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[ChairmanPoo]

IMO sticks to snakes is not better than spammals, what with needing raw materials. You can spammal all the way to make hordes able to eat pretty much any monster. With sticks to snakes, you are more limited. Even if you pile huge ammounts of arrows, you still have to pick your battles. Plus, it takes more mana.

[Grendus]

Sticks biggest drawback is requiring ammo. I found, however, that I used both consistently as a summoner. StS has the advantage of power, while spammals can summon large numbers of creatures. Use a few StS with clubs, throw in some arrows, and back them up with spammal cannon fodder and you can clear out most of orc without too much danger.

[beorn080]

Oh yeah, StS isn't bad. I merely think that Spammels is better, PLUS you never risk an angry spammel, while snakes can be violent at you.

[Dr.Feelgood]

Been playing a fire wizard, and once you get over the initial hurdle it's fairly fun. However, I'm noticing that Conjure Flame doesn't seem to hurt zombies, but Throw Flame does. Am I just really unlucky, or are zombies immune to the stationary killer fire?

Zombies are not immune. You have to keep them in the fire for a few turns.

IMO sticks to snakes is not better than spammals, what with needing raw materials. You can spammal all the way to make hordes able to eat pretty much any monster. With sticks to snakes, you are more limited. Even if you pile huge ammounts of arrows, you still have to pick your battles. Plus, it takes more mana.

The strongest creature you can summon with spammals is a gray rat. Sticks to Snakes can summon vipers, black mambas, or anacondas. Any weapon with a wooden handle can be used, not just arrows. Arrows only summon water moccasins and regular snakes.

Oh yeah, StS isn't bad. I merely think that Spammels is better, PLUS you never risk an angry spammel, while snakes can be violent at you.

Snakes can only be hostile if you sacrificed a cursed item to summon them. You can wield anything in the game to check its status.

[ChairmanPoo]

The strongest creature you can summon with spammals is a gray rat. Sticks to Snakes can summon vipers, black mambas, or anacondas. Any weapon with a wooden handle can be used, not just arrows. Arrows only summon water moccasins and regular snakes.

True, but you can summon as many grey rats as you want. At level 5 of summoning you get two mammals per cast. I doubt very much you get more killing efficiency than a rat horde, even with strong snakes (which you wont be getting all too often, given that you need to sacrifice good items for that)

Snakes can only be hostile if you sacrificed a cursed item to summon them. You can wield anything in the game to check its status.

you can wield anything in the game to check its status, but you cannot unwield everything afterwards

[Grendus]

The strongest creature you can summon with spammals is a gray rat. Sticks to Snakes can summon vipers, black mambas, or anacondas. Any weapon with a wooden handle can be used, not just arrows. Arrows only summon water moccasins and regular snakes.

True, but you can summon as many grey rats as you want. At level 5 of summoning you get two mammals per cast. I doubt very much you get more killing efficiency than a rat horde, even with strong snakes (which you wont be getting all too often, given that you need to sacrifice good items for that)

You can summon as many snakes as you want as well. Most people who rely on StS use arrows rather than clubs or staves for fuel. A good 30 stack of arrows is enough for 15 summons, and since you need fewer snakes than spammals to take down a target that's quite a bit of power. If you want stronger summons, taking the clubs off the dead orcs and goblins or the spears from the gnolls will net you a big snake. By the time those aren't enough to reliably win, you should be upgrading to ice beasts, demons, and ugly things.

Snakes can only be hostile if you sacrificed a cursed item to summon them. You can wield anything in the game to check its status.

you can wield anything in the game to check its status, but you cannot unwield everything afterwards

But you can summon a snake with a cursed item to get rid of it. If you're paranoid about it being a very strong snake, stand on a staircase and summon spammals (you should always have spammals, at least until you find butterflies) until it can only place the snake 2 or 3 squares away, then go up the stairs and wait for the summons to go away. Never try to use an unchecked club or staff to summon a powerful snake in combat.

StS isn't better than spammals, but it has it's merits. It's a very powerful spell, when used correctly, and a good summoner knows when to mix summons to achieve the desired effect.

[Mr.Person]

I disagree. I think Sticky Flame is a better spell than Mephitic Cloud. MC is resistible, doesn't work if your foe rPois, doesn't actually damage your foe, and only confuses your foe. Sticky Flame can miss and sometimes doesn't last long. But really, it's whatever works for you that matters. Confusion's getting a bigass nerf in 0.7.0 (either enemies snap out of it sooner, you stay confused for longer, or both), I can tell you that. MC might get a buff to compensate, but then again, Sticky Flame might also get nerfed. I'm not sure.

One thing I can tell you, however, is that the "kill-it-before-it-can-hit-me" mentality doesn't work in the long run. Eventually, you get hit. ALL of the mid-game uniques cast spells. The badass ones cast Iron Shot and Crystal Spear. These can easily do 80 damage that ignores AC. Centaur and Yaktaur groups will rape you alive since they've got better range, more health, and much better speed. Bees have buttloads of EV and ok HP, come in groups, and move very fast. No way you can kill a whole group of bees before they reach you. You NEED to train Dodging up to about 10 when you enter Lair, 15 when you're getting into Vaults, and 20 when you hit the end-game. Mephitic or whatever, not a huge deal. When I turned Dodging back on and trained it, I became much better able to survive.

[Leafsnail]

It's odd, actually - that mentality worked great against yaks, death yaks and bees.  Once confused, you can kill them at leisure.  Sure, bees move fast, but if they're moving in the wrong direction and stinging each other repeatedly that isn't helping them much.  And casters can be disabled in a single shot by Mephitic Cloud, at least early on.

MC is eventually rendered useless by the increasing tendancy towards enemies with rPois, but by this time you should have a lot of other spells to hand (including, in my case, Sticky Flame and Mystic Blast).  After all, pretty much all of your starting spells will become useless at some point or another, and if they increase your survivability while you have them, so much the better.

[Mr.Person]

That's why I said both are fine. Blink is a great spell, I'm just not a fan. MC is a great spell, I just have more fun using Sticky Flame. I also tend to last longer since I don't get gibbed by Spiny Frogs and Hydra. On the other hand, that's probably just me sucking, not the spell.

[Leafsnail]

Yeah... I kinda hope that Sif Muna's given me something I can use on hydras by the time I get to them.  Otherwise it's running away/ throw flame/ blinking a lot .  Or just using up a couple of staffs while I wait for somethin' good.

[Grendus]

Slow can be your friend against strong, poison immune enemies. It's not exactly a fire wizard's forte, but it's great for holding the nasties back.

[Dr.Feelgood]

I disagree. I think Sticky Flame is a better spell than Mephitic Cloud. MC is resistible, doesn't work if your foe rPois, doesn't actually damage your foe, and only confuses your foe. Sticky Flame can miss and sometimes doesn't last long. But really, it's whatever works for you that matters. Confusion's getting a bigass nerf in 0.7.0 (either enemies snap out of it sooner, you stay confused for longer, or both), I can tell you that. MC might get a buff to compensate, but then again, Sticky Flame might also get nerfed. I'm not sure.

Confusion can cause instant death if your enemy is near deep water/lava and can't swim. Most early/mid-game monsters are not poison resistant (including uniques). You can cause several enemies to kill each other/themselves. The fact that it acts like a pseudo-paralysis makes it overpowered. IIRC Mepthic Cloud is only getting a duration nerf. I don't see how that is going to make it inferior to Sticky Flame.

One thing I can tell you, however, is that the "kill-it-before-it-can-hit-me" mentality doesn't work in the long run. Eventually, you get hit. ALL of the mid-game uniques cast spells. The badass ones cast Iron Shot and Crystal Spear. These can easily do 80 damage that ignores AC. Centaur and Yaktaur groups will rape you alive since they've got better range, more health, and much better speed. Bees have buttloads of EV and ok HP, come in groups, and move very fast. No way you can kill a whole group of bees before they reach you. You NEED to train Dodging up to about 10 when you enter Lair, 15 when you're getting into Vaults, and 20 when you hit the end-game. Mephitic or whatever, not a huge deal. When I turned Dodging back on and trained it, I became much better able to survive.

Completely untrue. Here's a 90HP DEWz with only 5 levels in dodging.

Here are some more examples: LV18 spriggans

All of my spell casters never get within melee range of dangerous monsters. There was a guy who won with a mummy wizard that had zero fighting and dodging skill. And another guy named Dedastry who won with 21 max HP.

Yeah... I kinda hope that Sif Muna's given me something I can use on hydras by the time I get to them.  Otherwise it's running away/ throw flame/ blinking a lot .  Or just using up a couple of staffs while I wait for somethin' good.

Hydras have low MR, so use Slow on them and spam Throw Flame.

[Mr.Person]

Alright, fine. You caught me. If you're really good, you can play a challenge game. Good for those dudes!

[DJ]

I don't get why the summoning book is listed as suboptimal choice for a wizard. Repel Missiles is sweet, worth ditching Throw Flame IMO. And Canine Familiar, while not as good as Conjure Flame, is still a decent spell.

[ChairmanPoo]

Canine familiar is not that much better than summon mammals, that might be it's greatest disadvantage. Missile protect can save your life, though