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[Damiac]

At around XL21 the abyss becomes pretty farmable.  You still get pretty decent XP, and are unlikely to face terrible dangers.  But, instead of farming it, you might as well just go after the rune. 

I find it to be a decent interlude between finishing depths, and clearing vault5.  Just be ready to use a teleport scroll if the RNG gives you a bunch of tough monsters.  And keep moving.

[Mindmaker]

Well I should have said "survivable without being a resource drain".

Later levels can leave you beaten up without a way to heal up, due to a lack of terrain blocking LoS, in conjunction with higher spawnrate and teleporting you around.
And those "torment spores" get pretty common once you hit Abyss:4 leaving you permanently wounded. Of course, all of that doesn't apply when you stay on the upper floors.

It's usually my fifth rune, unless I  get banished early and think I can take it.

[Retropunch]

Yeah Abyss is a much more survivable as long as you have sufficient teleporting/blinking/swiftness. I'm rather partial to having a delve there for a while once I'm up to a sufficient level for a few extra bits/XP if I'm short of something for extended.

Covenant: Playing clinging did unfortunately get removed recently. I have no idea why.

[tompliss]

It's usually my fifth rune, unless I  get banished early and think I can take it.

Which 4 do you get before ?
2 from easy lair branches are obvious, 1 from Vault seems usual (even if I think it is actually harder but less random, so less risky to get it), but the fourth ?

[Retropunch]

It's usually my fifth rune, unless I  get banished early and think I can take it.

Which 4 do you get before ?
2 from easy lair branches are obvious, 1 from Vault seems usual (even if I think it is actually harder but less random, so less risky to get it), but the fourth ?

Although I'm not the focus of the question, Slime usually ends up not too difficult as long as you have resist corrosion and resist mutation. The trick with it is to ignore all the top 5 floors and just dive to the bottom to kill the golden jelly. The guaranteed boat load of loot means you'll normally get at least one or two items you actually need/want.

[Mindmaker]

Pretty much this.
I don't know if it used to be more difficult in early version, but I didn't have much problems clearing it even before the corrosion fix.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I even explore every floor, despite no loot.

[Moron]

IMO the biggest danger in Slime is getting paralysed by giant eyeballs - better make sure you have an amulet of stasis, or a smite targeted spell that can take them out as soon as they come into LOS.

[tompliss]

Paralization is the biggest short term danger, but mutation is bigger longer term : Blurry vision, berserkitis, shoutitis, and many other mad mutations can srew up your character real bad.

[Robsoie]

In the end that's the same as Abyss and nearly everything else in Crawl actually, if you're having a high level enough, the items/resistances/spells/abilities you need for it, Slime Pit is not too hard.

But if you're not having a high level enough, do not have the items/resistances/spells/abilities you need for it, the same as with Abyss, going into Slime Pits is simply calling for a YASD for your character.

[tompliss]

I think it is a bit different, after all :
Slime is really based on your special resists, and you only really need damage (whatever the type) for TRJ. It is also nearly useless to go in if you don't plan on taking the rune.
Vault is more about AC/EV/stealth, and damage all the way. It is "harder" (in the way that even with good loot, you need to be more powerful than in other 3rd rune branches), but more streamlined, and with more "guaranted" loot along the way.
Abyss is more random, and less based on resist (even if Stasis and rMut really help), and even if AC/EV/Stealth (moreso this third) and speed help, hey aren't as required as in Vault.

I've grabbed the Abyssal rune with characters that would stand nearly no chance in Vault:1

[Graven]

So I realised I haven't actually played for quite a while now, and downloaded the newest trunk.

Rolled a DrWa, since I've not won either of these, and went with Capitalism, a.k.a. Gozag.

Dude's saved my life on several occasions, potion injection is awesome, summon shopkeeper is eh. I summoned three, all three are in the vaults. I can't actually get any rune right now, so that 5k gold is, for now, irrevocably lost.

I've also coasted through the Lair, Orc, Elf and the Abyss riding on my sweet +3 Whip of electrocution. Not Demon whip, ordinary whip. As you can imagine, the abyss was not really fun. I really need a better weapon. I've also got a potion of experience I'm stashing until I figure out how Gozag's duplication ability works.

Code: [Select]

Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.15-a0-1638-g2ba718f (tiles) character file.

Gravenous the Warrior (Grey Draconian Wanderer)    Turns: 46713, Time: 01:22:38

HP 162/162       AC 22     Str 17      XL: 17   Next: 97%
MP  45/45        EV 18     Int 17 (19) God: Gozag
Gold 1162        SH 13     Dex 12      Spells:  3 memorised, 37 levels left

rFire  + + .     SeeInvis +     m - +3 whip (elec)
rCold  . . .     Clarity  .     (armour unavailable)
rNeg   + . .     rCorr    .     X - +0 shield {rF+}
rPois  +         rRot     .     F - +2 hat of the Bear Spirit {Spirit, +Rage rN+ MR++}
rElec  .         Spirit   +     s - +1 cloak
SustAb .         Warding  .     P - +1 pair of gloves {Dex+3}
rMut   +         Stasis   .     B - +1 pair of boots
Gourm  .                        y - amulet of resist mutation
MR     ++++.                    n - ring "Crey" {MR+ Slay+3 Stlth--}
                                A - ring of Existentialism {rPois rF+ MP+9 SInv}

@: drained, incredibly resistant to hostile enchantments, extremely unstealthy
A: walk through water, unfitting armour, large and strong wings, unbreathing,
cold-blooded, AC +14
a: Fly, Potion Petition, Call Merchant, Bribe Branch, Renounce Religion, Evoke
Berserk Rage


You are on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts.
You worship Gozag.
Gozag is noncommittal.
You are not hungry.

You have visited 7 branches of the dungeon, and seen 33 of its levels.
You have visited the Abyss 1 time.
You have also visited: Labyrinth.

You have collected 10388 gold pieces.
You have spent 2071 gold pieces at shops.
You have paid 7155 gold pieces to Gozag.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 e - a glowing great mace
 m - a +3 whip of electrocution (weapon)
Armour
 a - a large shield
 s - a +1 cloak (worn)
 B - a +1 pair of boots (worn)
 F - the +2 hat of the Bear Spirit (worn) {Spirit, +Rage rN+ MR++}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 4 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   It protects you from negative energy.
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It lets you go berserk.
 P - a +1 pair of gloves of dexterity (worn)
 X - a +0 shield of fire resistance (worn)
Magical devices
 c - a wand of slowing {zapped: 8}
 d - a wand of magic darts
 k - a wand of heal wounds {zapped: 4}
 p - a wand of teleportation
 u - a wand of teleportation
 C - a wand of digging {zapped: 6}
 J - a wand of teleportation
 M - a wand of disintegration {empty}
 V - a wand of teleportation
 W - a wand of teleportation {zapped: 1}
Comestibles
 f - 5 bread rations
 g - 6 meat rations
 i - 10 fruits
 q - 4 beef jerkies
 t - a slice of pizza
Scrolls
 b - 6 scrolls of amnesia
 j - 8 scrolls of remove curse
 r - 4 scrolls of fog
 v - 6 scrolls of magic mapping
 x - 5 scrolls of identify
 D - 2 scrolls of teleportation
 Y - a scroll of vulnerability
Jewellery
 l - an uncursed ring of see invisible
 n - the ring "Crey" (right hand) {MR+ Slay+3 Stlth--}
   (You took it off a deep elf high priest on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   [ring of protection from magic]
   
   It affects your accuracy and damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks
   (+3).
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It makes you much less stealthy.
 o - an uncursed ring of regeneration
 w - a ring of intelligence
 y - an amulet of resist mutation (around neck)
 A - the ring of Existentialism (left hand) {rPois rF+ MP+9 SInv}
   (You took it off a deep elf sorcerer on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   [ring of magical power]
   
   It protects you from fire.
   It protects you from poison.
   It affects your magic capacity (+9).
   It enhances your eyesight.
 E - an uncursed ring of sustain abilities
Potions
 z - 3 potions of brilliance
 H - a potion of heal wounds
 I - a potion of restore abilities
 L - 2 potions of curing
Miscellaneous
 S - a phial of floods
 T - a phial of floods
 U - a lamp of fire


   Skills:
 - Level 17,4(16,5) Fighting
 - Level 12,0(11,2) Maces & Flails
 - Level 12,5(11,7) Dodging
 - Level 1,0(0,4) Stealth
 - Level 15,0(14,1) Shields
 - Level 12,1(11,3) Spellcasting
 - Level 8,1(7,3) Charms
 - Level 1,0(0,4) Summonings
 - Level 6,9(6,2) Translocations
   Level 1,2(0,6) Earth Magic
 * Level 0,0 Evocations


You have 37 spell levels left.
You know the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Apportation           Tloc           ####......   1%          1    None
b - Infusion              Chrm           ####..       1%          1    None
c - Summon Butterflies    Summ           ##......     10%         1    None


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:6             Orc (4/4) D:11
    Elf (3/3) Orc:3          Lair (8/8) D:10         Shoals (1/5) Lair:5
 Spider (1/5) Lair:4        Slime (0/6) Lair:8       Vaults (0/5) D:14
 Depths (0/5) D:15       

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Gozag
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh

Shops:
D:5 [*%   D:7 (   D:13 *   D:15 }   Orc:4 *[:(   Elf:1 %   Vaults:2 (   Vaults:3 [   Vaults:4 (   Depths:1 =

Annotations:
Elf:2 Nikola
Lair:3 Snorg
Lair:7 exclusion: hydra


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You can walk through water.
Your dull iron-grey scales are very hard (AC +14).
Your body does not fit into most forms of armour.
You can survive without breathing.
Your cold-blooded metabolism reacts poorly to cold.
Your wings are large and strong.

I have to say, I'm loving the change to corrosion. Not really noticed any other changes, too busy trying to whip Executioners to death. [thank god for all that teleportation]

[Elephant Parade]

Uh-oh. My fighter is stuck in the Abyss at 9 HP, surrounded by monsters. This may be the end.

[MaximumZero]

Uh-oh. My fighter is stuck in the Abyss at 9 HP, surrounded by monsters. This may be the end.

* MaximumZero takes off his hat.

[tompliss]

A lucky scroll of fear might do it (scroll, heal*2, TP, maybe invis/agility potions while you wait for the TP, or hide behind a wall)...

[Graven]

Huh, did they change Shields calculation or something? With 25 skill in Shields and a Large Shield I have 24 SH, whereas before I'd have more than twice that.

This is odd, I wouldn't have picked shields as something that needed nerfing, considering how much their usefulness drops in end-game and extended. Or am I going crazy[ier] somehow?

edit : OH JESUS LORD. I decided to go take on V:5, since I wasn't feeling up to Slime or Zot. Had absolutely no chance of tanking the starting ambush with my puny Draconian defensive skills, so I took a teleport. It sent me to a presumably safe spot, but just around the corner... BLAM! Two titans and stuff. And I was wearing boots of flying.

Before I realise what is going on, I'm at like 30 HP. Ohgodpanic! I bribe the branch end for 3k - all my gold. It does... nothing. Titans are commies, apparently, and keep on slamming my rotten capitalistic head. I manage to weave two Phials of flooding inbetween the 14 [!!!!] charges of healing it takes me to live through this.

I'm alive, in the middle of the vaults, with no consumables. And no gold to sustain my crippling potion habit.

edit : Draconians are a dumb race. The experience I pooled into Shields is dumb experience. Large shields are dumb shields :|

Code: [Select]

Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.15-a0-1638-g2ba718f (tiles) character file.

706689 Gravenous the Peltast (level 27, -1/249 (258) HPs)
             Began as a Grey Draconian Wanderer on June 21, 2014.
             Was an Initiate of Gozag.
             Killed by the power of Zot (38 damage)
             ... on Level 2 of the Realm of Zot on June 22, 2014.
             The game lasted 03:11:52 (97595 turns).

Gravenous the Peltast (Grey Draconian Wanderer)    Turns: 97595, Time: 03:11:52

HP  -1/249 (258) AC 26     Str 17      XL: 27
MP   0/50        EV 25     Int  6 (26) God: Gozag
Gold 2001        SH 24     Dex 13      Spells:  7 memorised, 37 levels left

rFire  + + .     SeeInvis +     e - +6 eveningstar of Tiecs {crush, MR+ Int+2 SInv}
rCold  . . .     Clarity  .     (armour unavailable)
rNeg   + . .     rCorr    .     l - +0 large shield
rPois  +         rRot     .     F - +2 hat of the Bear Spirit {Spirit, +Rage rN+ MR++}
rElec  .         Spirit   +     Y - +2 cloak {MR+}
SustAb .         Warding  .     P - +1 pair of gloves {Dex+3}
rMut   +         Rnd*Tele +     o - +0 pair of boots {Fly}
Gourm  .                        y - amulet of resist mutation
MR     +++++                    s - ring of protection from fire
                                A - ring of Existentialism {rPois rF+ MP+9 SInv}

@: flying, slowed, very slow, almost entirely resistant to hostile enchantments,
unstealthy
A: walk through water, unfitting armour, deformed body, teleportitis 1,
unbreathing, cold-blooded, AC +18
a: Potion Petition, Call Merchant, Bribe Branch, Renounce Religion, Evoke
Berserk Rage, Stop Flying
}: 5/15 runes: barnacled, slimy, silver, abyssal, gossamer


You were on level 2 of the Realm of Zot.
You worshipped Gozag.
Gozag was noncommittal.
You were near starving.

You visited 11 branches of the dungeon, and saw 59 of its levels.
You visited the Abyss 2 times.
You also visited: Labyrinth.

You collected 31802 gold pieces.
You spent 4932 gold pieces at shops.
You paid 24869 gold pieces to Gozag.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 e - the +6 eveningstar of Tiecs (weapon) {crush, MR+ Int+2 SInv}
   (You acquired it on level 4 of the Shoals)   
   
   It inflicts extra damage upon your enemies.
   
   It affects your intelligence (+2).
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It enhances your eyesight.
Armour
 l - a +0 large shield (worn)
 o - a +0 pair of boots of flying (worn)
 F - the +2 hat of the Bear Spirit (worn) {Spirit, +Rage rN+ MR++}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 4 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   It protects you from negative energy.
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It lets you go berserk.
 P - a +1 pair of gloves of dexterity (worn)
 Y - a +2 cloak of magic resistance (worn)
Magical devices
 b - a wand of heal wounds (2)
 m - a wand of teleportation (3)
 p - a wand of teleportation (3)
 t - a wand of digging (14)
 u - a wand of teleportation (4)
 C - a wand of draining (7)
 J - a wand of teleportation (3)
 M - a wand of teleportation (4)
 V - a wand of teleportation (3)
 W - a wand of teleportation (3)
Comestibles
 d - 7 royal jellies
 f - 7 bread rations
 g - 4 meat rations
 i - 20 fruits
Scrolls
 j - 11 scrolls of remove curse
 r - 11 scrolls of fog
 v - 8 scrolls of magic mapping
 x - 5 scrolls of identify
 D - a scroll of teleportation
 I - 2 scrolls of silence
 Q - a scroll of amnesia
 R - 3 scrolls of fear
Jewellery
 a - an uncursed amulet of resist corrosion
 n - the ring "Crey" {MR+ Slay+3 Stlth--}
   (You took it off a deep elf high priest on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   [ring of protection from magic]
   
   It affects your accuracy and damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks
   (+3).
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It makes you much less stealthy.
 s - a ring of protection from fire (right hand)
 y - an amulet of resist mutation (around neck)
 A - the ring of Existentialism (left hand) {rPois rF+ MP+9 SInv}
   (You took it off a deep elf sorcerer on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   [ring of magical power]
   
   It protects you from fire.
   It protects you from poison.
   It affects your magic capacity (+9).
   It enhances your eyesight.
 B - the ring of Grontol {Ice Slay+4}
   (You took it off a yaktaur captain on level 5 of the Vaults)   
   
   [ring of ice]
   
   It enhances your ice magic, and weakens your fire magic.
   It affects your accuracy and damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks
   (+4).
   It makes you vulnerable to fire.
   It protects you from cold.
 H - an uncursed ring of wizardry
 X - an uncursed ring of protection from cold
Potions
 c - 3 potions of invisibility
 k - a potion of restore abilities
 z - 6 potions of brilliance
 G - a potion of flight
 L - 9 potions of curing
 N - 3 potions of resistance
Miscellaneous
 h - a phial of floods (inert)
 q - a phial of floods (inert)
 E - a phial of floods (inert)
 K - a lamp of fire
 O - a lamp of fire
 S - a phial of floods (inert)
 T - a phial of floods (inert)
 U - a lamp of fire
 Z - a phial of floods (inert)


   Skills:
 + Level 23,2 Fighting
 - Level 16,1 Maces & Flails
 * Level 22,4 Dodging
 - Level 1,0 Stealth
 - Level 25,0 Shields
 - Level 12,1 Spellcasting
 - Level 8,1 Charms
 - Level 1,0 Summonings
 - Level 6,9 Translocations
   Level 1,2 Earth Magic
 - Level 10,0 Evocations


You had 37 spell levels left.
You knew the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Apportation           Tloc           ##........   1%          1    None
b - Infusion              Chrm           ##....       1%          1    None
c - Summon Butterflies    Summ           #.......     12%         1    None
d - Repel Missiles        Chrm/Air       #.....       4%          2    ##.....
e - Blink                 Tloc           N/A          1%          2    ##.....
f - Regeneration          Chrm/Necr      #.........   10%         3    ###....
g - Spectral Weapon       Hex/Chrm       #.......     10%         3    ###....


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:6             Orc (4/4) D:11
    Elf (3/3) Orc:3          Lair (8/8) D:10         Shoals (5/5) Lair:5
 Spider (5/5) Lair:4        Slime (6/6) Lair:8       Vaults (5/5) D:14
  Crypt (0/3) Vaults:2        Zot (2/5) Depths:5     Depths (5/5) D:15

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Gozag
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh
Jiyva

Shops:
D:5 [*%   D:7 (   D:13 *   D:15 }   Orc:4 *[:(   Elf:1 %   Shoals:2 ?   Shoals:5 }   Vaults:2 (   Vaults:3 [
Vaults:4 ([   Depths:1 %=   Depths:2 =   Depths:3 *   Depths:4 =[   Depths:5 (=?[

Portals:
Hell: Depths:1 Depths:2 Depths:3 Depths:4 Depths:5
Abyss: Depths:4
Pandemonium: Depths:3
Ziggurat: Depths:1
Trove: Depths:1 (give 5 scrolls of blinking)

Annotations:
Elf:2 Nikola
Lair:7 exclusion: hydra


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You can walk through water.
Your dull iron-grey scales are very hard (AC +18).
Your body does not fit into most forms of armour.
You can survive without breathing.
Your cold-blooded metabolism reacts poorly to cold.
Your body is misshapen.
Space occasionally distorts in your vicinity.