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[Seriyu]

Does Vehumet lower the fail rate of your spells enough for heavy armor to be viable? I'd think even if Vehumet blasted spells into my brain, if I couldn't cast them, I'd be doomed.

Well, you can't use plate or anything, but I was casting low-ish level conjurations in... I think scale mail. Maybe ring mail. Level 1 and 2 spells were in single digit failure rates, and level 3 had 30 something. With more armor and conjurations skill it'd only get better.

[tompliss]

The runelock is annoying. I liked sneaking near the bottom of the dungeon and stabbing folks for massive experience. If I were going to do another low level run I'd probably go vaults, swamp or slime, and the abyss.

The runelock has been moved from the depth to the vault.
You can still reach the entrance of Zot without rune, and with the increased difficulty & xp of Depths, this doesn't change much for this

And by the way, An elf in elven ring mail has no spellcasting penalty, even without a god. Vehumet cen help them to go further (or simply help them with a non-elven armor, as those aren't exactly common).

[Antioch]

I don't get why the rune lock has been implemented anyway. The vaults are harder then the first runes in lair, and there is not any real loot or other benefits gained from entering the vaults early.

[Graven]

Currently the vaults are harder that anything in Lair, Slime included.

Someone on the dev team realised that having a corridor on the outer edge of the Vaults:5 gives people the chance to not slog through the entire ambush face-first and decided they were having none of that.

So now Vault:5 doesn't have an outer ring.

And as we all know, assholes can lock the stairs if you're trying to stairdance.

Basically what I'm saying is, fuck the vaults.

[tompliss]

So I guess I'm the only one who didn't go for the outer ring in the Vaults ?
I played some "easy" characters (DDBe, GrFi, MfGl), and some not so much (OgAM melee-oriented), but I never needed to go for the outer rim.
I know this is supposed to make it harder, but I don't think it will prevent "normal" characters from doing it...

[Dr Feelgood]

I used controlled teleport and magic mapping to grab the vault rune quickly. I did that twice. And a couple of my characters blinked away from the ambush, but that was to prevent getting hit by my own aoe spells. So... about 4 times.

Does anyone actually die to the ambush? I could see why they would want to make it harder. That being said, the outer ring was restored in the latest trunk build.

[Robsoie]

Does anyone actually die to the ambush? I could see why they would want to make it harder. That being said, the outer ring was restored in the latest trunk build.

I can imagine melee-only characters with no blinking scrolls available may have a really, really hard time in the ambush if there are one of those "i lock the stairs so you can't use it" power from some of the vault guys.

[tompliss]

Well ... You can only have 8 enemies around you, and the basic vault guards are easily handled with a bit of AC. Even my 30 AC Ogre went in there and squashed them one by one, making his own way to the warden and convokers...

[Seriyu]

So I made it to Zot 2! And died. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Seriously though, tips for Zot? First time getting three runes, I kind've expected to go down. Still, I got GDA, had maxed armor skill for it, had a nice lajatang, I was at least hoping to get pasted by an orb of fire or something. Am I supposed to clear floors in zot, or am I supposed to rush down to 5, clear it out, etc? There seemed to be a lot of rot flying around for me to do that.

I suppose I could've... remembered to use those elemental evocables, but I somehow doubt blowing them on a random draconian pack would've done much to help me in the actual hard part. I also didn't have too much evocations.

Spoiler: Char morgue (click to show/hide)

 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.14-a0-2682-g5763165 (tiles) character file.

538633 Seriyu the Invulnerable (level 24, -18/247 (249) HPs)
             Began as a Demonspawn Gladiator on Feb 17, 2014.
             Was a High Priest of Okawaru.
             Killed from afar by a purple draconian monk (35 damage)
             ... with a bolt of dispelling energy
             ... on Level 1 of the Realm of Zot on Feb 18, 2014.
             The game lasted 06:28:20 (95024 turns).

Seriyu the Invulnerable (Demonspawn Gladiator)     Turns: 95024, Time: 06:28:21

HP -18/247 (249) AC 48     Str 27      XL: 24   Next: 53%
MP  31/37        EV  7     Int 10      God: Okawaru [*****.]
Gold 4061        SH  0     Dex 20      Spells:  0 memorised, 23 levels left

rFire  + + .     SeeInvis +     e - +11,+4 lajatang "Ceadepae" {drain, rN+ Dex+2}
rCold  + + .     Clarity  +     C - -1 gold dragon armour
rNeg   + + +     Conserve .     (no shield)
rPois  +         rCorr    .     (helmet unavailable)
rElec  .         rRot     .     y - +4 dragonskin cloak
SustAb . .       Spirit   .     r - +2 pair of gloves "Cyebuc" {Str+4 Dam+3}
rMut   +         Warding  .     X - +2 pair of boots {run}
Saprov . . .     Stasis   .     w - amulet "Goacw" {rMut +Inv}
MR     +++..                    i - ring of Zozajeg {+Fly rPois rN+}
                                R - ring "Psuvem" {rF+ MR++ SInv}

@: heroism, finesse, quick, extremely resistant to hostile enchantments,
extremely unstealthy
A: horns 3, iridescent scales 3, breathe flames 1, clarity, cold resistance 1,
dopey 1, powered by death 3, robust 2, slow metabolism 1, spiny 3, strong 1
a: Heroism, Finesse, Renounce Religion, Breathe Fire, Evoke Invisibility, Evoke
Flight
}: 3/15 runes: decaying, serpentine, silver


You were on level 1 of the Realm of Zot.
You worshipped Okawaru.
Okawaru was extremely pleased with you.
You were not hungry.

You visited 9 branches of the dungeon, and saw 52 of its levels.
You visited the Abyss 2 times.
You visited 1 bazaar.
You also visited: Labyrinth and Sewer.

You collected 6395 gold pieces.
You spent 2334 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 e - the +11,+4 lajatang "Ceadepae" (weapon) {drain, rN+ Dex+2}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 2 of the Lair of Beasts)   
   
   A truly terrible weapon, it drains the life of those it strikes.
   
   It affects your dexterity (+2).
   It protects you from negative energy.
 m - a +7,+4 quarterstaff of electrocution
Missiles
 h - 5 throwing nets (quivered)
Armour
 g - a +0 cloak of preservation
 r - the +2 pair of gloves "Cyebuc" (worn) {Str+4 Dam+3}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 1 of the Vaults)   
   
   It affects your strength (+4).
   It affects your damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks (+3).
 y - the +4 dragonskin cloak (worn)
   (You took it off Tiamat on level 1 of the Realm of Zot)
 C - a -1 gold dragon armour (worn)
 N - the +0 cloak of Breigg {Dex+3}
   (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 4 of the Vaults)   
   
   It affects your dexterity (+3).
 X - a +2 pair of boots of running (worn)
Magical devices
 K - a wand of disintegration (9)
Comestibles
 f - 10 bread rations
Scrolls
 n - a scroll of fog
 p - 2 scrolls of blinking
 q - 3 scrolls of silence
 s - 2 scrolls of enchant weapon I
 x - 15 scrolls of teleportation
 z - 4 scrolls of fear
 D - 12 scrolls of remove curse
 F - a scroll of acquirement
 I - 7 scrolls of recharging
 J - 6 scrolls of magic mapping
 M - a scroll of amnesia
 W - 7 scrolls of identify
Jewellery
 i - the ring of Zozajeg (right hand) {+Fly rPois rN+}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 4 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   [ring of poison resistance]
   It protects you from negative energy.
   It lets you fly.
 w - the amulet "Goacw" (around neck) {rMut +Inv}
   (You took it off Tiamat on level 1 of the Realm of Zot)   
   
   [amulet of resist mutation]
   It lets you turn invisible.
 L - the cursed necklace of Bloodlust {*Rage +Rage MR+ Str+2 Int-2 Dam+5 Stlth- Curse}
   (You found it on level 1 of the Realm of Zot)   
   
   [amulet of rage]
   It affects your strength (+2).
   It affects your intelligence (-2).
   It affects your damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks (+5).
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It may make you go berserk in combat.
   It may recurse itself when equipped.
   It makes you less stealthy.
   It has a curse placed upon it.
 P - an uncursed ring of protection from cold
 R - the ring "Psuvem" (left hand) {rF+ MR++ SInv}
   (You found it on level 2 of the Vaults)   
   
   [ring of protection from fire]
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It enhances your eyesight.
 Y - an uncursed ring of protection from fire
 Z - an uncursed amulet of guardian spirit
Potions
 c - 5 potions of speed
 d - a potion of heal wounds
 k - 20 potions of curing
 l - 3 potions of resistance
 o - 6 potions of restore abilities
 t - 5 potions of brilliance
 A - 2 potions of lignification {unknown}
 B - a potion of degeneration {unknown}
 S - 2 potions of might
 T - 3 potions of flight
 V - 2 potions of porridge
Miscellaneous
 b - a phial of floods
 u - a lamp of fire
 v - a sack of spiders
 E - a fan of gales
 G - a fan of gales
Rods
 a - a +2 rod of the swarm (10/10)
   (You took it off Tiamat on level 1 of the Realm of Zot)


   Skills:
 + Level 21.1(26.1) Fighting
 - Level 14.0(19.0) Staves
 - Level 1.7(6.7) Throwing
 O Level 27 Armour
 - Level 2.6(7.6) Dodging
 - Level 11.7 Invocations
 + Level 14.6 Evocations


You had 23 spell levels left.
You didn't know any spells.

Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (16/16)            Temple (1/1) D:4             Orc (4/4) D:9
    Elf (0/3) Orc:4          Lair (8/8) D:11          Swamp (5/5) Lair:3
  Snake (5/5) Lair:4        Slime (0/6) Lair:7       Vaults (5/5) D:15
  Blade (0/1) Vaults:3      Crypt (0/5) Vaults:3        Zot (2/5) Depths:6
 Depths (6/6) D:16       

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh
Jiyva

Shops:
D:6 (   D:10 =   D:15 *   Orc:4 [=?*(   Snake:3 !   Snake:4 (   Vaults:2 :

Portals:
Hell: Depths:1 Depths:2 Depths:3 Depths:4 Depths:5 Depths:6
Abyss: Depths:1 Depths:2 Depths:4 Depths:6
Pandemonium: Depths:3 Depths:5 Depths:6
Ziggurat: Depths:1

Annotations:
D:7 Maurice
D:10 exclusion: door
Depths:1 exclusion: downstairs


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You have a pair of large horns on your head.
You are completely covered in iridescent scales (AC +8).
You can steal the life force of all defeated enemies in sight.
You are very robust (+20% HP).
You are completely covered in sharp spines.
You can breathe flames.
You possess an exceptional clarity of mind.
Your flesh is cold resistant.
You are dopey. (Int -2)
You have a slow metabolism.
Your muscles are strong. (Str +2)


Message History

The purple draconian monk is moderately wounded.
You hit the purple draconian monk.
You headbutt the purple draconian monk!!
The purple draconian monk is heavily wounded.
You hit the purple draconian monk but do no damage.
You drain the purple draconian monk!
Your headbutt misses the purple draconian monk.
The purple draconian monk is heavily wounded.
The grey draconian hits you but does no damage.
The grey draconian tail-slaps you but does no damage.
You miss the purple draconian monk.
Your headbutt misses the purple draconian monk.
The purple draconian monk is heavily wounded.
You hit the purple draconian monk but do no damage.
You drain the purple draconian monk!
You headbutt the purple draconian monk, but do no damage.
The purple draconian monk is heavily wounded.
The purple draconian monk breathes energy at you.
The bolt of dispelling energy hits you!
You die...

.........####dｧ#       #..#
.........#  #ｧｧ##     ##..#
.........#  #...#     #...#
......#..#  ##..### ###..##
..#####..##  #....###....#  #
...#  #...#  ##.........##  #
#..#  ##..##  ###.....###   #
#..##  #...##   #......#
#...#  ##...##  #......#####
##..##  ##...####.......##.##
 #...##  ##...@#.).........##
 ##...##  ##..dd...........##
  ##...##  ###.....).......##
#  ##...##   ####..........##
## ##.?..##     ####.......##
.###......###      #.......##
.#..........####   #.......##
...............#####.......##
...........................##
...>.^......##..^........###


You could see a purple draconian monk and a grey draconian.

[Grek]

Do not fight two draconians at once. Do use your acquirement scrolls instead of letting them sit in your inventory.

[tompliss]

Being in Gold Dragon armor and worshiping Oka means you only have Evocables to get away from bad situations :/

[Dr Feelgood]

You don't have to clear every level. About half of my wins involved rushing to the bottom level. I only bother clearing Zot levels for exp. A weapon with the freezing brand is useful against draconians, since it'll slow them down. Fear scrolls also work on them. The fog and blink scrolls could have saved you. Take your time in Zot. Fight everything one-on-one.

[Seriyu]

About fighting them one on one - The first floor had basically no one tile wide corridors, so... how was that supposed to happen? There was one, way at the right and frankly at that point I think it would've been better to stair dance. Are Zot floors pre generated? So ilike, next time I go there will it still be a big semicircle sort've setup?

And yeah,that's a second question, is GDA actually good? I checked the knowledge bots but in traditional knowledge bot fashion it gave me the resists, the stats, and snarky comments about it sucking despite not saying why it did. So I just equipped it! It seemed great, does it block translocations or something?

And yeah, I did completely forget about scrolls. Hurf.

[tompliss]

GDA is not bad, but not good enough to use a -1 one if you're worshipping Oka (as he should have gifted some shiny armor, with high enchant of nice ego like the damage boosters).

Zot are not pre-generated, but there are less designs for them (especially for zot:5, where the general layout is always the same). Anyway, it's always much more open than the rest of the dungeon, so it will be hard against drac packs, not matter what you do.

I find it weird you where not level 27 when you entered zot, by the way. And your 27 skill in armor is useless, as you worship Okawaru.
I think you could have visited the 2 first levels of Elf, to get soem more XP/gifts/piety.

The main reason GDA "sucks" is because you usually find those in the really late game (golden dragon become "common" only in Zot), and you should have spend your enchant armor scrolls on other armors by then.

Oh, by the way : GDA + Okawaru means you don't have abilities to flee other than evocables, as I said before. That also means your positionning is really important, and taking the decision to flee when you're at half HP is nearly mandatory. Especially agaisnt Draconians : some have really high damage spells, and you don't want them fight noises to atract a (ancient) lich to cast paralyze at you.

[Seriyu]

I actually didn't get a lot of armor gifts, the best thing I had was an rElec plate, I mostly just got quarterstaves otherwise. I have the worst luck with gear, even with oka.

I did notice I wasn't level 27, didn't know if it was worth trying to go for tomb or elf for the last few levels. Guess it was! Annnnd where do you stop training armor then? I was under the impression it was one of the skills you pretty universally took to 27 for the AC boost.