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[Arcvasti]

Addressing the points in the above post:

- Yeah, but the two-handers require forsaking a shield. And Merfolk need that SH, especially mid game.

- Dodging =/= good defense. Or rather, it doesn't equal good defense on its own. It needs a more consistent thing to back it up, be that resists or AC.

- Yeah, Merfolk in water are hella strong. Enough so to make Swamp/Shoals pretty easy. Really nice, but kinda situational.

- I've tried MfGl a few times doing what you said. I'll give 'em a few more runs, but either I'm really bad with Merfolk in particular or Merfolk are underpowered. Probably not the latter, at least not too much so, since they were pretty popular last tournament.

- Merfolk Skald I wasn't too impressed with either. They've got even less early AC then other backgrounds because they're partial casters. I personally prefer Transmuter, although that has its own problems.

- Yep, the best I've done with Merfolk has been with Ru. Aura of Power nicely shields their weaknesses. Haven't given it a try with two-handed polearms as of yet.

- Thing is, axes suck ass. The one-handed ones are mediocre and the two-handed ones require way too much skill to use while still being worse then comparable Long Blades/Maces. Polearms are about the same, although the skill thing isn't an issue for Merfolk.

- Yeah, Statue Form is hellaciously strong. Dunno if I'd go for Troll though. Demonspawn with the right mutations eclipse them[Claws + Powered by Death alone is basically troll level power right there except with actual aptitudes].

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Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.18-a0-1522-g37626c5 (tiles) character file.

Kisuxac the Fencer (Minotaur Fighter)              Turns: 26537, Time: 00:59:13

Health: 147/147    AC: 31    Str: 38    XL:     16   Next: 33%
Magic:  21/21      EV: 16    Int: 14    God:    Trog [******]
Gold:   1177       SH: 23    Dex: 13    Spells: 0 memorised, 15 levels left

rFire  + . .      SeeInvis .    S - +3 double sword (elec)
rCold  + + +      Gourm    .    K - +7 plate armour of the Snake Pit {rN+ Int+6}
rNeg   + + .      Faith    .    v - +1 large shield {rC+}
rPois  +          Spirit   .    Z - +0 hat {Int+3}
rElec  +          Dismiss  .    r - +2 cloak of Starlight {rElec rC+ EV+4 Stlth--}
rCorr  .          Reflect  .    c - +2 pair of gloves {Dex+3}
SustAt +          Harm     .    F - +0 pair of boots
MR     ++++.      Clarity  +    l - amulet of the Four Winds {rN+ MR+++ Clar}
Stlth  ..........               x - +5 ring of strength
                                H - ring of Timoch {SustAt Str+5 Stlth-}

I cleared all of Lair, Orc, and Dungeon. Where should I go next? What should I equip to make that branch the easiest? I can Get full rF with different equipment. My game has been very generous on item creation this time.

Never beat the game, closest I ever go was to final Zot floor but died to Orbs of Fire.

I'd go for the first couple levels of Elf[Third one is a lot trickier]. You have enough MR that they can't banish you, an end-game tier weapon and pretty robust resistances. I seem to remember that Throw Icicle is the most common attack Deep Elves throw at you, so rC might actually be a bit better for that. I'd then go for the Lair branches, the first four levels of the Vaults and then the Depths before attempting Vaults:5 and Zot proper. The Crypt I'd save for gaining TSO/Zin piety if you decide to tackle the extended game. I might even go for the first 5-10 levels of a Ziggurat if I needed some crucial xp or equipment. Orbs of Fire are very very robust against most things, although cold and OODs/LCSs bring them down pretty handily. Antimagic takes longer, but basically neuters them for its duration. Since you have Trog, getting antimagic shouldn't be that hard.

[EnigmaticHat]

I think merfolk are weak, but not particularly weak compared to, say, humans.  Their aptitudes heavily encourage them to go down a dangerous path (melee + light armor) but you don't really need to play them like that.

[Adragis]

I love axes ;-;

[Scoops Novel]

Gifs of my lv 1 adventure.

What do you think? I want to make sense before prime time on reddit.

[Micro102]

It's hard to follow and I stopped halfway because  of it. Sorry

[EnigmaticHat]

I think it would have been better if it was more tied to DCSS in some way; as is its hard to tell what its supposed to represent.

[Scoops Novel]

I think it would have been better if it was more tied to DCSS in some way; as is its hard to tell what its supposed to represent.

Anything specific? Could you tell the kobold was a kobold?

[EnigmaticHat]

It would be better if it were interspersed with images or a more detailed text description from an actual game.  The brief subtitles aren't enough for us to understand what the images are supposed to represent.

[flame99]

Tryed out a transmuter for the first time. They're actually pretty powerful...Kicked ass until I got too cocky with an early vampire.

[Damiac]

So, I decided to try to show a good example of a merfolk gladiator.  It's going quite well, but the dungeon has provided me with all sorts of weird and wild stuff, so I certainty departed quite a bit from the strategy I laid out.  That's generally what happens with starting strategies in dungeon crawl though.

So remember how I said MF have a bad armor apt, but it can still be worthwhile to train it?  Oka granting you a +9 Crystal Plate Armor is an example of such a time, especially when you also have a cloak granting str + 6.  Even with that armor, I have regeneration and repel missiles castable, and I expect to be able to cast haste by the time I get to extended. I suppose I'll pick up spectral weapon, even though I'm past the point in the game where it really shines, just to use against the pan lords or other high HP enemies when I can afford to take a bit of extra damage.

So I got wyrmbane early on, and since I've never gotten it before, I decided to go against my own advice and use a shield.  I later got that demon trident (Daps from Oka!) so the one handed route is working out pretty well.  Still, after I clear Zot I'm going to enchant up a glaive and switch to 2 handed for extended, because I am feeling the low damage, and although the buckler is nice, the resists on it are pretty redundant.

Before lair I was playing a very typical merfolk, running with a +3 halberd of draining, with high EV and lowish AC, but oka had other plans for me.  Seriously, I think he was trying to make up for his usual crappy gifts on this run.  He gave me the following: Wyrmbane, +9 CPA with +4 str, +3 buckler w/ rElec rPois rF MR, +4 gloves w/ +Inv rElec rF MR, +11 Demon Trident of venom w/ rF, Int-4, stlth+.

This is one of the strongest characters I played in a very long time.  My offense is a tiny bit on the weak side, but my defense is absurd.  However, the 27 str helps make up for the low damage on my weapon, and helps me have a decent EV with CPA.  This character is a lot of fun, but not very representative of a typical merfolk.  Seriously, I cleared elf before getting my second rune, and was not even threatened. I've never done that before!

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Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.18-a0-1570-gf60b0ab (webtiles) character file.

damiac14 the Acrobat (Merfolk Gladiator)           Turns: 74931, Time: 06:40:37

Health: 233/233    AC: 60    Str: 27    XL:     27
Magic:  35/35      EV: 23    Int: 14    God:    Okawaru [******]
Gold:   4093       SH:  9    Dex: 22    Spells: 2 memorised, 37 levels left

rFire  + + +      SeeInvis +    Y - +18 lance "Wyrmbane" {slay drac, +Rage rPois rF+ AC+5}
rCold  + . .      Gourm    .    j - +9 crystal plate armour of the Gardener {Str+4}
rNeg   . . .      Faith    .    V - +3 buckler of Asugafum {rElec rPois rF+ MR+}
rPois  +          Spirit   +    w - +2 helmet {SInv}
rElec  +          Dismiss  .    m - +0 cloak "Kiytulaqi" {Str+6 Int+2}
rCorr  .          Reflect  .    Z - +4 pair of gloves of Jewof {+Inv rElec rF+ MR+}
SustAt .          Harm     .    c - +2 pair of boots {run}
MR     +++++                    W - amulet of guardian spirit
Stlth  ..........               F - ring of Robustness {AC+8}
                                N - ring "Penuvef" {rC+ MR+ Str-2 Int+3}

@: repel missiles, quick, almost entirely resistant to hostile enchantments,
extremely unstealthy
A: change form in water, swift swim
a: Heroism, Finesse, Renounce Religion, Evoke Berserk Rage, Evoke Invisibility
}: 3/15 runes: barnacled, silver, gossamer


You are on level 1 of the Realm of Zot.
You worship Okawaru.
Okawaru is exalted by your worship.
You are not hungry.

You have visited 10 branches of the dungeon, and seen 48 of its levels.
You have visited the Abyss 1 time.
You have also visited: Ossuary and Ice Cave.

You have collected 6122 gold pieces.
You have spent 2029 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand Weapons
 o - the +11 demon trident "Daps" {venom, rF+ Int-4 Stlth+}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 1 of the Vaults)   
   
   It poisons the flesh of those it strikes.
   
   It affects your intelligence (-4).
   It protects you from fire.
   It makes you more stealthy.
 Y - the +18 lance "Wyrmbane" (weapon) {slay drac, +Rage rPois rF+ AC+5}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts)   
   
   It affects your AC (+5).
   It protects you from fire.
   It protects you from poison.
   It lets you go berserk.
Missiles
 s - 16 throwing nets
 B - 3 javelins of returning
 D - 74 javelins
 X - 14 poisoned javelins (quivered)
Armour
 c - a +2 pair of boots of running (worn)
 j - the +9 crystal plate armour of the Gardener (worn) {Str+4}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 6 of the Lair of Beasts)   
   
   It affects your strength (+4).
 m - the +0 cloak "Kiytulaqi" (worn) {Str+6 Int+2}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 8 of the Lair of Beasts)   
   
   It affects your strength (+6).
   It affects your intelligence (+2).
 w - a +2 helmet of see invisible (worn)
 V - the +3 buckler of Asugafum (worn) {rElec rPois rF+ MR+}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 13 of the Dungeon)   
   
   It protects you from fire.
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It protects you from poison.
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
 Z - the +4 pair of gloves of Jewof (worn) {+Inv rElec rF+ MR+}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 4 of the Spider Nest)   
   
   It protects you from fire.
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It lets you turn invisible.
Jewellery
 g - a +4 ring of evasion
 u - an uncursed ring of flight
 C - an uncursed ring of resist corrosion
 F - the ring of Robustness (right hand) {AC+8}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 2 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   [ring of protection]
   
   It affects your AC (+8).
 N - the ring "Penuvef" (left hand) {rC+ MR+ Str-2 Int+3}
   (You found it on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   [ring of protection from magic]
   
   It affects your strength (-2).
   It affects your intelligence (+3).
   It protects you from cold.
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
 T - an uncursed ring of positive energy
 W - an amulet of guardian spirit (around neck)
Wands
 t - a wand of digging
 H - a wand of disintegration (10/24)
 M - a wand of teleportation (2/9)
Scrolls
 d - 6 scrolls of identify
 e - 19 scrolls of remove curse
 l - a scroll of amnesia
 n - a scroll of summoning
 q - 7 scrolls of magic mapping
 x - 9 scrolls of recharging
 y - 7 scrolls of fog
 z - 4 scrolls of blinking
 J - 2 scrolls of silence
 O - 7 scrolls of fear
 R - a scroll of brand weapon
 S - 4 scrolls of teleportation
Potions
 a - 4 potions of haste
 b - 9 potions of brilliance
 i - 2 potions of might
 k - 21 potions of curing
 p - 5 potions of resistance
 r - 11 potions of agility
 v - 11 potions of heal wounds
 G - 5 potions of cancellation
 L - a potion of ambrosia
 Q - 3 potions of magic
 U - 3 potions of invisibility
Miscellaneous
 E - a fan of gales
Comestibles
 f - 30 bread rations
 h - 3 beef jerkies
 A - 14 fruits
 K - 18 slices of pizza
 P - a meat ration


   Skills:
 + Level 22.7 Fighting
 + Level 17.1 Polearms
 + Level 18.5 Throwing
 + Level 15.6 Armour
 - Level 24.0 Dodging
 - Level 4.0 Shields
 - Level 8.0 Spellcasting
 + Level 17.6 Charms
 - Level 8.5 Necromancy
 - Level 5.0 Invocations
 - Level 7.0 Evocations


You have 37 spell levels left.
You know the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Regeneration          Chrm/Necr      #####.....   3%          3    ##.....
b - Repel Missiles        Chrm/Air       ####..       12%         2    None





[Xgamer4]

Damn.

Is that what you need to do to get Oka to cooperate with drops? Set out to show us that no, really, a combo can be decent? I'm not particularly sure this proves your point (I'm pretty sure anything could be decent with that pile of equipment), but man, I wouldn't complain.

[Damiac]

Hah, like I said, this character doesn't prove anything.  A mummy would be excellent with this equipment.  Of course, I did have to survive to lair before things started getting silly.   I got shafted from d9 to d12, which was scary (this was before Oka started feeling generous).  At the point where I got the CPA and the game was busted wide open, I had successfully survived getting shafted to D12, and had 12 dodging, 13 polearms, and 10 fighting, which is the sort of skilling I'd recommend for a MfGl.

I maintain that this is a good combo, but not top tier.  The +0 HP apt is what prevents MF from being super good, I've found more and more as I've played this game that HP apt is probably the #1 indication of a race's strengths, putting aside weird stuff like centaur/spriggan/naga speed, and Octopode/felid/troll/ogre armor restrictions.  Although even with the troll armor restrictions, I'd put them at #1 easiest race for winning.  But I'd certainly put Minotaurs or Hill Orcs above Merfolk in terms of easy wins.

What MF are really, really good at is getting established early on, which is quite important.  A MF can turn on polearms(+4 apt!), dodging(+3 apt!), and fighting(+1 apt), and will have a pretty easy time getting to lair.  From there, you have to consider what the game gives you, but halberds at least are plentiful, and you're likely to be able to find a glaive in orc.

As I think this character demonstrates, their -3 armor apt doesn't prevent them from wearing heavy armor, although it shouldn't be the default option.  And dodging skill doesn't go to waste even in heavy armor, as I think my 22 EV demonstrates.

[flame99]

Low MR, poor strategy, and not having gotten statue form reliably online yet meant that I ended up being killed by an invisible vampire while confused.

[Arcvasti]

Yeah, Merfolk Transmuters are pretty neat. I've done much better with them then trying to struggle through Polearms' mediocrity. The -2 Earth makes it a tad harder to get Statue Form online, which is unquestionably the best UC Transmutation. I personally prefer Draconian/Naga Transmuters for their additional robustness, MfTm is quite good too.

[frostshotgg]

OpTm's are pretty effective as well. I find they're really easy to get off the ground because unarmed is fantastic in the first few dungeon floors.