaru.
             Escaped with the Orb
             ... and 4 runes on June 22, 2016!
             
             The game lasted 03:43:47 (72490 turns).

Gulomuof the Swordmaster (Minotaur Fighter)        Turns: 72490, Time: 03:43:48

Health: 182/273    AC: 52    Str: 41    XL:     27
Magic:  30/30      EV: 30    Int:  7    God:    Okawaru [******]
Gold:   3854       SH: 33    Dex: 20    Spells: 0 memorised, 26 levels left

rFire  + + +      SeeInvis .    w - +10 sword of Jihad {holy, *Rage rN+ EV+3 Stlth-}
rCold  + + +      Gourm    .    L - +9 armour of the Dragon King {rPois rF+ rC+ MR+}
rNeg   + + +      Faith    .    F - +2 large shield
rPois  +          Spirit   .    o - +2 hat of Xihamuat {*Corrode rF+++ Str+3 Int+3}
rElec  +          Dismiss  +    z - +0 cloak of Jigsaw {rF- Str+7 Dex+3 Slay+5}
rCorr  .          Reflect  .    q - +2 pair of gloves {Str+3}
SustAt .          Harm     .    a - +1 pair of boots {Fly}
MR     +++..      Clarity  +    E - amulet of Cekugob {Dismiss -Tele rElec rPois rN++ AC+1 EV+1}
Stlth  .......... NoTele   +    M - +4 ring of strength
                                K - ring of Xom's Full Attention {+Blink rC+++ EV+3 Int-2 Stlth+}

@: flying, very slightly contaminated, hasted, studying Stealth, very quick,
extremely resistant to hostile enchantments, extremely unstealthy
A: retaliatory headbutt, claws 1, fangs 1, horns 2, iridescent scales 1,
camouflage 1, clarity, dopey 1, fire resistance 2, sense surroundings 1,
teleportitis 1, subdued magic 2
a: Heroism, Finesse, Renounce Religion, Evoke Blink, Stop Flying
0: Orb of Zot
}: 4/15 runes: serpentine, barnacled, silver, abyssal


You escaped.
You worshipped Okawaru.
Okawaru was exalted by your worship.
You were not hungry.

You visited 13 branches of the dungeon, and saw 57 of its levels.
You visited the Abyss 1 time.
You visited 1 bazaar.
You also visited: Trove, Ice Cave and Volcano.

You collected 8901 gold pieces.
You spent 3800 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand Weapons
 w - the +10 sword of Jihad (weapon) {holy, *Rage rN+ EV+3 Stlth-}
   (You found it on level 2 of the Depths)   
   
   It has been blessed by the Shining One to cause great damage to the undead
   and demons.
   
   It affects your evasion (+3).
   It protects you from negative energy.
   It may make you go berserk in combat.
   It makes you less stealthy.
 x - a +7 vampiric double sword
Missiles
 v - 9 steel javelins
 A - 54 poisoned javelins
 O - 46 javelins (quivered)
 Y - 4 javelins of penetration
Armour
 a - a +1 pair of boots of flying (worn)
 o - the +2 hat of Xihamuat (worn) {*Corrode rF+++ Str+3 Int+3}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 4 of the Vaults)   
   
   It affects your strength (+3).
   It affects your intelligence (+3).
   It renders you almost immune to fire.
   It may corrode you when you take damage.
 q - a +2 pair of gloves of strength (worn)
 z - the +0 cloak of Jigsaw (worn) {rF- Str+7 Dex+3 Slay+5}
   (You found it on level 8 of the Lair of Beasts)   
   
   It affects your strength (+7).
   It affects your dexterity (+3).
   It affects your accuracy and damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks
   (+5).
   It makes you vulnerable to fire.
 F - a +2 large shield (worn)
 L - the +9 armour of the Dragon King (worn) {rPois rF+ rC+ MR+}
   (You found it on level 3 of the Crypt)   
   
   It protects you from fire.
   It protects you from cold.
   It protects you from poison.
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
Rods
 u - a +2 lightning rod (13/13)
   (You found it on level 3 of the Abyss)
Jewellery
 m - the amulet of the Invisible Hand {rC- Regen+ Str+2 Int+7}
   (You found it on level 1 of the Abyss)   
   
   [amulet of regeneration]
   
   It affects your strength (+2).
   It affects your intelligence (+7).
   It makes you vulnerable to cold.
   It increases your rate of regeneration.
 E - the amulet of Cekugob (around neck) {Dismiss -Tele rElec rPois rN++ AC+1 EV+1}
   (You found it on level 1 of the Vaults)   
   
   [amulet of dismissal]
   
   It may teleport away creatures that harm you.
   It affects your AC (+1).
   It affects your evasion (+1).
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It protects you from poison.
   It greatly protects you from negative energy.
   It prevents most forms of teleportation.
 K - the ring of Xom's Full Attention (left hand) {+Blink rC+++ EV+3 Int-2 Stlth+}
   (You found it on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   [ring of evasion]
   
   It affects your evasion (+3).
   It affects your intelligence (-2).
   It renders you almost immune to cold.
   It lets you blink.
   It makes you more stealthy.
 M - a +4 ring of strength (right hand)
 V - an uncursed ring of see invisible
Wands
 y - a wand of digging (12/24)
 H - a wand of disintegration (5/24)
 Z - a wand of heal wounds (6/9)
Scrolls
 c - 7 scrolls of teleportation
 h - 8 scrolls of fear
 j - a scroll of magic mapping
 l - 28 scrolls of remove curse
 B - 7 scrolls of silence
 D - a scroll of holy word
 N - 12 scrolls of recharging
 S - 14 scrolls of identify
 T - 3 scrolls of blinking
Potions
 b - 4 potions of cure mutation
 d - 9 potions of brilliance
 e - 10 potions of flight
 i - 8 potions of cancellation
 n - 11 potions of magic
 p - 8 potions of resistance
 s - a potion of haste
 C - 7 potions of agility
 G - 10 potions of might
 J - 9 potions of lignification
 P - 3 potions of invisibility
 R - a potion of ambrosia
Books
 Q - a manual of Stealth
Miscellaneous
 g - a disc of storms
Comestibles
 f - 22 bread rations
 k - 10 beef jerkies
 I - 25 meat rations


   Skills:
 O Level 27 Fighting
 O Level 27 Long Blades
   Level 0.5 Maces & Flails
 + Level 17.6 Throwing
 O Level 27 Armour
 + Level 19.3 Dodging
 O Level 27 Shields
   Level 2.4 Fire Magic
   Level 2.4 Ice Magic
 - Level 10.6 Invocations


You had 26 spell levels left.
You didn't know any spells.

Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:7            Lair (8/8) D:11
 Shoals (4/4) Lair:3        Snake (4/4) Lair:3        Slime (0/6) Lair:7
    Orc (2/2) D:11            Elf (3/3) Orc:2        Vaults (5/5) D:13
  Crypt (3/3) Vaults:3       Tomb (1/3) Crypt:3      Depths (5/5) D:15
   Hell (1/1)                 Dis (0/7) Hell            Geh (0/7) Hell
    Coc (0/7) Hell            Tar (0/7) Hell            Zot (5/5) Depths:5

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Gozag
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Pakellas
Qazlal
Ru
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh
Lugonu

Shops:
D:11 [   D:12 :   Orc:2 (}*:   Elf:1 }   Shoals:3 :   Snake:3 %   Vaults:2 :[}:[
Vaults:4 =   Vaults:5 ?   Depths:3 (

Portals:
Hell: Depths:1 Depths:2 Depths:3 Depths:4 Depths:5
Abyss: Depths:3 Depths:4
Pandemonium: Depths:2 Depths:3
Ziggurat: Depths:1

Annotations:
D:5 Gulomuof's ghost, amateur MiFi
D:7 Prince Ribbit


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You reflexively headbutt those who attack you in melee.
You have a pair of horns on your head.
You have sharp fingernails.
You have very sharp teeth.
You are partially covered in iridescent scales (AC +4).
Your skin changes colour to match your surroundings (Stealth).
You possess an exceptional clarity of mind.
You are dopey. (Int -2)
Your flesh is very heat resistant.
You passively map a small area around you.
You are occasionally teleported next to monsters.
Your spells are easier to cast, but less powerful.


Message History

The Brimstone Fiend misses you. You block the Brimstone Fiend's attack. x2
You slice the Brimstone Fiend!! The Brimstone Fiend convulses!!
Your headbutt misses the Brimstone Fiend.
The Brimstone Fiend is heavily wounded.
The golden eye blinks at you.
You resist with almost no effort.
You block the Brimstone Fiend's attack.
The Brimstone Fiend completely misses you.
You block the Brimstone Fiend's attack.
The golden eye blinks at you.
You resist with almost no effort.
There is a staircase leading out of the dungeon here.
You can't go down here!
You block something's attack.
Deactivating autopickup; reactivate with Ctrl-A.
The golden eye blinks at you.
You resist with almost no effort.
The golden eye blinks at you.
You resist with almost no effort.
You have escaped!

   #.##    #....#      #
  ##.#     #.##.#  #####
  #..###  ##.#######..##
  #....####...####....##
  ##.....#..˜..#.....###
   #8..˜....˜....˜..8###
   ##...˜..˜˜˜..˜...##..
  ##.....˜˜˜˜˜˜˜.....###
  #....˜˜˜˜...˜˜˜˜....#
  #..˜˜˜˜˜G1@..˜˜˜˜˜..#
  #....˜˜)˜†G†˜˜˜˜....#
 ###.....˜˜˜˜˜˜˜.....##
##.##...˜..˜˜˜..˜...##
#..#8..˜....˜....˜..8#
...#.....#..˜..#.....##
#......####...####....##
##...#### ##.#######....
 #..###.#   ......#.###.


You could see a Brimstone Fiend and 2 golden eyes.

Vanquished Creatures
//cut creature list

Grand Total: 3260 creatures vanquished

//cut event list
 72490 | D:$      | Escaped with the Orb!
             

Skill      XL: |  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 |
---------------+----------------------------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Long Blades    |  3  4  5  6  7  9 11 14                         17       21 23 24 26 27          | 27.0
Fighting       |                         14    16                            18 19 20 23 26 27    | 27.0
Armour         |                                6 13 17 20                      21    22 24 26 27 | 27.0
Shields        |                                         6  9 11 16 20 24 25                26 27 | 27.0
Fire Magic     |                                            2                                     |  2.4
Ice Magic      |                                            2                                     |  2.4
Invocations    |                                            2              4  6  8  9 10          | 10.6
Dodging        |                                                                               19 | 19.3
Throwing       |                                                                               17 | 17.6
Maces & Flails |                                                                                  |  0.5

Action                   |  1- 3 |  4- 6 |  7- 9 | 10-12 | 13-15 | 16-18 | 19-21 | 22-24 | 25-27 || total
-------------------------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------++-------
Melee: Long sword        |    86 |   113 |   281 |   135 |     7 |       |    12 |       |       ||   634
       Headbutt          |    15 |    22 |    80 |   213 |   381 |   410 |   709 |   563 |   921 ||  3314
       Scimitar          |       |       |       |   644 |  1109 |  1003 |       |       |       ||  2756
       Mace              |       |       |       |     4 |       |       |       |       |       ||     4
       Unarmed           |       |       |       |       |       |     4 |       |       |       ||     4
       Double sword      |       |       |       |       |       |   161 |  2026 |   545 |       ||  2732
       Bite              |       |       |       |       |       |       |   130 |   329 |   500 ||   959
       Eudemon blade     |       |       |       |       |       |       |       |  1040 |  2549 ||  3589
Throw: Javelin           |       |       |       |       |       |       |     8 |       |     1 ||     9
Evoke: Wand              |       |       |       |       |       |       |       |     3 |     2 ||     5
       Deck              |       |       |       |       |       |       |       |    12 |       ||    12
       Disc of storms    |       |       |       |       |       |       |       |       |     1 ||     1
  Use: Scroll            |     5 |     4 |    10 |    14 |    14 |    11 |    24 |    11 |    22 ||   115
       Potion            |       |     2 |     5 |     3 |     5 |     8 |    12 |    18 |    26 ||    79
 Stab: Distracted        |       |     1 |       |       |       |       |       |       |     2 ||     3
       Paralysed         |       |       |       |       |       |       |     1 |       |       ||     1
  Eat: Chunk             |     1 |     4 |    17 |    22 |    23 |    42 |    87 |   140 |    59 ||   395
       Beef jerky        |       |       |     1 |       |       |       |       |       |     4 ||     5
       Royal jelly       |       |       |       |     1 |     1 |       |       |     7 |     2 ||    11
       Pizza             |       |       |       |     1 |       |     3 |       |     1 |     3 ||     8
       Fruit             |       |       |       |       |       |     6 |     6 |     8 |    12 ||    32
       Meat ration       |       |       |       |       |       |       |     1 |     1 |     8 ||    10
       Bread ration      |       |       |       |       |       |       |     1 |       |       ||     1
Armor: Scale mail        |    32 |    74 |    45 |       |       |       |       |       |       ||   151
       Plate armour      |       |       |    41 |       |       |       |       |       |       ||    41
       Fire dragon armou |       |       |     2 |    14 |       |       |       |       |       ||    16
       Chain mail        |       |       |     9 |   396 |   616 |   556 |    77 |       |       ||  1654
       Crystal plate arm |       |       |       |       |       |       |   502 |   372 |     5 ||   879
       Gold dragon armou |       |       |       |       |       |       |       |       |   726 ||   726
Dodge: Dodged            |    32 |    46 |    36 |    96 |   151 |   181 |   258 |   205 |   871 ||  1876
Block: Shield            |    36 |    83 |    75 |       |       |       |       |       |       ||   194
       Large shield      |       |       |    24 |   530 |   864 |  1394 |  2434 |  1474 |  2722 ||  9442
       Buckler           |       |       |       |     1 |       |       |       |       |       ||     1



[Arcvasti]

You probably could have gone for 15 runes. Full resists is quite impressive at this stage of the game. The Sword of Jihad and the Amulet of Cekugob both have quite nasty side effects, both of which are quite capable of getting you killed against really dangerous foes. If you could find a replacement amulet before the truly nasty places like Dis, you'd most likely be fine. I'd also switch to TSO and Holy up your double sword as an endgame weapon.


As far as branch order goes, that's pretty solid. I would definitely have cleared Crypts and Elf before doing Vaults:5 though. Neither is too terribly difficult by that time and you need lots of resists for Vaults:5.

[TheDarkStar]

In my new playthrough, I got a -8 buckler (+blink, int+2). It might be the worst randart I've ever gotten - it actually makes my SH negative when I equip it.

[heydude6]

What do you guys think a negative SH would do?

[TheDarkStar]

What do you guys think a negative SH would do?

Presumably, it would make enemies more able to hit you than if you weren't wielding the shield.


What considerations should I make when trying to kill TRJ as a melee character? rCorr is a given, but would a scroll of immolation be worth using?


Edit: Scrolls of immolation 10/10, would explode TRJ again.

[Aoi]

What do you guys think a negative SH would do?

Maybe it's a magnetic tarp with a bulls-eye painted on it.

[TheDarkStar]

I'm at 27 in Long Blades and 0 in M&F. Currently I have a +1 randart speed-branded Triple Sword that also blocks my teleportitis, a +4 Eudemon blade, and a +5 Sacred Scourge. Which weapon is best for Pan exploration?

[IcyTea31]

What do you guys think a negative SH would do?

Maybe it's a magnetic tarp with a bulls-eye painted on it.

There used to be an unrandart shield like that, the Bullseye, giving great SH in exchange for EV. It was merged with the Shield of the Gong to make one ridiculous shield to rule them all.

[frostshotgg]

I wish I could find Shield of the Gong in my Qazlal runs. Get the authentic Zot Defense experience.

[TheDarkStar]

Bleh. I died to a random Pan floor where a bunch of smiters were on the other side of a runed door. This was after easily getting all but the Dis, Cocytus, and Tartarus runes. At least I've learned my lesson about smiting.

 

[Arcvasti]

I'm at 27 in Long Blades and 0 in M&F. Currently I have a +1 randart speed-branded Triple Sword that also blocks my teleportitis, a +4 Eudemon blade, and a +5 Sacred Scourge. Which weapon is best for Pan exploration?

Eudemon blade, no question. Speed brand on a Triple Sword might actually outweigh holy, IF it was more then a +1. Sacred Scourge is nice, but not worth training up M&F specifically for it. As for your teleportitis, Zin might be of help. Zin gives 100% rMut at max piety and lets you cure all mutations once, as well as several other very nice abilities, although you'd need to train Invocations a fair bit for Recite to come into its own.

Bleh. I died to a random Pan floor where a bunch of smiters were on the other side of a runed door. This was after easily getting all but the Dis, Cocytus, and Tartarus runes. At least I've learned my lesson about smiting.

 

M8, that's got nothing on that Hellion vault which has oodles of Hellions dropping Damnation on you all at once. Even the most robust character can only take a few turns of that before dropping. There are several similar vaults in Pan. They're when I feel the best about having Tornado and Fire Storm, usually.

[Leafsnail]

The first rule of Pan is to avoid the Hellion vault no matter what your character is.

[Scoops Novel]

Gifs of my dungeon crawl run so far:

Chronicles of Ted the Dead, ogre summoner.

Level 1, 2, 3 and 4.

Meet Finton the Smitten. Level 5, 6, 7 and 8.

Have a little Howitzer the Crowd Pleaser. Level 9, 10, 11.

and finally Glorious Calvin the Downtrodden.