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[BFEL]

I think Shenron said he couldn't because 16 was wholly a robot whereas 17 and 18 were cyborgs. Or something.

Basically this. Which is totally bullshit but its the official explanation. Guess Toriyama is conservative about AI rights.

[Neonivek]

I think Shenron said he couldn't because 16 was wholly a robot whereas 17 and 18 were cyborgs. Or something.

Basically this. Which is totally bullshit but its the official explanation. Guess Toriyama is conservative about AI rights.

Yes but did he actually state that?

For example he never shown 17 being revived. It took until the end of the Buu saga to reveal that yes, in fact, he was still alive.

I am trying to see if this is either actually said, is a US dub only, or if this is one of those fan assumptions that get passed around so much people project it into the show.

[Solifuge]

Dang carbon chauvinist; artificial life is still life!

Spoiler: Hate to ramble about Kill la Kill again... but I have to say a little bit now that it's over, or I will explode from these feelings. (click to show/hide)

Sweet butts, what a show that was. The way they blended bombastic over-the-top-ness with a lot of really sweet or emotionally powerful moments between characters is really something else. The last bit of banter and clothing puns between Senketsu and Ryūko was so sweet and sad that I could've cried... it's like being sentimentally attached to a particular old garment that you can't wear anymore, and saying goodbye to a friend I know I'm never going to see again. I love how they use the Sailor Uniform as a symbol of youth too, and bringing that whole Growing Up and Moving On angle to the story.

I was really glad to see how they wrapped things up with the Graduation OVA Episode, too. It tied up some loose threads and did a pretty brilliant Before and After comparison of character growth in the same stroke. It's good of them to let the audience say their goodbyes to the setting as it sank into the sea, and farewell to the characters as they sailed off on the rest of their lives; I always get attached to stories I really like when they wrap up, but stuff like episode 25 helps. :3

I'm pretty sure that the emphasis on Humanity finally "being free to wear the clothes they want to wear" confirms my earlier read; in part, KlK seems like it was about challenging old cultural ideologies, accepting human bodies and human nature for what they are, and defining the terms on which we live our lives for ourselves rather than molding ourselves into existing cultural or social structures.

Speaking of which, that was a Date date between Mako and Ryūko, right? I don't know how to read the cultural cues, and that might have been a platonic thing... but when you think about how just the thought of one another always got them fired up to do their best, and how hard they fought to protect one another in their own ways, I'm -pretty sure- they're a thing. For one, it plays in really well with the theme of living free from old social structures and ideas of what was proper. For another, the stoic hardass with a sensitive side, and the cheerful tenacious goofball make a pretty dang cute couple.

Fond farewells, Kill la Kill. Looking forward to Trigger's next big series... I really like their style.

[Karnewarrior]

Sprin had to go, so it's just me and BFEL today

Spoiler: Monogatari Episodes 2-4 (click to show/hide)

6:57 PM - bfel001: WHO NEEDS SPRIN ANYWAY
6:57 PM - Karnewarrior: For me anything more than nekomimi is furry, and even that's a bit out of my normal comfort zone
6:57 PM - bfel001: HE WAS ONLY HOLDING US BACK
6:57 PM - Karnewarrior: THATS TRUE
6:57 PM - Karnewarrior: HE WAS
6:57 PM - Sprin was kicked by Karnewarrior.

7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: uh
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: was that her nipple
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: or her bellybutton
7:02 PM - bfel001: It was her cervix
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: oh ok good
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: I was scared for a second
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: that I saw a nipple
7:03 PM - Karnewarrior: and my purity in the eyes of god was tainted

7:13 PM - Karnewarrior: They're sending her to PRayer Camp
7:13 PM - bfel001: Nymphomaniac cat? WHEN DID THIS HAPPEN?
7:13 PM - Karnewarrior: To Pray the staples guy away

7:20 PM - Karnewarrior: HE just suplexed a God
7:20 PM - bfel001: I'll just judo throw a crab god
7:20 PM - Karnewarrior: Jhonny Bravo is a badass

7:25 PM - bfel001: STOCKING, WHERES PANTY
7:25 PM - Karnewarrior: taking dick

7:30 PM - bfel001: Seriously, is his cowlick sentient?!

7:31 PM - Karnewarrior: This is no longer Monogatari
7:31 PM - Karnewarrior: Now this is a Slice of Life about a girl who's the original in a world filled with clones
7:31 PM - Karnewarrior: Actually, the birth rate in Japan dropped so low, that the entire world started just cloning one person
7:31 PM - Karnewarrior: So her whole class, her teacher, everyone under the age of 13
7:32 PM - Karnewarrior: is all her genome
7:32 PM - Karnewarrior: she is
7:32 PM - Karnewarrior: MAHOU SHOUJO NANAKO ONE-CHAN!

7:47 PM - bfel001: He's like the most mundane superhero ever

7:44 PM - Karnewarrior: what
7:44 PM - Karnewarrior: am I watching
7:45 PM - bfel001: I DON'T KNOW
7:45 PM - bfel001: SHES LIKE THE MOST PASSIVE AGGRESSIVE TSUNDERE EVER
7:45 PM - Karnewarrior: How the fuck does that even work?

7:50 PM - Karnewarrior: He's in a serious fight with a middle schooler
7:50 PM - bfel001: IKR?
7:50 PM - bfel001: No ELEMENTARY SCHOOLER
7:51 PM - bfel001: WHAT THE SHIT DUDE
7:51 PM - Karnewarrior: I mean like
7:51 PM - Karnewarrior: a real, serious fight
7:51 PM - Karnewarrior: that he almost didn't win
7:51 PM - Karnewarrior: with a elementary schooler

7:52 PM - bfel001: She was down to fuck, and then he goes and assaults a little girl for no reason
7:53 PM - Karnewarrior: Story of my life

7:56 PM - Karnewarrior: I can't into this all over the place - IT'S LIKE THEY GRABBED AN ANIMATOR FROM EVERY COMPANY IN JAPAN (and like, twelve from Trigger) AND THEN THREW THEM ALL IN A ROOM AND HAD THEM COMMUNICATE THROUGH DRAWINGS
7:57 PM - bfel001: No I think they weren't in the same room. Half were at the bottom of the ocean, and the other half were in low earth orbit
7:57 PM - bfel001: And they were only allowed to communicate with the ones in the opposite location
7:57 PM - Karnewarrior: Through interpretive dance

8:07 PM - Karnewarrior: nice eigo, Staples
8:07 PM - bfel001: ENGLISH HAPPENED THERE
8:07 PM - bfel001: WE HAVE TO TELL SPRIN
8:07 PM - Karnewarrior: WE'VE FOUND THE DUB

8:17 PM - Karnewarrior: Congratulations on gut punching an eight year old into unconsciousness

8:23 PM - bfel001: [Johnny Bravo] probably wouldn't repeatedly beat [Snail] into unconsciouness repeatedly like SOME PEOPLE

[BFEL]

7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: uh
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: was that her nipple
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: or her bellybutton
7:02 PM - bfel001: It was her cervix
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: oh ok good
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: I was scared for a second
7:02 PM - Karnewarrior: that I saw a nipple
7:03 PM - Karnewarrior: and my purity in the eyes of god was tainted

Damn it Karne, you cut out the part about "she has a camera inside her, right next to the office depot"

[KingofstarrySkies]

I snorted loudly and nearly woke up sleeping people at the panty and stocking reference.

[Solifuge]

As I watch through Kiznaiver (which I'm really enjoying, mind you), I'm wondering if there's a gap in the corpus of anime and manga, or if I'm just not informed enough (probably this).

Can you recommend any series that uses unusual scenarios as a means of exploring human nature, relationships, life, or so on, but which centers around a cast of adults rather than school-aged folks? I'm guessing it's just a marketing demographic thing, but it seems like adolescent-focused stories get to have all the fun. I think there's plenty of room for stories built around adult characters dealing with a not-entirely-different set of challenges, between work and/or having young families, or dealing with the challenges of finding work and paying rent, or figuring out how to form new relationships after school, or generally learning how to Adult, you know?

[Orange Wizard]

As I watch through Kiznaiver (which I'm really enjoying, mind you), I'm wondering if there's a gap in the corpus of anime and manga, or if I'm just not informed enough (probably this).

Kiznaiver's an anime original, the manga's basically just a transcript.

[Reelya]

Generally, the type of stuff you're asking about is classed as Josei

Only generally however:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The four classifications Japan uses, Shonen, Shoujo, Seinen, Josei, don't describe specific comics, they describe the general market segment of the magazine that published it. For example, Death Note is "shonen" (for young boys) despite being violent and creepy, whereas K-On is "Seinen" (for adult men) despite being a cute series about 4 highschool girls, and Nana is "shoujo" (for young girls) despite dealing with adult relationships, and Chihayafuru is "josei" (for adult women) despite being about with highschoolers. Often mangakas offer their new comic to a range of magazines and the exact classification solely depends on which one picks it up. And the readership doesn't always match the "label":

If 50% of Weekly Shonen Jump readers are female, one can consider the magazine to be the most gender-neutral manga magazine out there today. The Nikkei Shimbun recently took a look at Japanese women that read Jump. The results were what fans might usually expect. As you can see, female readers love series like Haikyuu!!, Gintama, Katekyo Hitman Reborn, Kuroko no Basket, One Piece, and BLEACH. The boys loved titles like Nisekoi, Kochikame, Medaka Box, Toriko, Beelzebub, and Naruto.

So yeah, girls who aren't into the whole romcom thing actually read Shonen Jump in enough numbers to affect the type of content the provide.

Josei stuff is so rarely adapted that most of it is pretty good:
http://myanimelist.net/anime/genre/43/Josei

Well, i want through the other lists, Seinen, Shoujo and Shonen and picked out a few more that deal with human nature or relationships in a decent way:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Seinen
Planetes
Saraiya Goyou
Aoi Bungaku Series
Golden Time
Eikoku Koi Monogatari Emma
Shoujo
Natsume Yuujinchou
Hotarubi no Mori e
Nana
Rose of Versailles
Skip Beat!
The are even a few in Shonen, but they all involved highschool ages:
Shigatsu wa Kimi no Uso
Beck
Gekkan Shoujo Nozaki-kun (which is strange that this is a shonen, since it's a clever deconstruction of the tropes in shoujo. This could really have been serialized in any type of magazine.

Although that list is not complete, since the 4 demographics only relate to manga adaptations. Going through other categories:
Yojouhan Shinwa Taikei
NHK ni Youkoso!
Kino no Tabi: The Beautiful World
Eve no Jikan
Although these ones are starting to get a bit abstract now.

[Insanegame27]

Haifuri is still a thing... I think...

[Reelya]

Haifuri is completed. It's a one season deal.

[Neonivek]

Goodness I am never going to get over how excessively expensive and time sinky Gundam Build Fighters is (And Try introduced low damage... and you could still lose models)

I honestly think the villain was right with introducing cheap, affordable, ready to use, and streamlined models.

In fact... I'd have outright made a competition where you had to use those models. Where skill rules.

[Reelya]

Yeah that is a bit opposite of the normal scheme of things, because the show is marketed by the people who make model kits. Imagine an equivalent bike racing anime where the "villain" introduced a cheaper range of ready-to-race bikes allowing those without deep pockets to compete, then the "heroes" of the show complained about how this leveled the playing field too much. It would not come off the same at all.

[Cruxador]

More Kill la Kill shower thoughts. Do you think it's pretty fair to say it's another deconstruction of the Mahou Shojou genre?

It's about female adolescence, as TTGL is about male adolescence. It's to be expected that it involves elements of the number one female-specific anime genre.

Like I said in my last KlK post, I was sorta meh on the Fanservice at first, and I'm still kinda uncomfortable with a few bits; Ryūko and Senketsu's first meeting was kinda rapey, and Sasuki and Ragyō in the bath made me squirm. Same goes for the massive amount of leering dudes, and how that's just considered normal and okay, but that's probably mostly my concern with mainstream Japanese culture and views toward women. On the flip-side, I appreciate how the fellas of Nudist Beach get sexualized too; even if it's mostly played for laughs when the dongles on their mech suits get in people's faces, it's good to see anime being more egalitarian about who wears the skimpy clothes.[/quote]Other people have assured me at length that they disagree, but I wouldn't consider fanservice an appropriate term here. The nudity is a pretty heavy driver of story and characterization and a not-at-all subtle show of female empowerment. I'm also not sure why you call out that it's played for laughs with the males; it's played for laughs with females too but the sexualized aspect of it is way more heavily emphasized with the males, in that there is one male character where it's emphasized consistently and one female character where it comes up in one scene.[/quote]

Speaking of which, that was a Date date between Mako and Ryūko, right?

I'm pretty sure it was intentionally ambiguous. Gotta allow yuri goggles to pick something up, dontcha know. As a service to fans thereof.

[KingofstarrySkies]

So I'm up to Episode 9 of Gurren Lagann, and before 8 I was thinking 'golly gosh will I have some stuff to say, mostly how I really liked the filler episodes and that I overall enjoy the show so far'

And then I watched episode 8. And now I have nothing more to say. (i do still like the show though seriously itsgreat)