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[ggeezz]

Anyone played a long enough time with the new training system ?

I've played a few games with it.  It's nice not to have to victory dance.  It's been easier to train fighting with my SpEn.  I'm level 12 and fighting is at 9.  If you're in manual mode, skills you turn off don't get trained all.  Short blades is still level 1 for me, even though I've used it a lot.

The downsides I see are that you cannot save up experience then pour it into one skill.  I'm also not sure how you get your first level in a new skill since you don't have a pool.  I think I've gained first levels in magic skills sometime after learning a spell in that school.  But I'm not sure how it works yet.

[ggeezz]

I can totally understand the removal of Berserk Rage. It gives all the OPness of berserk without having to commit to the annoying crime of abandoning Trog late game when he becomes useless.

Also, I've come to the conclusion that the hardest class to play is EE, for the simple fact that no race has good aptitudes for it.

You should watch elliptic play a DDEE.  Of course, elliptic makes everything look easy, but I didn't understand how to use the skills until I watched him.

[Frumple]

I can totally understand the removal of Berserk Rage. It gives all the OPness of berserk without having to commit to the annoying crime of abandoning Trog late game when he becomes useless.

Also, I've come to the conclusion that the hardest class to play is EE, for the simple fact that no race has good aptitudes for it.

Sludge elves

Only one with positive apts on both earth and transmutation. Interesting that fire and ice both lack a race with +3 apt for it, though. Only earth (DD), air (Kenku), and poison (Naga) has that. Maybe the lava orc'll have +3 fire.

For 'zerk, though, it could probably be noted it's a much higher opportunity cost for a hybrid caster than it is for a trog worshipper, since it shuts down spellcasting until it's over. It's somethng, anyway. Was the spell removed entirely, or just from crusader's starting book?

[Dr.Feelgood]

I can totally understand the removal of Berserk Rage. It gives all the OPness of berserk without having to commit to the annoying crime of abandoning Trog late game when he becomes useless.

Also, I've come to the conclusion that the hardest class to play is EE, for the simple fact that no race has good aptitudes for it.

Dwarves are good with earth magic. MDEE and DDEE are both pretty easy. I haven't won with a SEEE yet, so no comment.

[ggeezz]

Thinking about the training system some more . . .   The fact that you can train skills without using them is a game changer in many ways.  I haven't played a hybrid yet but I imagine it's much easier to get spellcasting up and going.  You can wear armour that wouldn't allow to you cast spells, but still put experience into spellcasting skills.

With an SpEn you can put experience into spellcasting while killing things with darts, saving food in the very beginning.

[breadbocks]

Spellcasting. The same problem goes for MD. I've not yet actually tried a SEEE. As for IEs and FEs, I prefer DEs, for the massive boost on spellcasting.

Also, what's this I hear about new training system?

EDIT: Just downloaded the trunk to play skalds, holy shit, shroud! It's like repel missiles, but for meele!

[ggeezz]

Spellcasting. The same problem goes for MD. I've not yet actually tried a SEEE. As for IEs and FEs, I prefer DEs, for the massive boost on spellcasting.

Also, what's this I hear about new training system?

EDIT: Just downloaded the trunk to play skalds, holy shit, shroud! It's like repel missiles, but for meele!

Sandblast will get you by until you can get spellcasting up.  You just need to manage your rocks wells.

[Robsoie]

I can totally understand the removal of Berserk Rage. It gives all the OPness of berserk without having to commit to the annoying crime of abandoning Trog late game when he becomes useless.

Also, I've come to the conclusion that the hardest class to play is EE, for the simple fact that no race has good aptitudes for it.

You should watch elliptic play a DDEE.  Of course, elliptic makes everything look easy, but I didn't understand how to use the skills until I watched him.

It is strange to say that Earth Elementalist is the hardest class, considering that i only won Crawl once online since all the years i'm playing this game (it was in the tournament few months ago) and it was with a Demigod Earth Elementalist.

But i must say that i had to diversify my magic skills, not focus only on Earth magic , as i doubt my character would have survived without non-Earth spell for long in some of the very difficult situations my character surprisingly survived.

[breadbocks]

Spellcasting. The same problem goes for MD. I've not yet actually tried a SEEE. As for IEs and FEs, I prefer DEs, for the massive boost on spellcasting.

Also, what's this I hear about new training system?

EDIT: Just downloaded the trunk to play skalds, holy shit, shroud! It's like repel missiles, but for meele!

Sandblast will get you by until you can get spellcasting up.  You just need to manage your rocks wells.

I was wondering about that. How do you use rocks to power up sandblast?

[debvon]

Alright.. this has to be the LUCKIEST fighter I've ever played in my entire life. Before lair (somewhere around the temple I think?) I found the +6 +6 Lehudib's crystal spear {return}. Then inside the lair I cleared out an ice cave with demons and at the end was the +15 Maxwell's patent armour {rCorr, Cons, -CAST, -TELE, MR} which is an amazing pure fighter platemail. Right after I leave the ice cave I smack down a yak and Okawaru gifts me the +7+8 eveningstar "Abbaed" {flame, dex+3}, and I'm a mace fighter. Oh and I forgot to mention the artifact ring "Jula Wuu" {+Rage, +Lev, rElec, Dam+2} that I found earlier as well.

So I'm sitting here with 44 AC, 32 SH, an amazing throwing weapon, an artifact eveningstar, and I haven't even cleared lair yet. Moments like this make me forget all about the times crawl has screwed me over.

Spellcasting. The same problem goes for MD. I've not yet actually tried a SEEE. As for IEs and FEs, I prefer DEs, for the massive boost on spellcasting.

Also, what's this I hear about new training system?

EDIT: Just downloaded the trunk to play skalds, holy shit, shroud! It's like repel missiles, but for meele!

Sandblast will get you by until you can get spellcasting up.  You just need to manage your rocks wells.

I was wondering about that. How do you use rocks to power up sandblast?

ctrl+click your rocks to wield them, then use sandblast. It's amazingly powerful against unarmored things (and even armored-ish things) once it has some spell power behind it.

[breadbocks]

Huh. Also, the Crystal Spear is an actual weapon? I thought it was just a spell. >.>

Also, I <3 Zot Defense pet Sigmund Zombie.

[baruk]

For 'zerk, though, it could probably be noted it's a much higher opportunity cost for a hybrid caster than it is for a trog worshipper, since it shuts down spellcasting until it's over. It's somethng, anyway. Was the spell removed entirely, or just from crusader's starting book?

The smart crusader would always cast berserk last, after all his buff spells, so the lack of spell-casting is not really hurting him.
 The salient point is the opportunity cost of choosing a berserker over a crusader. If the berserk ability is what you're interested in, isn't it better to retain the option to cast spells? Flexibility is the key here - your power grows with your variety of options, not just the stackability of those options eg. just because you can't cast berserk AND silence together, doesn't mean it's not useful having both memorised.
 On balance I think it's a good decision to drop berserk from crusaders/skalds. It ought to be Trog's special thing. Turning it into a spell is actually kind of obscene, if you think about it from Trog's viewpoint (I'm not sure if the spell was actually removed or not).

[Robsoie]

Been playing a bit with the new train system that is supposed to replace the victory dancing, and overall it seems good, as you actually play the game to get your skills trained and no more of those boring minutes in not playing the game but just casting spells against nothing repeatedly in the hope of allocating your xp pool to specific skills.

Though i'm not sure of the difference between "auto" and "manual", as in both i could turn off some skills and have only the ones turned on being trained.
And i heard about the possibility to focus on some skill by "double" turning them on, but find nothing about it in the actual interface.

It's fun to explode an unique and get suddenly +1 skills to some of them.

I guess it will need some tuning though and possible that "auto" is not yet really implemented (as said i didn't noticed a difference from "manual", and i hope less opacity on how it exactly work.

[Rex_Nex]

Huh. Also, the Crystal Spear is an actual weapon? I thought it was just a spell. >.>

Also, I <3 Zot Defense pet Sigmund Zombie.

It's both. The weapon is a unrandart +int spear.

[G-Flex]

I don't really like the idea of choosing where your skills points go directly. I was always a fan of training them through use, although I guess I can't think of a better way to eliminate victory dancing.